Reid's Journey to Backhand Mastery

[UhhNegative]

I think I maybe am misunderstanding the "inside" swing. I definitely see how you are more turned back like almost your front side is folded back across your back side. But then if I look at Doss at the same point of the throw, he's definitely turning back too but it seems like he would be breaking the wall as well. It just seems like a wide reach back is antithesis to what you are saying. Am I just understanding this wrong? Seems to me my weight is just too far tipped forward instead of loading/turning back more and staying more centered. I think it comes from a misguided goal of getting on to the front foot, but I am overdoing it. I think some side view video would clear that up.

 

[slowplastic]

Doss' head and shoulders are still inside his stance. I see it on beginner snowboarders all the time, they kind of lean forward so their spine/back is at a 30 degree angle with their butt way out past their heel edge and shoulders way out past their toe edge. Sure your average body weight is overtop of the middle of your board, but you have a ton of weight past each edge. A little nudge/bump either way and the weight gets sloshed out of your stance, in this case past your heels/toes. The solution is to be more upright in the spine with more squat so that your butt is over the heels and shoulders over the toes.

Nate Doss' shoulders and butt are inside of his stance. Yes his right hand is along the toes/touching the wall, but it's not way out to the side...although the shoulder angle is greater than 90 because of how turned back he is. I'd focus on the body alignment first, being inside the stance. If you're past your feet you don't have any leverage...poor throws aren't as fast of a teacher as hard butt checks or scorpion falls.

 

[sidewinder22]

Also have to account for camera angle and trajectory angle left to right, so Doss's wall on this pure hyzer shot would be angled left to right down the trajectory/ tee pad inline with his arm. Inside swing drill is for straight or distance line right to left.

 

[UhhNegative]

So a little more squatty with the legs and less bent over up top? I'm still struggling to see the difference, at least with this frame. It's definitely easy to notice with the video with how my whole top torso falls over the top and I'm weird bent at the end of the shot.

 

[slowplastic]

Yeah you can see SW22 and Doss both have their rear leg a bit more bent so that the left hip/butt is over the heel, whereas yours is past the heel to the right of the tee. And their spines are less tilted so their right shoulders are swinging above the right ankle rather than the toes.

 

[UhhNegative]

Ok I see now. I think in my effort to shift "from behind" I was falling out of posture so I will have to revisit my positioning on that. Now that you mention the butt positioning I can totally see it.

 

[sidewinder22]

Right and door frame drill your front foot should be inline to the frame so arm is straight back and inline. I think some people misconceive or fear rounding too much in reach back, but if your shoulders turn far enough back and maintain the wide upper arm even when the disc crosses behind your center, you will not round.

 

[deyo7]

I think its helpful to think of keeping it

| tight |

(as in all centered in the lines, not tense). Toight. Toight, like a tiger...

 

[billyjacko]

Yeah you can see SW22 and Doss both have their rear leg a bit more bent so that the left hip/butt is over the heel, whereas yours is past the heel to the right of the tee. And their spines are less tilted so their right shoulders are swinging above the right ankle rather than the toes.

Ok I see now. I think in my effort to shift "from behind" I was falling out of posture so I will have to revisit my positioning on that. Now that you mention the butt positioning I can totally see it.

The thing that really helped me with the inside swing drill is thinking of leveraging the shoulders. RHBH right shoulder will be leveraged against the left instep into the backswing. Left shoulder will leverage against the right instep in the swing (and fallow through right over the plant foot.) This and thinking about getting the rear hip pointing toward the target have both helped me get consistent distance in the 400' range. Have you set up to do the inside swing drill yet? I felt stupid, but when put pressure on the right foot and the disc immediately started going forward it was a huge mental breakthrough for me.

 

[UhhNegative]

Well I got to play some AZ disc golf today which was really fun as someone from the east coast. This is from Buffalo Ridge. Wasn't really focused on form but I have been keeping the off arm in a little bit more but still having posture issues. I just want to stick out my butt for some reason. This was a pretty short downhill hole so I threw a little hyzer here.

 

[sidewinder22]

You look awfully stiff and flat footed in the setup. Use your feet to move your body/weight back and forth a little and settle into the ground/stance and take a practice swing or few. Aim the swing weight of the disc to the apex. Still extending the rear knee/pushing off heel. Need to squat lower and push off the instep/plantar flexion which will engage your butt muscles better.

 

[UhhNegative]

Alright I think I understand the inside swing drill better and how it's supposed to help you keep inside your posture. Will be practicing. I think my fear of rounding has compounded the issue.

I have a follow through/grip related question. It seems I have the problem of rotating my shoulder open through the finish, like I used to do with my left handed throw to compensate for my lack of angle integrity. Are you supposed to actually pronate through the finish or basically just keep the same angle? Watching this video of Paul it looks like he basically maintains shoulder position through the hit and then pronates as the arm is moving more behind the body (for safety, longevity, I assume). But whenever I think about trying to pronate through the finish, it just feels like the disc will come out on hyzer.

 

[sidewinder22]

Yes. Pronating and internal shoulder rotation keeps the disc on angle through release and extends leverage/whip forward with the thumb. The nose of the disc is on the opposite side from your grip... it you hold the arm and disc straight out from you, pronate/internal rotate, the opposite side of disc drops down/nose down, vice versa supinate the nose goes up.

 

[UhhNegative]

Got a little chance to try out some new ideas with grip. I focused on putting more grip pressure with my thumb instead of my fingers (if that makes sense) and it felt like I could hold on much longer and keep my forearm looser. I was also able to throw more pronated and definitely was getting more nose down flights. Didn't have enough space to throw further than about 150' but I think it was progress. Just a matter of convincing my brain it was a good idea. Even threw in a little turnover Judge from about 90' in my backyard so that was fun.

 

[UhhNegative]

Some putting and swinging practice from today (and some right handed ball golf swinging):
Ugh I'm still supinating through impact instead of pronating

https://photos.app.goo.gl/2cEuo8qLsl73DTth1

https://photos.app.goo.gl/WCseAUiMXPg5lbch2

https://photos.app.goo.gl/RsrupzHWrPvB8kH43

 

[sidewinder22]

- Take the watch off your wrist!

- It looks like you are squatting/crouching before you even start the backswing. Stand tall in the setup, so you can load down/back into the rear leg in the backswing/transition, and still be able to lower your center of gravity/fall into the plant to start the forward swing.

- Need to get your heels to up lift off the ground. Backswing - front heel needs to go up. Forward swing - front heel plants as rear heel goes up. Double crush the can.

- You are reaching back across your body/rounding in backswing. In Door Frame Drill, your front foot needs to be inline to door frame so arm/disc are straight back with the front foot. Your rear foot appears to inline to door frame instead.

- Need to turn your body/arm further back on disc, so your grip should be more on the 9 o'clock on the disc/opposite your chest, you are pulling the disc at almost 12 o'clock on it by the nose.

- Need to brace and turn/clear the front hip behind the ankle/knee.

- Need to get your rear arm in front of your body to brace against front leg.

 

[UhhNegative]

My front hip also gets way too far ahead of my plant foot and kind of jams up instead of clearing (easy to see in those frames). Where in the transition is that going wrong? I think that's why my rear leg straightens instead of staying loaded, because I'm moving the weight forward too early or too far?

Still dreaming about that one day in the field I had 2+ years ago when I had effortless 350'

 

[sidewinder22]

In Door Frame Drill, your front heel should be weightless - leads into crush the can. Looks like you are really flat footed so your weight really isn't shifting back or forward.

 

[UhhNegative]

So I think I had a mental breakthrough after reading Aztec's post. I was keeping my arm way too stiff. Now when I DINGLE ARM back and forth I see how basically the disc HAS to get to your right pec if you keep your arm loose. Experimented a little bit in the backyard and short upshots require almost no effort when I let the disc whip in to my chest and then hold my grip firm at the end to launch it. It's going to need a lot of work and practice but I think this is a step in right direction.

 

[UhhNegative]

Finally figured out putting a little better. I needed speed earlier (lower), thinking about using my index to control the nose, and using my fingers to keep the disc more flat. I'd say my RH putting has surpassed my LH at this point which is exciting. Lots more work to do. On BH I'm still playing around with keeping my hand on the outside of the disc better, keeping the arm loose, and working on the hit timing. I'm getting much better spin and straighter flights even at the 100'-150' I've been practicing at.