USDGC results-exactly what people were worried about?

[patdb23]

A performance score format competition sounds interesting. But to try it out on what most would consider the 2nd biggest event of the year (Worlds = 1st) is a huge mistake and no wonder most of the pros boycotted the USDGC. You can take a look back since inception and see the names of past champions, Climo, Schultz, Feldberg, Doss, Locastro, Schusterick. How does Innova explain themselves by tarnishing the prestige of the event by naming an 880 rated player in that mix of names? Basically sum it up that Innova turned it's back on the Pros of our sport. They realized that the rec player is where they make their money from so why not take a prestigious Pro event away and hand it over to Ams.

 

[RJRendleman]

If innova was losing that much money (and i really don't think they were losing money) then they should be rethinking things internally, not changing the format and using the easy way out. And last time I checked sponsorship and advertisement spending will never appear to turn a profit. There is no way to gauge how much money advertising brings in after the fact.

Heck I spent

$50 attempting to qualify
$88 in the innova pro shop

thats $138 right there in innova's pockets and I didn't even play!

Innova shouldn't be looking for profits, they should be looking just to break even

I hope innova enjoyed their profit this year

 

[harr0140]

If innova was losing that much money (and i really don't think they were losing money) then they should be rethinking things internally, not changing the format and using the easy way out. And last time I checked sponsorship and advertisement spending will never appear to turn a profit. There is no way to gauge how much money advertising brings in after the fact.

Heck I spent

$50 attempting to qualify
$88 in the innova pro shop

thats $138 right there in innova's pockets and I didn't even play!

Innova shouldn't be looking for profits, they should be looking just to break even

I hope innova enjoyed their profit this year

I'm guessing you have no idea what it is like to run a business . . . Businesses do not exist to serve everyone for no profits . . . those are called not for profits, but businesses exist to make money and if they aren't making money they have to do everything they can to turn it around and make money so they can stay in business.

 

[RJRendleman]

I'm guessing you have no idea what it is like to run a business . . . Businesses do not exist to serve everyone for no profits . . . those are called not for profits, but businesses exist to make money and if they aren't making money they have to do everything they can to turn it around and make money so they can stay in business.

the USDGC isn't supposed to be about making profits!

Innova sells discs, bags, clothes, baskets, etc... to make profits

Coca Cola isn't making money from the Coca-Cola 600.....They lose tons of money to have their name in the title as the sponsor....the profit comes in the long run, when everyone goes home and buys cokes that week at the grocery store....That is what sponsorship is about....giving money....if Innova doesn't want to sponsor it, I'm sure discraft or vibram could find a way to take over

 

[mashnut]

How exactly did the original USDGC actually sell any more discs for innova? A couple hundred pros who don't buy plastic anyway and a few hundred spectators who make up a tiny fraction of the disc buying population isn't a lot of eyes for tens of thousands of advertising dollars.

 

[harr0140]

the USDGC isn't supposed to be about making profits!

Innova sells discs, bags, clothes, baskets, etc... to make profits

Coca Cola isn't making money from the Coca-Cola 600.....They lose tons of money to have their name in the title as the sponsor....the profit comes in the long run, when everyone goes home and buys cokes that week at the grocery store....That is what sponsorship is about....giving money....if Innova doesn't want to sponsor it, I'm sure discraft or vibram could find a way to take over

I guess I can understand that, but when the title sponsor can't afford to be the title sponsor anymore who says they can't change it up.

The problem is then that it is a companies tournament in the end, unless the PDGA steps up and makes it their tournament which then sells sponsorship etc . . . perhaps that is what the PDGA Championship was supposed to be . . . maybe it will be eventually, either way the change has happened and we all need to respect the people making those changes, there are reasons for them to make the change obviously.

 

[RJRendleman]

The problem is then that it is a companies tournament in the end, unless the PDGA steps up and makes it their tournament which then sells sponsorship etc . . . perhaps that is what the PDGA Championship was supposed to be . . . maybe it will be eventually, either way the change has happened and we all need to respect the people making those changes, there are reasons for them to make the change obviously.

I agree...if the PDGA wants to have the premier tournament at Winthrop they are going to have to step up to the plate and take over....i guess i just don't agree with it basically being innova's tournament instead of a pdga tournament

 

[DavidSauls]

I agree...if the PDGA wants to have the premier tournament at Winthrop they are going to have to step up to the plate and take over....i guess i just don't agree with it basically being innova's tournament instead of a pdga tournament

But it IS Innova's tournament.

Innova dreamed it up, made it happen, and funded it. Not the PDGA. There was no "United States Championship" before they did. When it started I was skeptical anybody would pay $200+ for any tournament, but they proved me wrong.

The PDGA's not in a position to "step up to the plate and take over". They did create a replacement Major of sorts this year, the PDGA Championship.

But anyone else can. Vibram, Discraft, Gateway, Coca-Cola, you, me....absolutely nothing prevents anyone from emulating the USDGC. In fact, Vibram and the TPC guy are trying. And I wish them well.

 

[biscoe]

the pdga has no ownership of the "united states disc golf championships", it is innova's baby... the first few were not even pdga sanctioned if i recall correctly...

 

[Cgkdisc]

The original US Championship was started by PDGA Commissioner, Jim Challas in Minnesota for either July 1996 or 1997. The City of Minneapolis screwed over the team putting this together (pulled approval for the site late in the planning) and the event didn't happen although you can still see minis and discs with the US logo on eBay. Then, Innova decided to do an event called the USDGC in 1998 and essentially used the name much to the chagrin of Jim and the PDGA Board at the time. That issue festered for several years and they eventually came to agreements on it at some point. Not sure what they are but I believe the PDGA won't create/run an event called the US Championship unless Innova abandons the USDGC.

 

[Dana]

I would say that it is debatable that Innova "abandoned the USDGC" this year...

Its all about the Players Cup now.

 

[Big Weekend]

I would say that it is debatable that Innova "abandoned the USDGC" this year...

Its all about the Players Cup now.

Bingo.

Pumped to meet the man, the legend, Senor Dodge.

 

[DavidSauls]

Thanks, Chuck, for the interesting history on the event name. Never knew that.

 

[patdb23]

The original US Championship was started by PDGA Commissioner, Jim Challas in Minnesota for either July 1996 or 1997. The City of Minneapolis screwed over the team putting this together (pulled approval for the site late in the planning) and the event didn't happen although you can still see minis and discs with the US logo on eBay. Then, Innova decided to do an event called the USDGC in 1998 and essentially used the name much to the chagrin of Jim and the PDGA Board at the time. That issue festered for several years and they eventually came to agreements on it at some point. Not sure what they are but I believe the PDGA won't create/run an event called the US Championship unless Innova abandons the USDGC.

I have to say that's quite interesting about the use of the name. Before I knew anything about the USDGC I thought it was a PDGA event to define who would be the United States Disc Golf Championship sponsored by Innova. Not sure if this was appropriate at the time.

I think sponsors or clubs should be careful in choosing appropriate names for their events. One of our local events has the name "California State Flying Disc Golf Championships". This event is no where near a championship event, 57 players at a C-tier and the title is innappropriate and I wish they never used it.

But to get back on track, I wish that PDGA had taken ownership of a US title event and never allowed a manufacturer to use this title (USDGC), but I guess Worlds is suitable, do we really need a US title? Just have to remove the whole USDGC title now as it no longer means anything, and to even permit the use of that name for 2011 is a bigger fallacy than giving Bonds the HR title. No amount of astericks can distinguish this year from previous titles properly won. And I suggest the PDGA step in and remove the USDGC title going forward for any performance enhanced events.

 

[Amadeus]

I initially bashed this event, but feel my actions were harsh. Innova has always done fantastic things for the sport of disc golf and with some work on the handicapping system for this event, I feel it could grow to be just as important as the real USDGC. Without Innova, disc golf would be nothing, so I support them for bringing in more ams and PDGA members with this event. I apologize to those I offended with my previous post.

 

[tallpaul]

The original US Championship was started by PDGA Commissioner, Jim Challas in Minnesota for either July 1996 or 1997. The City of Minneapolis screwed over the team putting this together (pulled approval for the site late in the planning) and the event didn't happen although you can still see minis and discs with the US logo on eBay. Then, Innova decided to do an event called the USDGC in 1998 and essentially used the name much to the chagrin of Jim and the PDGA Board at the time. That issue festered for several years and they eventually came to agreements on it at some point. Not sure what they are but I believe the PDGA won't create/run an event called the US Championship unless Innova abandons the USDGC.

I have a few of said discs and a couple of sweatshirts I completely wore out. Was a nice American logo; red, white, and blue, and all that...

 

[solomon.trenton]

care t post a pic?

 

[DavidSauls]

I have to say that's quite interesting about the use of the name. Before I knew anything about the USDGC I thought it was a PDGA event to define who would be the United States Disc Golf Championship sponsored by Innova. Not sure if this was appropriate at the time.

I think sponsors or clubs should be careful in choosing appropriate names for their events. One of our local events has the name "California State Flying Disc Golf Championships". This event is no where near a championship event, 57 players at a C-tier and the title is innappropriate and I wish they never used it.

But to get back on track, I wish that PDGA had taken ownership of a US title event and never allowed a manufacturer to use this title (USDGC), but I guess Worlds is suitable, do we really need a US title? Just have to remove the whole USDGC title now as it no longer means anything, and to even permit the use of that name for 2011 is a bigger fallacy than giving Bonds the HR title. No amount of astericks can distinguish this year from previous titles properly won. And I suggest the PDGA step in and remove the USDGC title going forward for any performance enhanced events.

Something of a sidetrack, but one of my pet peeves is the promiscuous use of the word "championship". A few years ago I counted 72 tournaments calling themselves "championships" which, with all the divisions available, means there are hundreds, if not thousands, of "champions" out there. My little state of S.C. has 3 of them, not to mention a points series champion. Gosh, the PDGA already has several World Championships, PDGA Championship, Global Championship......

But to the point, I'm not sure the PDGA needs to get into regulating tournament names or reserving certain ones. As I've posted before, you could always get around this with a "National Championship" or "American Championship" or plenty of other options. Besides, I'm not sure how much of a national champion the USDGC winner ever was, since it's not limited to United States players. More of a United States Open.

Actually, I've always thought of the USDGC as something like the Masters in golf. Which, as I understand it, is owned and run by the Augusta National Club, not the PGA. (I'm not a golf fan, so I could be wrong about this). But something they've made into a very prestigious event.

 

[DiscJunkie]

I initially bashed this event, but feel my actions were harsh. Innova has always done fantastic things for the sport of disc golf and with some work on the handicapping system for this event, I feel it could grow to be just as important as the real USDGC. Without Innova, disc golf would be nothing, so I support them for bringing in more ams and PDGA members with this event. I apologize to those I offended with my previous post.

Well said.
Thanks for "manning up".
While I agree with many that some issues could have been handled differently by JP and Innova (event name, most of all), i agree that Innova has been great for Disc Golf and their intentions are in the correct direction.