Discing down adventures.

[cfair]

Uh oh, looks like another putter only convert, lol. I will say that as most putters r truly stable discs, they r easier to put on line that other discs. And maybe they r more 'grippable' than other discs and inspire more confidence. Personally, I would just lose too much distance playing that way.

This depends on the distance your getting. I'm not using only my putter. I practice and play with mids and fairways its just Mike C really likes playing a lot of putter only rounds. But others play putter only rounds from time to time to get the practice with them in. I'm surprised the fellow above said his short game still sucks because I feel as I've done putter only rounds everything has gotten a little better. Especially as I integrate mids, fairways, and drivers back into the game.

Through this process I park holes a lot of my friends 3. But we're not saying abandon the faster discs, we're just saying learn the slower ones, putters just happen to have the most to teach. Also there are some of us that will take this farther than others.

 

[BrotherDave]

I'm surprised the fellow above said his short game still sucks because I feel as I've done putter only rounds everything has gotten a little better. Especially as I integrate mids, fairways, and drivers back into the game.

I think that was a typo, he's not just Sloppydisc, he's sloppytypist also.

He really needs to stop posting while on a euphoric high of beer and hot wings.

 

[sloppydisc]

Yes, but sorry about the confusing typos. Anny lines, and approaches are much better. Long live the putter. If I have a chance of reaching the basket, I am throwing a putter.

 

[cfair]

Gotcha, ya see... I'm bad at catching stuff like that.

BTW I love tossing anny lines for an upshot when I can. I almost feel like I'm more accurate and more consistent than even throwing a regular hyzer.

 

[Mike C]

Yeah, I would agree that they're a good learning tool, but it just seems a little impractical to try to play rounds with them. Like I was saying to Garu, I think u get more for yer 'snap' from mids or drivers and I would rather spend my time practicing those discs. But that's just me.

It's definitely less effort to get the mids and drivers to travel a given distance, but that's part of the fun. When I play putter rounds it forces me to play a lot of holes as pars instead of deuce runs, so it gives me good practice for approach. Plus you might be surprised how far a putter can be thrown with some practice.

 

[djjeremiahj]

Here's my discing down adventure..

at the beginning of the summer i conciously tried to push the distance with my teebird, eagle, tl and roc (and learn how to drive my Rhyno)...

now, i'm parking the 225' pin with my rhyno
the 275' pin with my roc
anything under 325' with my teebird...
- all with almost pin point precision and accuracy.

it's a huge confidence booster when you know that anything within 325' you can park.... The game changes, and with it, comes the understanding and respect for the long distance drivers.

now, i'm working on discing up, and really learning how to master the throws with the speed 9-11 discs. Being able to turn over a beast, sidewinder or sl on command.... or having the confidenct to throw the valk and know exactly where it will break and sneak around a tree.... etc....
not just throwing it because you hope; you throw it because you know...

 

[sloppydisc]

Typos

I think that was a typo, he's not just Sloppydisc, he's sloppytypist also.

He really needs to stop posting while on a euphoric high of beer and hot wings.

No wings and beer. Just bad on the Ipad. You'll damn well know when I am hammered! I'll probably say something about your mother or grandmother.

 

[garublador]

Call it muscle or snap, u still need that much more energy to go from 250 to 350'.

Actually you don't. You need to transfer more of the energy to the disc, but you don't need to generate more energy. It takes less effort to throw a putter 350' with good snap than it does to muscle one 280'. "Snap" is transferring energy to the disc. It's mostly a matter of timing, not of muscle or energy generation.

I would just argue that u would need less of a jump in energy to get that same difference in distance with a mid or driver. IOW, u will get a much better bang for yer buck from yer snap with those discs...That's my only point.

So you're saying that mids and drivers go farther than putters? I don't see how that's an argument against learning to throw putters farther. It seems more like stating the obvious. If your putters go farther, so will your mids and drivers assuming you're getting the nose down.

 

[Mike C]

Actually you don't. You need to transfer more of the energy to the disc, but you don't need to generate more energy. It takes less effort to throw a putter 350' with good snap than it does to muscle one 280'. "Snap" is transferring energy to the disc. It's mostly a matter of timing, not of muscle or energy generation.

Well put. The thing about putters that are nice when you're learning to increase your D, is if your throw is off you should see it immediately. Some faster discs won't behave like this, though there are some that would.

 

[dodgeball]

So you're saying that mids and drivers go farther than putters? I don't see how that's an argument against learning to throw putters farther. It seems more like stating the obvious. If your putters go farther, so will your mids and drivers assuming you're getting the nose down.

So what you're saying is the best way to get better at throwing mids and drivers is to practice throwing putters, instead of throwing mids and drivers?? Yeah, makes perfect sense to me! I get that putters are good at showing o.a.t in your shot, but that really doesn't take very long to see that and correct the problem. I would argue that putters are actually forgiving when trying to throw them for distance because they are slower discs, but that they do teach u to throw harder (and hopefully straight too). I would also argue that maybe there is more technique involved in throwing mids and drivers correctly. With these discs the premium is on technique and smoothness (rather than power) and that's what I'm trying to accomplish at this point.

 

[dodgeball]

Well put. The thing about putters that are nice when you're learning to increase your D, is if your throw is off you should see it immediately. Some faster discs won't behave like this, though there are some that would.

So if they show yer flaws immediatley, WHY do u have to keep throwing them?? If u putter-only guys would just admit there's a little macchismo or whatever involved here, with throwing putters farther than other people throw their drivers, then I"d be happy!

 

[cfair]

So what you're saying is the best way to get better at throwing mids and drivers is to practice throwing putters, instead of throwing mids and drivers?? Yeah, makes perfect sense to me!

Yes throwing mids and drivers better is improved by throwing putters because Putter is dependent on good form that is the base for throwing the dirvers and mids. The farther you throw a putter well the farther you'll throw mids and drivers. There is a little extra you have to add to drivers (nose down) but with out the base that putters provide nose down means little.

I get that putters are good at showing o.a.t in your shot, but that really doesn't take very long to see that and correct the problem. I would argue that putters are actually forgiving when trying to throw them for distance because they are slower discs, but that they do teach u to throw harder (and hopefully straight too).

Correcting OAT is not a simple process. A lot of people have a crap ton of issue with it. Putters are not forgiving in the least... faster discs are more forgiving of form issues and errors.

I would also argue that maybe there is more technique involved in throwing mids and drivers correctly. With these discs the premium is on technique and smoothness (rather than power) and that's what I'm trying to accomplish at this point.

Putters are more dependent on a smooth throw... way more dependent. As far as technique goes drivers only need more because they require OAT and that isn't "more technique" its in addition too what is required to throw a putter well...

 

[Mike C]

So if they show yer flaws immediatley, WHY do u have to keep throwing them?? If u putter-only guys would just admit there's a little macchismo or whatever involved here, with throwing putters farther than other people throw their drivers, then I"d be happy!

The easiest way to correct a form flaw is to see it in the first place. With my putters, I know instantly every time if I rolled my wrist, threw with too much hyzer, threw too low or too high etc. It's certainly possible to see these things with any disc, even something like a Nuke, but putters make it really easy for me to build consistent form.

It can be amusing throwing a putter just as far as someone's Pro Katana (Did this yesterday), but I'm not into the "I'm better than you" attitude. I play with lots of people who can't break 300' with any disc, and we just play. I'm very non-competitive with DG.

 

[cfair]

So if they show yer flaws immediatley, WHY do u have to keep throwing them?? If u putter-only guys would just admit there's a little macchismo or whatever involved here, with throwing putters farther than other people throw their drivers, then I"d be happy!

They show the flaws immediately in the flight path. Correcting those flaws takes time. Keeping a clean throw requires discipline. Many players go through the process of cleaning up form. Often with something like a Comet. Then they go back to life as usual with improved form. However if they don't keep up on this that form can be lost because of the forgiving nature of faster discs.

Machismo is only involved when a guy who throws 320 is using a Destroyer or Boss. By using nothing faster than Teebirds, Stalkers, and Gazelles we're just trying to be honest with ourselves. With the putters we're learning to improve.

 

[cfair]

I'm very non-competitive with DG.

I know Mike C's type. He is personally competitive a self perfectionist/refinist. Always seeking to do the last thing just did better and not really paying much attention to those around him.

I can read you like a book Mr. Wiz

 

[Technohic]

So if they show yer flaws immediatley, WHY do u have to keep throwing them?? If u putter-only guys would just admit there's a little macchismo or whatever involved here, with throwing putters farther than other people throw their drivers, then I"d be happy!

I do find enjoyment in throwing my putter more than some people. I admit it. Usually its people I like to just give a hard time anyway, but I dont want it to come off as making fun of someone who just doesnt get my humor.

Like my brother who I got started playing last summer and has been playing with a guy with him down in Texas:

Brother: Got a new driver today; a Valkyrie.
Me: Really? How far you throwing now.
Brother: I dont know. Around 230'
Me: Hey, you're getting a little better. Thats almost how far I throw my putter
Brother: Yeah well; screw you, ok?
Me: Hey, Cathy (my fiance) throws about that far...
Brother: Haha you're hillarious.
Me: Seriously. Have you tried throwing that putter like I told you?

 

[garublador]

So what you're saying is the best way to get better at throwing mids and drivers is to practice throwing putters, instead of throwing mids and drivers??

No, I've actually argued the opposite. It's literally the first thing I said when I started replying to you in this microthread.

I would also argue that maybe there is more technique involved in throwing mids and drivers correctly. With these discs the premium is on technique and smoothness (rather than power) and that's what I'm trying to accomplish at this point.

I'm arguing that that isn't correct. The difference isn't power/technique and smoothness. In fact, saying those are separate things doesn't really make sense when we're talking about these distances and discs. The difference is nose down. Faster discs require more nose down. The difference between a nose down, 350' putter throw and a 420' nose down fairway driver throw is aiming. You probably don't need to throw the fairway driver as high. The technique is pretty much the same.

 

[Mike C]

I know Mike C's type. He is personally competitive a self perfectionist/refinist. Always seeking to do the last thing just did better and not really paying much attention to those around him.

I can read you like a book Mr. Wiz

What can I say, I'm predictable. That's exactly the kind of person I am, and have been for the past 11 years with skateboarding. I've never competed, but I can do tricks I've never seen pro's do (Though they could probably do them if they tried ).

Dodgeball, I was typing out another reply to you in the edit window of my last post, but it went past 5 minutes and the post got deleted. Basically I was going to say that putters are not the end all be all of getting good. I think they are the first, and by far the most important step, to getting good. Here is why:

-Putters are the easiest discs to control, and to manipulate on a variety of flight paths. This translates to honing skills and control rather than fighting with the disc trying to make it do what you want.
-Putters reveal form flaws and don't respond well to being muscled. No disc flies well if the thrower is doing either of these things, so it's good to eliminate them as quickly and efficiently as possible, which putters and understable mids do well.
-If you want to increase your max distance, trying to push putters as far as you can lets you work on building that snap but also forces you to keep clean form. Distance without control means nothing in this game.
-Learning to utilize your putters for drives and approach will give you an edge over players who use mids for these roles, because putters inherently offer superior control.

Other discs will help you in areas putters cannot. If you need to work on nose down, you'd be much better off with a Destroyer than a putter IMO, assuming you can power it.

The difference is nose down. Faster discs require more nose down. The difference between a nose down, 350' putter throw and a 420' nose down fairway driver throw is aiming. You probably don't need to throw the fairway driver as high. The technique is pretty much the same.

Is absolutely true. Putters are not good at flying distance, low line shots. Distance drivers are. But if you can learn to throw a putter 300', then translate those skills it took to do that to a fairway driver, and then learn to aim the driver lower and keep the nose down, you will have a clean, controlled throw for 375' at least I'd imagine.

But the skills you learn with a putter will translate to every other disc you will ever throw, I guarantee it. If I can throw Putters 350', imagine what I could do with a Nuke? 350' of putter power translates to well over 425' of distance driver power. It's not like learning to throw a putter far means you can ONLY throw a putter far.

 

[cfair]

It's not like learning to throw a putter far means you can ONLY throw a putter far.

This. When I use a fairway driver I easily out distance my friends now. Because I can throw my putter within 20' of their distance driver.

How about this Dodgeball. Join us for the rest of Fall. Disc down till the end of October and start by doing some putter only rounds. Like 3 in a week. Week 2 grab a mid and use it for drives only and the putter for approach/putting. Do this for 2 weeks and then on week 4 grab a fairway driver and see what happens. I'm almost willing to bet money that you'll see a jump in distance, control, and confidence.

Just curious, what are your distances Dodge?

 

[tom8658]

I get that putters are good at showing o.a.t in your shot, but that really doesn't take very long to see that and correct the problem.

I would love to be you. :\

With all discs the premium is on technique and smoothness (rather than power)

Fixed.