Form Check Diary ✅

[sidewinder22]

 

[Kjimsern]

20/20 ill try it, i also liked the rest of the video also.

 

[Kjimsern]

I've had this problem. Invariably for me (and I think a lot of other people) it exposes a more fundamental balance problem where you are either compensating for poor balance with the head, or otherwise not including your head in the balance of the shot.

I always find that the large pendular drills like Double Dragon or Door Frame help me exaggerate it the most. I also very much focus on this posture going into the practice and live throw finish position. I focus on making the "green line" from foot to head - my head needs to be the tippy top of the bow or balance point. Otherwise I'm doing some version of tipping or compensating.

BTW, just catching up on your thread, you do appear to be making some good changes in the fundamental balance and action. My guess is that your body and brain is resisting the change, just like everyone else. You will need to coax it along over time - back off and relax when you need to, nudge it back in the right direction. Keep yourself focused, but patient with your body as it learns the new skill.

The Power of Posture

Forgive me if a repost by title, but I didn't find a dedicated one and it might be good to have a fresh discussion anyway. I keep finding more and more synergies between SW22 DG coaching and the waltz in particular, and thought that a general thread helping people with posture concepts and...

www.dgcoursereview.com

My own problem is potentially deeper and harder to change than yours so I might start there, and can also share more learned from Sidewinder and other sports contexts as I've tried to change this.

Since you have some experience in this, im doing all the drills and im trying my best to translate them over to my throwing. Door frame, double dragons, crush the can. Ride the bull.

I feel like if i think about it while throwing or getting reps most of the changes doesnt feel to good and balanced, its wierd.

Here forexample is from today and im doing crush the can drill for many reps then trying to adapt it into my form also some 20/20 head posture/loaded bow balanced position.

Ive always landed with toe first and rotated a little earlier before the full heel is down on the ground because of tight calf muscles.

Question is, is that fine? Or should i force the heel down and then wait for rotation.

Those are the dillemas i get into alot during this process, sorry for my bad english.

Here is a video so you can see for yourself

 

[Brychanus]

Ive always landed with toe first and rotated a little earlier before the full heel is down on the ground because of tight calf muscles.

I do think there is some variability out there, but the basic idea is that even though you're starting to get force transmission as the leading toe(s) touch the ground, the most grounded part of the brace is around when the heel comes down.

Sidewinder once shared the tip "let the leading foot pull the hip into the plant." Really what you're after is letting the whole body get grounded abruptly and firmly to anchor the throw.

I like watching this angle of Wiggins where you can tell that he's already getting some action out of the backswing as the toes are starting to resist the ground. But all the action through the big muscles of the plant leg and core really start to occur as the heel is landing.



Also notice that Wiggins remains extremely closed off to the target as the heel is coming down. So depending on what you mean by "rotated a little earlier" I would air on the side of "waiting for the crush to complete." It's possible to take that too far, but maybe worth a shot.

I also found it easier to see when his form was less mature*:



BTW this may be related to head stuff: usually delaying my own move a little longer staying closed off and waiting for the "grounding" in the crush as my heel starts to take most of my weight means I can create more space to swing/pull through, and it gets a little easier to keep my head "on the stack" rather than craning over or rushing or compensating. I don't always find the sweet spot but it's there. If I start opening up too soon I tend to crane or tip etc. and my head gets rapidly more out of whack.

IMHO don't ignore subtle signs in your neck. Fortunately my neck is doing much better recently but I can tell if it's drifting in the wrong direction based on how I feel the next day in the right side of my neck, so I always slow down to work on it if I feel anything funny there. Neck injuries suck and it's apparently fairly easy to cause disc or nerve issues too if you are moving at the level of force that you are.

Slightly selfish but since I'm looking at Doss a lot recently - watch his plant process and crush. It's very clean and he's a good example of just "walking right into it." Notice how his swing is pretty closed off and he gets very grounded in the heel before most of the action occurs up the chain, which is why he can get a pretty good rip on it with a small range of motion.

*There are some theoretical reasons I've chatted with people about that Wiggins' form might actually be leaking a bit in a few ways (which is fascinating), but I'll still be happy to take cues from a world distance record holder in the meantime.

 

[Kjimsern]

I do think there is some variability out there, but the basic idea is that even though you're starting to get force transmission as the leading toe(s) touch the ground, the most grounded part of the brace is around when the heel comes down.

Sidewinder once shared the tip "let the leading foot pull the hip into the plant." Really what you're after is letting the whole body get grounded abruptly and firmly to anchor the throw.

I like watching this angle of Wiggins where you can tell that he's already getting some action out of the backswing as the toes are starting to resist the ground. But all the action through the big muscles of the plant leg and core really start to occur as the heel is landing.



Also notice that Wiggins remains extremely closed off to the target as the heel is coming down. So depending on what you mean by "rotated a little earlier" I would air on the side of "waiting for the crush to complete." It's possible to take that too far, but maybe worth a shot.

I also found it easier to see when his form was less mature*:



BTW this may be related to head stuff: usually delaying my own move a little longer staying closed off and waiting for the "grounding" in the crush as my heel starts to take most of my weight means I can create more space to swing/pull through, and it gets a little easier to keep my head "on the stack" rather than craning over or rushing or compensating. I don't always find the sweet spot but it's there. If I start opening up too soon I tend to crane or tip etc. and my head gets rapidly more out of whack.

IMHO don't ignore subtle signs in your neck. Fortunately my neck is doing much better recently but I can tell if it's drifting in the wrong direction based on how I feel the next day in the right side of my neck, so I always slow down to work on it if I feel anything funny there. Neck injuries suck and it's apparently fairly easy to cause disc or nerve issues too if you are moving at the level of force that you are.

Slightly selfish but since I'm looking at Doss a lot recently - watch his plant process and crush. It's very clean and he's a good example of just "walking right into it." Notice how his swing is pretty closed off and he gets very grounded in the heel before most of the action occurs up the chain, which is why he can get a pretty good rip on it with a small range of motion.

*There are some theoretical reasons I've chatted with people about that Wiggins' form might actually be leaking a bit in a few ways (which is fascinating), but I'll still be happy to take cues from a world distance record holder in the meantime.

Good stuff, im gonna keep doing crush the can and maybe try to stay more closed to get that neck thing fixed. It could be a future problem if i dont handle it asap.

 

[sidewinder22]

Your rearside looks ok, but landing weird on front leg.

I think you land the front leg in a more quad dominant position and lift your shoulder up away from your knee and planes get crossed up.
Simon lands the front leg in a more hip hinge dominant position clearing the knee/hip back and battering ramming the shoulder forward over the knee.

Inside Swing Drill 2 (not yet released):
1. Start standing normal feet close together with both toes on wall.
2. Walk rear foot back away from wall like Reverse Elephant Walk/Walk Back Drill - front toes should easily lift off ground with pressure on heel.
3. Your front knee should be east of ankle and quad muscle should be relaxed and feel some stretch in hammy/glute.
4. Now take a backswing and forward swing to power pocket and swing thru but don't worry about releasing the elbow/lower arm/disc out(wall in way) and walk thru/followthru with rear shoulder forward over front foot inside wall. Your front foot should easily pivot on heel as you swing thru.

 

[Kjimsern]

Your rearside looks ok, but landing weird on front leg.

I think you land the front leg in a more quad dominant position and lift your shoulder up away from your knee and planes get crossed up.
Simon lands the front leg in a more hip hinge dominant position clearing the knee/hip back and battering ramming the shoulder forward over the knee.

Inside Swing Drill 2 (not yet released):
1. Start standing normal feet close together with both toes on wall.
2. Walk rear foot back away from wall like Reverse Elephant Walk/Walk Back Drill - front toes should easily lift off ground with pressure on heel.
3. Your front knee should be east of ankle and quad muscle should be relaxed and feel some stretch in hammy/glute.
4. Now take a backswing and forward swing to power pocket and swing thru but don't worry about releasing the elbow/lower arm/disc out(wall in way) and walk thru/followthru with rear shoulder forward over front foot inside wall. Your front foot should easily pivot on heel as you swing thru.
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View attachment 343579

This is interesting, i will check if i can pull this off.

I agree in what your saying also, i can feel it.

i will make a video and post so you can check if its fine, thanks.

I tried to feel for the ham and glute stretch, that is a great mental que. ( tested some throws)

 

[Brychanus]

Your rearside looks ok, but landing weird on front leg.

I think you land the front leg in a more quad dominant position and lift your shoulder up away from your knee and planes get crossed up.
Simon lands the front leg in a more hip hinge dominant position clearing the knee/hip back and battering ramming the shoulder forward over the knee.

Inside Swing Drill 2 (not yet released):
1. Start standing normal feet close together with both toes on wall.
2. Walk rear foot back away from wall like Reverse Elephant Walk/Walk Back Drill - front toes should easily lift off ground with pressure on heel.
3. Your front knee should be east of ankle and quad muscle should be relaxed and feel some stretch in hammy/glute.
4. Now take a backswing and forward swing to power pocket and swing thru but don't worry about releasing the elbow/lower arm/disc out(wall in way) and walk thru/followthru with rear shoulder forward over front foot inside wall. Your front foot should easily pivot on heel as you swing thru.
View attachment 343578
View attachment 343579

Aww yeah. If I understand where you are going with this it seems like an important bridge between dingle arms, inside swing 1, and whip step. Very cool.

Kjimsern this will feel totally different to you once you get it - related to those drills and some of the golf concepts earlier in this thread. For me it definitely reduces the overstress on the quad and knee and hip and whips the arm through more easily and quicker.