Scott Stokley's forehand form

[crdiscgolf79]

I have been watching his videos on youtube as of late. Went back and re-watched some of his older ones and newer ones. He claims his forward facing form and throwing it like a ball is the correct way to throw (either pendulum swing or wind-up style). He says if you throw from a more sideward stance it is wrong.

However, we see many other pros (Eagle, Koling, Ricky, etc) being successful not looking like Stokely.

Stokely absolutely smashes his forehands, but is he right that his way is the right way? I wonder how much genetics is at play here (Stokely is like 6 foot 6).

I have tried it his way and it hurts my shoulder and I can't throw as far that way.




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p_Ivn4-nLWQ

 

[sidewinder22]

I agree with you. Pitchers start sideways, and end up facing the target at release.

Scott seems to have backed up a little on that statement.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rf6qb4_-y3A#t=3m45s

 

[nothinbuttree]

And if you watch players like McBeth and Heimburg, they seem to emulate his style pretty well. I think all it means is that there is no 100% correct way to throw. I think each style has plusses and minuses, one of which is strain on joints and ligaments. I have watched slow motion videos of Eagle throwing, and I don't think he will be throwing that way into his 50s like Stokely is. So long term impacts on one's body should be a consideration.

I am no expert at all, but it seems a more overhand throwing motion would be less impactful long term than snapping one's wrist as hard as Eagle does. But who is to argue with Eagle's FH distance for as long as he can keep that up.
YMMV.

 

[VictorB]

And if you watch players like McBeth and Heimburg, they seem to emulate his style pretty well. I think all it means is that there is no 100% correct way to throw.

Really all it means is that most everything we see before the actual 'downswing' doesn't matter, as long as the disc is on the correct plane. Same with the backhand. All of the walk up/wind up stuff can look very different, but they all get to the same position at the right time

 

[Warlan]

Really all it means is that most everything we see before the actual 'downswing' doesn't matter, as long as the disc is on the correct plane. Same with the backhand. All of the walk up/wind up stuff can look very different, but they all get to the same position at the right time

I think this is true but I also believe that different windups can be easier to learn than others (and will vary from person to person). In tennis, they teach a circular backswing. However, when learning it can be easier to just bring the racquet back like Stokely does his disc, specifically the timing becomes easier. So from a beginner point of view it may be easier. Later progressing into a windmill or other backswing could generate more power and whip.

 

[autocrosscrx]

I watched that video and went out and tried as well.

Lost some distance, lost some nose angle integrity, and had some pretty serious soreness in my forearm and pec the next day.

 

[txmxer]

If you throw like SS suggests (as I understand it), you put a lot of torque on your shoulder and elbow. If you turn more sideways, you reduce that loading. Having tore up my shoulder requiring ligament repair, I feel it just doing the movement in slow motion.

It may give you more distance if you can throw that way, but your shoulder and elbow will likely pay the price over time.

 

[Jay Dub]

If you throw like SS suggests (as I understand it), you put a lot of torque on your shoulder and elbow. If you turn more sideways, you reduce that loading. Having tore up my shoulder requiring ligament repair, I feel it just doing the movement in slow motion.

It may give you more distance if you can throw that way, but your shoulder and elbow will likely pay the price over time.

Scott said long ago his forehand caused a lot of problems for his arm.

 

[txmxer]

I agree with you. Pitchers start sideways, and end up facing the target at release.

Scott seems to have backed up a little on that statement.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rf6qb4_-y3A#t=3m45s

At 7 minutes he talks about tilting your body to throw hyzer (30 degrees). That is illogical. You cannot there is no linear path to a 30 degree body tilt that you can control and repeat. You tilt like that and you fall over.

 

[txmxer]

"you are turning your hips sideways"

 

[aphilso1]

When I first started trying to learn a forehand, Scott's video resonated with me because of how simple he makes the process seem. So I tried emulating his form. In hindsight, this probably set me back quite a bit on my development and was likely the reason why I quit throwing forehand altogether for a while. Obviously it works well for him, but for me I could just never get in an athletic-feeling stance nor get my large muscle groups engaged in the throw.

 

[Waddball]

I've tried this SS method as well, and I agree that it's got some problems. I am still wrestling with some pain. I think SS generalizes a little too much from his idiosyncratic form to what everyone "should" do. I also don't think he actually does what he says he does, at least when it comes to the 30 deg. body turn.

But it does have the virtue of having simple and repeatable footwork (the 30 deg. body turn excepted). Whereas the crow-hop and/or shuffle ideas have more moving parts and require more practice to lock in.

(Personally none of it matters much to me right now as I can't fix my horrible sidearm OAT, whether I crank my wrist and generate huge spin or not. Sigh.)

 

[sidewinder22]

At 7 minutes he talks about tilting your body to throw hyzer (30 degrees). That is illogical. You cannot there is no linear path to a 30 degree body tilt that you can control and repeat. You tilt like that and you fall over.

You mean walking forward rather than sideways?

 

[crdiscgolf79]

Is that a submarine pitch?

 

[Ahildy13]

Is that a submarine pitch?

No, watch carefully. The ball stays above his shoulder the whole time.
His shoulder just goes really low.

 

[sidewinder22]

It is still a submarine pitch.

 

[Rastnav]

No, watch carefully. The ball stays above his shoulder the whole time.
His shoulder just goes really low.

Uhhh, the ball's low point is basically his ankle. The ball is actually well below his elbow, much less his shoulder. His arm is actually moving fast enough that in the frame when the ball is at it's low point his arm and the ball are basically just ghosts/smears.

Low point:

Just after release:

 

[txmxer]

You mean walking forward rather than sideways?

Neither of those are anything like what he said as I understood it.

The hips are offset. Stokely's description is square/perpendicular to the line of throw with the upper body tilted.

Am I misunderstanding what he said?

 

[txmxer]

This doesn't look like the above to me.

 

[sidewinder22]

Neither of those are anything like what he said as I understood it.

The hips are offset. Stokely's description is square/perpendicular to the line of throw with the upper body tilted.

Am I misunderstanding what he said?

I think you answered my question. You are saying you can't balance walking forward and tilting like that, but you can sideways like the submarine gifs.