Sneaky Alligator
Par Member
It's also littering to leave a disc behind...
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The Disc Requisitioner
- Thread starter yenhe2002
- Start date
- Status
Technohic
* Ace Member *
- Joined
- Jul 27, 2009
- Messages
- 8,517
While we are on the subject ,and before it gets locked, ever have a somewhat opposite experience? Like you find an unmarked disc and talking to someone they start trying to guess the color hoping to claim it.
Me: "I found a disc on this hole last week"
undisclosed. "Ooo! Was it an Orc?"
Me: "No. It was an Eagle. I usually call but it was unmarked."
undisclosed: "Oh. A red Star Eagle?"
Me: "No. It was in champ plastic."
undisclosed: "It was red though, right?"
Me: "No."
and so on. I imagine had I had it with me, it surely would have been recognized within 10 guesses of the weight.
Me: "I found a disc on this hole last week"
undisclosed. "Ooo! Was it an Orc?"
Me: "No. It was an Eagle. I usually call but it was unmarked."
undisclosed: "Oh. A red Star Eagle?"
Me: "No. It was in champ plastic."
undisclosed: "It was red though, right?"
Me: "No."
and so on. I imagine had I had it with me, it surely would have been recognized within 10 guesses of the weight.
yenhe2002
Newbie
Yes sir, you are correct sir. Thank you.
Smigles
* Ace Member *
You should have taken him to the police. Maybe he learns to respect other peoples property.
Cuffed 'n stuffed sends an unmistakable message.
Sneaky Alligator
Par Member
Cops response: Oh, you're a "Frolfer"? You mind if I search your car?
bigghigg
Newbie
There are two very big "ifs" that must be proven before you can call it theft (according to the link provided). First, the finder must know the disc was lost. Second, the finder must only make a reasonable effort to return the disc.
It isn't defined how a finder would know a disc is lost vs. discarded or what reasonable effort constitutes. A name and number doesn't necessarily mean a disc was lost or misplaced any more than the lack of one means it was intentionally discarded. Even more gray is "reasonable effort." Is looking for anyone around the found disc a reasonable effort? Am I required to make a phone call? Am I required to physically take the disc somewhere?
Any disc found on a course would reasonably be considered "lost". So it pretty much passes your first test just be being found.
As for the second test, the reasonable effort, if the disc is inked and no other golfers are in sight, then there isn't too much that can be done and you got a disc. If the disc has contact information, you'd be obliged to call/text/email the person. If they can't be reached or if it would be an unreasonable hardship to make accommodations to return the disc, then it's yours. The situation will dictate what the reasonable effort is, but in the end, follow the golden rule of "don't be a douche".
yenhe2002
Newbie
Actually, this isn't as gray of an area as you might expect. There is a "reasonable person" standard in the law that applies to both quandries you have.
Imagine a jury trying to decide these issues: #1. Did the finder "know" that the disc was lost? #2. Assuming he did, did he make a "reasonable effort" to contact the owner/return it?
For knowledge, the jury does NOT determine whether the defendant claims to (not) have actual knowledge, but whether a reasonable person gaining possession of the property with all attendant circumstances would know that it was the property was lost.
In this case, a "reasonable person" would see that the property was concealed amongst the underbrush, labelled with a name and number as if in anticipation the property might be lost, not in a "garbage can" and therefore clearly discarded, not broken or otherwise unusable...and determine that it was lost. Defendant loses this one.
For "effort to return", the jury uses a similar reasonable person standard. A "reasonable person" looking at a name and telephone number and likely carrying a cell phone who happens to have a duty to attempt to contact the owner....let's just say the defendant loses this one too.
You are trying very....very....very hard to justify this. Guilty conscience?
Dude go to a court-room with that stuff seriously... trying a little to hard.
This is a forum we don't feel like reading the law for a $10 disc....
Dude go to a court-room with that stuff seriously... trying a little to hard.
This is a forum we don't feel like reading the law for a $10 disc....
:wall:
Everything that yenhe2002 documented is what people need to read. Value is irrelevant.
Let me boil it down to the basics:
Was a lost (personally-identifiable) item found? Yes. Is the person that found it obligated to make a reasonable attempt to return it? Yes. End of story.
Dsplayname
Double Eagle Member
I typically don't call when I find discs, although most of the ones I find don't have a number. On the other hand, I never think expect to get a disc back, or even a "peace of mind" call saying somebody found it, so I can stop looking when I go back to the course. In the last year, I've found about 6 Aviars on courses, and either left them at the next tee for somebody else, or given them to whoever is playing ahead of me. I would call and possbily return a nice disc, but most of what I find isn't.
Let me show you a example:
What if somebody found his disc in a bush,trashcan,gutter etc. That person then get's a sharpie and erases his number and name.
He then start's selling the disc he found to the guy he was playing double's with. He just bought a disc thinking it was legit and Ok=NOT Guilty!!!
It's the same thing with the guy who sell's disc from his van. Im sure most of you have bought a disc or 2 from a guy like that:|
If it's in the trashcan, then it's garbage. Your other two scenarios (bush, gutter) would still make it found property and possession or sale thereof is still theft. They guy that bought it isn't "OK=NOT Guilty" as you so eloquently phrased it. The guy that bought it is guilty of receipt of stolen property.
Just because you bought a stolen disc from the shady mofo in the van doesn't make it right. Your rebuttals continue to attempt to justify possessing/selling/receiving property that is not rightfully yours.
Your arguments = FAIL
City of Cleveland Ordinance
559.29 Obstructions and Trash Placed in Parks; Distributing Circulars
No person shall place or permit to remain in or upon any park or parkway, any goods, merchandise or other articles in the nature of an obstruction to the free use and enjoyment of the park or parkways. Nor shall any person place any straw, dirt, chips, paper, shavings, shells, ashes, swill or garbage, or other rubbish, even though not offensive to health, in or upon the same. Nor shall any person distribute any circulars, cards or other written or printed matter, in any park or parkway.
Maybe you should've thanked the guy for picking up your trash.
559.29 Obstructions and Trash Placed in Parks; Distributing Circulars
No person shall place or permit to remain in or upon any park or parkway, any goods, merchandise or other articles in the nature of an obstruction to the free use and enjoyment of the park or parkways. Nor shall any person place any straw, dirt, chips, paper, shavings, shells, ashes, swill or garbage, or other rubbish, even though not offensive to health, in or upon the same. Nor shall any person distribute any circulars, cards or other written or printed matter, in any park or parkway.
Maybe you should've thanked the guy for picking up your trash.
Sneaky Alligator
Par Member
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