Supportive card-mate talk (?)

[Rastnav]

This is insanity.

You didn't actually read the part of ru4por's post I was responding to.

He said his buddies, and other people he knew from tournament play, would intentionally try to rattle you by engaging in "positive" comments on your play if they figured out it bothered you.

 

[ru4por]

I would, colloquially, stroke the **** outa these players in tournament play. Courtesy violation after courtesy violation for engaging in "distracting or unsportsmanlike actions". If I don't want you talking about my game, you don't get to talk about my game.

Not that it would particularly bother me to get encouragement. I'm a chatty guy. But mental mind games are a no-no in disc golf.

You are going to stroke the guy telling you...."tough shot with that footing", "tough lie, with that low ceiling", "shake it off, man". Gonna be a tough call.

Nobody on your card has anything to do with your game. If stuff is bothering you, it is on you.

Mental games are a part of a percentage of tournament players' game. It is part of the mental test of your game. You don't think throwing courtesy violations, on supportive chatter, to support your mental game at the detriment of theirs is a mental game itself?

I am not a fan of this stuff, but it is part of the game.

 

[mojorooks]

Personally the silence bugs me, I wish people would just keep chatting at a lower volume level. The silence, and the eyes, all on me....

My 8yo niece recently tagged along while I played a round. She was so full of questions and yacking non-stop. It actually was nice to have, silence encourages overthinking.

And the absolute WORST is conversation that stops abruptly just before its time to putt.

 

[Rastnav]

You are going to stroke the guy telling you...."tough shot with that footing", "tough lie, with that low ceiling", "shake it off, man". Gonna be a tough call.

Nobody on your card has anything to do with your game. If stuff is bothering you, it is on you.

Mental games are a part of a percentage of tournament players' game. It is part of the mental test of your game. You don't think throwing courtesy violations, on supportive chatter, to support your mental game at the detriment of theirs is a mental game itself?

I am not a fan of this stuff, but it is part of the game.

If I, or someone else on my card, says "Hey, I'd prefer you not comment on my shots" and they are continuing to do so, yeah, I'd stroke them. Especially if I saw the card mate clearly trying to ignore them or block them out. Most especially if the comments, like OP mentioned, are comments saying something about future game play.

The proverbial $20 Nassau, or whatever the disc golf equivalent is? Yeah, that's just part of the game. In a tournament round, nope. If someone on my card doesn't want other people commenting on their shots, it is not courteous to continue to do so. That's seems to me to be the intent of the rule. Don't be a jerk to other people, whether it's card mates, other competitors, spotters, officials, TDs, whoever.

Conversely, if I like having people buck me up, but you don't feel like it, that's on me. I have no right to expect you to do so. This is a game where people are expected to respect each other and allows for comradery. Alden Harris wants to ask Gannon Buhr "Can (should) I jump putt this?" when they are within a stroke of each other on the final hole? That's no issue. If I'd prefer people allow me to keep my DG to myself, that too. People lift each other up at best, stay out of their way at worst.

 

[ru4por]

If I, or someone else on my card, says "Hey, I'd prefer you not comment on my shots" and they are continuing to do so, yeah, I'd stroke them. Especially if I saw the card mate clearly trying to ignore them or block them out. Most especially if the comments, like OP mentioned, are comments saying something about future game play.

The proverbial $20 Nassau, or whatever the disc golf equivalent is? Yeah, that's just part of the game. In a tournament round, nope. If someone on my card doesn't want other people commenting on their shots, it is not courteous to continue to do so. That's seems to me to be the intent of the rule. Don't be a jerk to other people, whether it's card mates, other competitors, spotters, officials, TDs, whoever.

Conversely, if I like having people buck me up, but you don't feel like it, that's on me. I have no right to expect you to do so. This is a game where people are expected to respect each other and allows for comradery. Alden Harris wants to ask Gannon Buhr "Can (should) I jump putt this?" when they are within a stroke of each other on the final hole? That's no issue. If I'd prefer people allow me to keep my DG to myself, that too. People lift each other up at best, stay out of their way at worst.

Man, I guess we all use disc golf for different things. I am too thick skinned, to even really understand this. I can be miserable at work. I can drag stress around with me over family issues. I LOVE the competitive aspect of tournament play, but if I get to a place where my joy is dependent upon the behavior of others, I will find a new hobby. Hmmm....I kind of like gardening.

 

[ballgolfconvert]

I personally love banter on the course. I love being under pressure and when someone says something the pressure goes up a bit and i am in heaven. it doesn't even matter if i succeed on my shot, I just love being under the gun when i play. It makes the successes all the much sweeter.

 

[Monocacy]

I am respectful of others when I play. But I rarely notice what other people are doing when I putt. Lots of times someone has apologized for something that I did not even notice lol.

Not that I am a particularly good putter, just generally oblivious about the world around me. And I do understand that many are more easily distracted, which is why I am respectful when others putt.

But this discussion always make me think of a basketball player or field goal kicker having to perform a precise maneuver while thousands scream, the opposing team's fans wave brightly-colored signs in the player's line of sight, etc. Somehow they manage.

 

[autocrosscrx]

I live in town and play public courses. So in my casual rounds, I deal with music and walkers and runners and dogs and garbage trucks and lawn mowers and band practice, etc, etc, etc. Heck, the tournament that I played Saturday has a water carry hole 1. Non-disc golfers were sitting on the benches, so like 3 feet from the pad, enjoying the day. First person is mid run up and a lady on the bench asked, "You really going to try to throw that frisbee way over there over all that water?"

...so you can talk or move or whatever while I'm putting or throwing.

But there rules allow us a certain amount of quiet and peace from our competitors, so if somebody has a faux pas, I'm okay with a warning.

 

[dmoore1998]

I guarantee the guy doing the talking doesn't think this bothers you still. If you're not a hothead generally...and it sounds pretty clearly like you were annoyed and riled up after the putting...he's probably ignoring everything you said and chalking it up to "he got mad and spouted off". You have to tell him you don't want him commenting on your play when you're calm.

Be clear though, do you not like the talk at all? Or do you not like the talk when you're clearly annoyed/upset about the hole you're currently playing? I play with plenty of folks who would tell me to STFU in the moment, but after the hole wouldn't think twice about me saying "You might be the worst putter in the state".

 

[TheOtherBill]

I'm a 'positive' player. I talk people up as we walk between lies, support their stupid shot-shaping idea that will never get near the basket, etc. I'm sure it can get annoying, but I also do it at work, at my kid's games - even at sports on TV.

I also only choose to play casual rounds with other supportive players. Disc golf is fun. If you aren't having fun, why are you out there? If you are having a bad round, only you can change your attitude about it - sometimes the disc will do just what it wants and there seems to be nothing to do about it but laugh.

HOWEVER, more important than the fun is respecting others. When I played events, even a 'look' in my direction would be enough to stop the chatter.

 

[Flick Maniac]

*Corriedoo
(n.)
The crucial moment of late recognition in a long passageway encounter. Though both people are perfectly well aware that the other is approaching, they must eventually pretend sudden recognition. They now look up with a glassy smile, as if having spotted each other for the first time, (and are particularly delighted to have done so), shouting out 'Haaaaalllllloooo!' as if to say 'Good grief!! You!! Here!! Of all people

New word of the day!

Is this like when you see your neighbor you dont really like and vice versa, approaching, and think "that guy again, isnt it stupid we have to greet just because of social norms, every frigging day... HEY THERE HOWYA DOIN"

 

[ChrisWoj]

It could be worse. He could have been laughing out you, louder and harder with each missed putt.

Thats my best friend in the disc golf world. I wouldn't have him out there on the course with me any other way. And for sure - he isn't laughing with me, because I'm pissed off as **** at myself at that moment. lol.

 

[etdefender19]

I don't have time for tournaments (usually) so I play 99% casual rounds and 90% of those with the same dude (either the two of us or part of a group). We needle each other all the time. My favorite to do is this one: I'm away, lay up on my approach, tap in, and say "same par you're going to make" as he lines up his 20-footer for birdie.

 

[hawgdriver]

Nothing worse than playing with the angry guy.

I agree, and it's the core issue and takeaway from the entire story. Usually I'm a stoic ass mf and have a rad mental game. That morning I was a battery starting at 2% charge, if that makes sense.

I have a couple casual playing buddies that would eat you alive. Once discovering your inability to handle positive banter, they would blow you up. Same with some tournament players. They are not much fun either.

lol bring it

It's way different when you actually sorta like/care the person who is giving you the little talks, and it's not psyops, but positive support. If it's outright ridicule, banter, trash talk...I will EAT YOU ALIVE. I won a weekly league on the final putt of the round, a 30'er, when the guy who finished one stroke behind me was standing directly opposite the chains and was fidgeting and eyeballing me. I could have asked him to stop or to move but I decided that I would just make the putt in his damned face lol. KI is a whole different issue imo.

In my sitch, this is that weird area where your bro is really trying to talk you into success the best he can, so it has these sort of emotional hooks lol.

I think the main takeaway here is to recognize when your mental toughness is at a low point, and proceed accordingly.

I'm usually good with his proclivity to constantly try to assert positive vibes.

 

[oddjob]

Not really on topic but many years ago I made the lead card for the final round which was being filmed. I was your standard 970 local pro playing with the best players in ETN.

Naturally I was nervous and 10 ft putts may as well have been 100.

Melton was on the card and gave casual positive comments throughout the round which helped me settle down. He was an all around positive vibe for the card as a whole.

Would easily be on my dream foursome.

/derail

 

[robdeforge]

After my 6-putt, I told my buddy that I didn't want his pep talks when I was getting ready to putt, and I tried to keep it as plainspoken and direct as possible, not attributional, but I was still in meltdown mode (pro tip: not the right time to deliver my message). He did not seem to reflect on my perspective in a meaningful way and took it as though he did nothing wrong..

it costs him literally nothing to listen to you here. literally. nothing. you are totally in the right to ask him to extend a very simple courtesy to you (which, again, requires him to literally do nothing)

You are going to stroke the guy telling you...."tough shot with that footing", "tough lie, with that low ceiling", "shake it off, man". Gonna be a tough call.

Nobody on your card has anything to do with your game. If stuff is bothering you, it is on you.

Mental games are a part of a percentage of tournament players' game. It is part of the mental test of your game. You don't think throwing courtesy violations, on supportive chatter, to support your mental game at the detriment of theirs is a mental game itself?

I am not a fan of this stuff, but it is part of the game.

It is absolutely definitively not part of the game.

QA-COU-1: A rival of mine likes to play head games, for example by telling me my score for the round, that they think I will make or miss a putt, etc. Can I call a courtesy violation on them?

Maybe. Though being a jerk isn't explicitly listed as a courtesy violation, any action that is "distracting or unsportsmanlike" can be penalized. You will need to decide if the player's behavior is bad enough to call. Short of that, it is something you, your group, and/or other players will have to work out with them. If the behavior is bad enough, or there's a pattern of it for that player, you can notify the TD and/or the PDGA Disciplinary Committee.

trying to play mind games with a(n unwilling competitor) is grounds for a courtesy violation, and if it continues it could be grounds for disqualification.

 

[dmoore1998]

I find it distracting when people look directly into my eyes. I always say "avert your gaze" and if they don't I give them a courtesy violation.

 

[ThrowaEnvy]

New word of the day!

Is this like when you see your neighbor you dont really like and vice versa, approaching, and think "that guy again, isnt it stupid we have to greet just because of social norms, every frigging day... HEY THERE HOWYA DOIN"

See also Corrievorrie

Its a bunch of words for corridor etiquette from " The Meaning of Liff" by Douglas Adams

 

[ballgolfconvert]

it costs him literally nothing to listen to you here. literally. nothing. you are totally in the right to ask him to extend a very simple courtesy to you (which, again, requires him to literally do nothing)



It is absolutely definitively not part of the game.



trying to play mind games with a(n unwilling competitor) is grounds for a courtesy violation, and if it continues it could be grounds for disqualification.

Wow. What a take. I'm curious do you inhale or exhale, while you are pulling a putt?

 

[hawgdriver]

Like many social interactions, the trick for the speaker is to correctly read his struggling playing partner. Some will like encouragement, some won't care, some will be bothered. Sometimes you guess wrong.

I've blown up on holes to the degree that my playing partners went silent. That, too, is a statement.

To kind of close this out...this is exactly the issue. This is the 'why' of possibly not playing rounds in the future with the dude. That he might not be able to read the room in that way. A 'lack of empathy' problem.

But, like TXMX said...if I value the relationship, just hash it out before the next round. Don't make assumptions, and don't take **** personal. I'll hash it out before the next round, he is a good dude.

Funny how these kerfuffles over silly circle/basket interactions find such sharp meaning.