Professionalism in discs

[RobA]

That's a broad generalization that I have found to be very untrue. It's sort of like the "only throw putters for x amount of time" myth...it's perpetuated by players who are only slightly above average and whom also look down upon new players, for whatever reason.

Not to get off topic but you just countered what you though to be a broad generalization with a far bigger broad generalization. :doh:

I don't agree with the "only throw putters" thing at all. But the reality is flight ratings only hold true when someone can throw the disc the way it was meant to be thrown. If you can't throw it a the suggested speed rating, or you throw it with too much torque, etc. then the flight ratings are useless to you.

 

[Jenga54]

TLDR
I just came here to bash Gateway and the garbage they will put on discs by request.

#professional
not to mention all the pot leaves, but this is classy.

 

[Jenga54]

sorry you had to see that if you hadn't already

 

[RobA]

As a relatively new disc golf player (~3yrs) I find this argument/conversation interesting.
For me, walking into the sport with only a 4 disc Discraft Starter pack, the inconsistencies of disc characteristics (including names) was a daunting mountain of spaghetti to make sense and order of.:doh:

My issue was my comparative reference: golf.
See, I have a fairly standard set of golf clubs. Drivers/Woods: 1, 3, 5, 7. Fairway/Irons: 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9. Wedges: Sand, Pitching. Putter: simple blade putter.
The thing is, I can hate any one of my clubs by any particular manufacturer. I can go to the Pro Shop and ask to see, for example, their selection of 9 Irons and BOOM! No confusion. :thmbup: (We could get picky with loft and lie angles, among other club related metrics, but I believe the point is made.)

This is where disc golf is weak, in my opinion: We have no mutually accepted, general classification system (and no one company has presented a complete alternative/solution):thmbdown:

I would personally prefer a hybrid of Prodigy/Discmania type designation combined with a finer grained Innova/Discraft flight characterization. Names and flight paths descriptors could simply be icing on the cake.

For example, a putter, the MVP Anode:
By Innova terms (infinitediscs.com)
Speed: 3
Glide: 3
Turn: 0
Fade 0

In my mind a: P-3
P - Putter
3 - It's Cruising Velocity target ( on a 1 - X scale where numeric "bins" are defined in terms of discrete meter/second or mph bounds)

As such it's full name might be: MVP P-3 Anode (the best of both worlds)
Glide, Turn, and Fade designations would serve to distinguish the disc among other P-3 putters.
Personally, I would like to see Glide on a 0-10 scale where bins are respective of % hang time, Turn on a -10-0 scale, and Fade on a 0-10 scale.
Ultimately the Anode might be fully defined as:
MVP P-3 Anode [3,-1,1]
Similarly, the Aviar Classic:
Innova P-2 Aviar Classic [2,0,0]


All said, I admit to being obsessive about this topic to the point where I have begun statistically analyzing the 600+ discs on inboundsdiscgolf.com flight path database in reference to various Innova interpretations. I hope to be able to prove, mathematically, that the concepts I have described above are already in practice through common understanding but are as of yet undefined by common, public practice.

However, let us not forget the intended purpose of such systems (and why manufacturers are against them). The point is to improve quality standards for our beloved game and for the equipment we use to play it, from manufacturer down to the green.

This isn't golf, and your argument that a driver is a driver across all manufacturers does not hold water.

We have general categories: Long Distance Drivers, Fairway Drivers, mid-ranges, and putters. They correspond with your Woods, Irons, and putters. Maybe golf would be much less boring if manufacturers named their clubs to avoid the deception that my 9-iron is the same as yours.

 

[brentjacobs]

Don't try to take the fun away:|

Mmmm nope, I don't agree. Standardization is a first step toward banality and ennui.

Thank you for using the word "ennui", great work! :thmbup:

 

[Dan Ensor]

TLDR
I just came here to bash Gateway and the garbage they will put on discs by request.

#professional
not to mention all the pot leaves, but this is classy.

Their customer service is top notch, and they aren't prudes. Such a flaw. :\

 

[THUGNIFICENT763]

Disc names are arbitrary, I name my discs anyways. I have a SP Hurricane named "Scrambles the Death Dealer".

 

[brentjacobs]

sorry you had to see that if you hadn't already

It's ok, I've seen the real thing so that was more dissapointing than anything, not prticularly accurate if you weren't aware.

There is custom art work in all consumer industries, all of which is subjective. Not a new concept so this whole conversation is strange to me. When did it become not ok to express oneself, whether a company or individual, via art(whether somebody else considers it tacky or not)?

I know a guy that got a "Bang the Chains" tatoo on his calf with Calvin pants down bending the basket over. It is the sh*tt*est tatoo ever(not the quality but the concept, the ink was well done). That's my opinion(and that of many others) but only that, an opinion. I would never tell him not to come to my leagues or tourneys. Variety is the spice of life and censorship & nanny-government is a slippery slope. Do you remember what happened in Demolition Man? I'd have to look at that Gateway stamp through a virtual viewer.

We're all entitled to opinions but trying to push others to see that "your way of thought holds us back as a community" is an exercise in futility. About as useless as me posting this aimed toward those who think their standards of integrity for the sport should be the status-quo.

 

[namar]

... But the reality is flight ratings only hold true when someone can throw the disc the way it was meant to be thrown. If you can't throw it a the suggested speed rating, or you throw it with too much torque, etc. then the flight ratings are useless to you.

flight ratings are only worthless to those who don't know or chose to ignore their meaning. to continue the car analogies, the average driver who is used to their traction control-equipped econobox will almost certainly spin/crash an old formula ford.

 

[Jenga54]

It's ok, I've seen the real thing so that was more dissapointing than anything, not prticularly accurate if you weren't aware.

There is custom art work in all consumer industries, all of which is subjective. Not a new concept so this whole conversation is strange to me. When did it become not ok to express oneself, whether a company or individual, via art(whether somebody else considers it tacky or not)?

I know a guy that got a "Bang the Chains" tatoo on his calf with Calvin pants down bending the basket over. It is the sh*tt*est tatoo ever(not the quality but the concept, the ink was well done). That's my opinion(and that of many others) but only that, an opinion. I would never tell him not to come to my leagues or tourneys. Variety is the spice of life and censorship & nanny-government is a slippery slope. Do you remember what happened in Demolition Man? I'd have to look at that Gateway stamp through a virtual viewer.

We're all entitled to opinions but trying to push others to see that "your way of thought holds us back as a community" is an exercise in futility. About as useless as me posting this aimed toward those who think their standards of integrity for the sport should be the status-quo.

A well written post. Art is subjective, however not all art is "professional" looking because that itself is subjective.
Of course the goal of being "professional" one would guess would be to draw in more people to the sport (#growthesport yay). For some, a DiscMania or Prodigy number stamp does this and attracts people. For others, the pot leaf and portrayal of women as objects attracts new players, so it goes both ways.
There is custom art in all businesses, and they typically will have rules on what they will allow and what they won't allow their product to sport next to its logo.
Since the post is about professionalism and not about limiting freedom, of course they can do it, and I can label it as "unprofessional"

 

[Aim For The Chains]

 

[RobA]

flight ratings are only worthless to those who don't know or chose to ignore their meaning. to continue the car analogies, the average driver who is used to their traction control-equipped econobox will almost certainly spin/crash an old formula ford.

Even though I don't get the analogy, it sounds like we are on the same page.

 

[Lewis]

I think the car analogy is the best. A Camry is like an Accord is like a Taurus is like an etc etc etc.

What really sets these cars apart? Tiny details like trunk space, head room, feel, look. You won't REALLY know what it's like to drive until you get behind the wheel. Same thing with a new disc. It's like a roc is like a wasp is like an etc etc etc.

I never hear new automobile drivers complaining about car names being too confusing, how is it any worse with discs? That's why there are flight charts.

I assume everyone knows what an F-150 is. I figure almost everyone knows that an F-250 is bigger than an F-150, and that an F-350 is bigger still. Same with the E-line of panel trucks.

Then you see "Mustangs" and "GT" cars and "Fusions" and "Edges" and "Flexes". Same brand, different target. No big deal.

I would like to argue, though, that a Camry is more like a Civic than an Accord.

 

[wolfmandragon]

I assume everyone knows what an F-150 is. I figure almost everyone knows that an F-250 is bigger than an F-150, and that an F-350 is bigger still. Same with the E-line of panel trucks.

Then you see "Mustangs" and "GT" cars and "Fusions" and "Edges" and "Flexes". Same brand, different target. No big deal.

I would like to argue, though, that a Camry is more like a Civic than an Accord.

Yes, but cars/trucks have a model year/vin configuration, thattracks the differences within the same model. Not so with discs. Which M1 does one have in their bag? Who knows? Stupid, shortsighted marketing driven crap

 

[ThrowBot]

I think that we should eschew all disc stamping/dyeing and instead have braille molded into the top of every disc that describes the flight characteristics. That will help blind people learn to play disc golf more quickly. #growthesport