hornet vs. wasp vs. generic overstable mid

[discspeed]

I belong to the "I like to throw my mids like drivers" crowd. Some people will say to power down on an overstable driver, but whenever I power down I seem to still get a really smooth hit and more distance than I want (this tactic is why I love my Comets). I'd just prefer to throw a more predictable, shorter disc which isn't really a bad thing to have.

I like throwing mids hard too, especially for shots that I want pushing straight and gliding the way a overstable fairway will never do. When I do power down on an overstable fairway, I'm usually doing a full throw from a standstill.

Huck Mids here!

I'm talking a precision shot from 200'-300' where you have to go around something and then fade/skip hard to the left. Or a spike. Pretty much any shot where you need to go straight to point A and then straight towards point B without much forward penetration. Most mids won't do this, and if they will, they still don't do it as well as an overstable fwy driver.

 

[7ontheline]

Thrown to 250' Star opaque Rhynos on low lines don't fade. The ones from the previous two years don't anyway. Other plastics do on low lines. Pig fades way early and hard. Close to ESP Zone but not as extreme. Very different flight and the only way i got Pigs farther than Rhynos last year was an s-curve. Pig is faster but drops earlier and harder due to the massive early fade. This year i've gained a little power so maybe the situation has changed. Haven't thrown either this year. No need with my current setup. Both are great and recommendable discs. Even together. Pig sidearms much more securely than Rhyno.

Sorry for any confusion regarding the Pig and thanks for the distance info on *Rhynos. I like your "on low lines" wording. If the Rhynos are stable straight at 250' on low lines then an finessed Sentinal thrown to the same 250' might have the forward gliding fade I'm looking for. My Pig too takes a ton of power to throw it flat or on a slight hyzer to have it get out to 275' or so. The thing knifes and crashes hard left but... it does have this pig mini firebird power fade although overstable and into the ground not staying aloft like I'd like but at least 50'+ of get left baby.

Where's the mid that can be thrown flat on low lines for the first 150' fly that hard fade and penetrate out to 250-300'? What am I missing? Only two mids??? Thanks

 

[7ontheline]

I went to Shelby Forest today for some on course practice.

#1 West calls for a dogleg left 270' in the short (320' long.) There's a tree at 100' that you need to shoot under but there's room out to the right for high sweeping hyzer if desired.

Observations- five throws each
174 Rancho 8/10 and 180 Sanny Rocs 10/10- both rocs performed well thrown flatish or with sweeping hyzer. 6 of the 10 shots ended in the circle.
172 Ace Race Hornet 7/10- performed fair. Harder fade than Rocs but came up short only 2 in the circle
176 GL Pain 8/10- performed fair as only 2 were inside the circle. Two throws were stable with little fade when thrown hard on low line leaving long putts. The Pain hyzered faded similar to the above Rocs.
175 DX Old School Viper 9/10- faded out early and hard. More fade than any or the above and only close to the basket when throwing hard on a hyzer 20' high 50'+ to the right allowing for skip.
171 11x KC pro Whippet 6/10- Best results as 3 out of 5 were in circle and one big skip on low iine just outside the circle that I could learn to aim a little more right on.
172 11X KC Pro Whippet 7.5/10- Similar results as above Viper perhaps 15' longer.
175 11x KC Pro Whippet 10/10- Simialr results as above Viper.
174 Star Firebird 7/10- Bigger fade and harder than any of the above to adjust for distance, had big skips on low lines and needed a fair amount of power and room to the right to accommodate hyzer. I think all but one of these would be jump putts. I usually only flick this flat top firebird for big dog leg rights.
175 Champ Firebird 7/10- Similar results as Star Firebird but more fade and much bigger skips. I usually only overhand, flick for skip, BH skip shots, roll and slice threw small branches with this beefy bad boy.
__________________________________________

#17 West calls for a dogleg left at 165' under a tree with overhanging branches 20' high or hyzered 25' to 35' the right of the truck and less than 35' height due to the trees on the right. The basket if another 160' at a 35 degree angle from the dogleg all 10' slightly uphill.

Observations
Only the Firebirds left me a putt at this one but the best shots were still 30' short. I never knew it was that far until I paced it off today.
175 11x KC Pro Teebird 7.5/10 - Worked well on the hyzer line as well as on the low line with GREAT GLIDING FADE!! YEAH!! However any early release meant off in the woods to the left.
175ish? Champ Orc 7/10- Powering down the Orc was MONEY. 3 in the circle including one drop in. An early release didn't hurt as much as the above 11x Teebird as it didn't have as much fade and was in the edge of the woods but pin high due to its speed.

There are 3 more doglegs on the West course and 3 maybe 4 on Shelby Forest East course that are under 300' and reachable with Mids or perhaps powering down my other 11X KC Pro TB 6.5/10 167g.

I'm gonna work on the Rocs for now and beat in the 172 7.5/10 Whippet by throwing it hard to cover the shots I currently throw with my champ FB. I love my well seasoned Whippet for new found controlled s-turn or straight with late hard fade flicks. My finesse game would suffer if I lost it without a backup.

What is the most overstable roc? Also, what can the Sent or Vector or some other sweet fading mid do better than a new roc?

Sorry for the long write up but dogleg left tunnel shots are birdies that I'm not consistantly getting right now.

 

[jubuttib]

What is the most overstable roc?

I'm gonna take a punt and say Champ Rancho, available as CFR.

 

[7ontheline]

How about easy to find or in production most overstable roc? Still CFR Rancho? The search begins and Paypal bill grows... unless someone wants to trade.

 

[Apothecary]

star sannys are damn overstable as well if you dont want to shell out that kind of cash.

 

[7ontheline]

star sannys are damn overstable as well if you dont want to shell out that kind of cash.

Thanks for the info. $17 bones on ebay, so no more than that, sounds reasonable if the dx roc needs a little get left and can still fly long enough.

I do love the extra glide of dx

 

[mjdepue]

I've thrown two San Marino Star Rocs. One was a friend's, the other my brothers. Brother's was overstable, friend's was flippy (both newish). Friend moved, and brother lost his otherwise I'd try to compare them for you...

Fresh KC Pro Roc should work as well but they do beat in faster than the Stars.

 

[booter]

If u don't mind spending dough...the most overstable roc is a champ glow battle roc or a champ kenny glow roc from the usdgc. Though they both can go for 70+new unpess u find throwers
.I've had a kenny glow in my bag for almost 2 yrs and its still beefy.I'm also the 3rd owner.

Otherwise...snag a vector if u wanna stay in the low price range

 

[Ben Hartwig]

glide, a local vendor here in madison got some kc flat tops. i bet those would be plenty stable...

 

[7ontheline]

glide, a local vendor here in madison got some kc flat tops. i bet those would be plenty stable...

Are KC flat tops OOP or a special run and thus $pendy? If so maybe not. There's another recommend for KC Pro Roc and the Vector... or perhaps the Sent or Star Sanny.

On low lines through tunnels goes stable/straight for 140-160' then fades hard with GLIDE out to 250-300'. More field work for me. I might have to stick to my budget and learn to throw my Rocs for a while but there's got to be something out there for me that I can depend on. thanks

 

[Amateur]

On low lines through tunnels goes stable/straight for 140-160' then fades hard with GLIDE out to 250-300'. More field work for me. I might have to stick to my budget and learn to throw my Rocs for a while but there's got to be something out there for me that I can depend on. thanks

I keep reading this. I don't think a mid will do this shot very well. I use my ESP Cyclones for shots like this. The low ceiling is the X factor, it kills the gliding fade you would get from an overstable mid.

My home course has a go straight 100', go left 300' hole that I always take 3 on. I don't have a ceiling requriement, but there is OB along the fairway keeping you from throwing booming hyzers with fast discs. I've used every disc in my drawer for this one and my ESP Cyclones get me farthest to the left. Now I just have to learn to make a 60' putt.

 

[zj10021]

at some point it does become the archer...

learn to shape the discs you have

 

[Ben Hartwig]

glide, a local vendor here in madison got some kc flat tops. i bet those would be plenty stable...

Are KC flat tops OOP or a special run and thus $pendy? If so maybe not. There's another recommend for KC Pro Roc and the Vector... or perhaps the Sent or Star Sanny.

On low lines through tunnels goes stable/straight for 140-160' then fades hard with GLIDE out to 250-300'. More field work for me. I might have to stick to my budget and learn to throw my Rocs for a while but there's got to be something out there for me that I can depend on. thanks

im pretty sure that you can order them from innova, as glide got them fairly recently with a custom stamp.

 

[Ben Hartwig]

and they aren't spendy at all... i think just 12 dollars like the regular pro

 

[7ontheline]

Vector, KC Pro Roc, Sent, Star Sanny Roc...

No other recommends for a flat low line then hard fading while gliding forward mid?

 

[jubuttib]

I know that there are some Pains out there that are less stable, but all of the GL ones I've thrown were just as stable as Vectors, and would fit here.

 

[7ontheline]

Maybe I got a bad Pain or it just didn't fit me or I suck. My failures with the Pain and searching for an alternative is what interested me about this thread back on pg 5.

Anyone want to trade Pains? 176 GL Blue looks almost new

 

[Ben Hartwig]

i threw a pain quite a bit earlier this year and i loved it... until i tried throwing it into a headwind. it is a great overstable mid, that just doesnt fly like it should into a headwind. my wasp stays overstable into a headwind with no problem, even with a lot behind it. it is my teenager with no job champ roc.

 

[helly]

I have a couple Pains, both Opto in Red and Magenta at like 178 and 177g, and both of them performed admirably into VERY stiff winds the other day. Got one to hold quite a strong hyzer on a 280ft approach into what felt like 35mph headwinds.