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I did a lot of choreography throughout high school in show choir. (We had one of the best programs in the country at the time) Mixing that with the more recent hypertrophy background, I can micromanage my body parts and muscles a good deal more than I think is helpful in disc golf. I don't catch on to some things very fast because my body parts don't necessarily follow the expected path.
This is very interesting and reminded me of a recent Shawn Clement video I saw:
About 45 seconds in he is talking about not thinking about body parts. When you asked about tightening your abs during a swing it kind of blew my mind because I feel like (for me) that would be the most awkward swing ever.
I have done some shadow swings to see how the ab contraction feels, and I do feel able to stay over my toes more during the throw out portion than before. That seems like a positive change if it transfers to the field.
I did a lot of choreography throughout high school in show choir. (We had one of the best programs in the country at the time) Mixing that with the more recent hypertrophy background, I can micromanage my body parts and muscles a good deal more than I think is helpful in disc golf. I don't catch on to some things very fast because my body parts don't necessarily follow the expected path.
I just mention that to apologize for asking how something feels or how to do some things that should just be falling into place a lot more than most people. Engineer brain also thinks piece by piece, so I have a few hangups in terms of "moving naturally."
This is very interesting and reminded me of a recent Shawn Clement video I saw:
About 45 seconds in he is talking about not thinking about body parts. When you asked about tightening your abs during a swing it kind of blew my mind because I feel like (for me) that would be the most awkward swing ever.
Wanted to pile on here. I had a lot of posture control developed from dance before I started. My instructor was late in her career and had trained many very high-level dancers. Part of what she can do in person you can't learn online is physically "backleading" a person into the moves, which also teaches them about momentum and gravity and mechanics. This is the value of good in-person coaching when available. Sometimes grabbing a player by a beltloop and help them learn about weight shifting teaches them quickly. Other times not.
However, even as I gained a lot of muscle and posture control good for dance, I still had to develop DG-specific posture & moves to make progress. Much of the progress comes from finding big, natural movements that help you swing with your entire body mass for power taking or delivering a hit. It is a distinct goal from dance (which usually doesn't involve throwing a partner into walls at maximum ejection speed), with distinct posture implications. Many adults have different blocks. Addressing them makes focusing on individual parts when necessary easier.
My suggestion is that you want to get the "big pieces" of your posture in place as best as possible before getting so fixated on things like abs. You immediately returned to thinking about abs, but instead you need to learn to use entirely different muscle groups in sequence. You can't do that just by focusing on your toes and abs based on what I'm observing.
There is a reason a lot of golf instructors spend so much time on it and make people swing ropes, clubs, hammers, etc. before they worry about what the left pinky toe is doing (unless that pinky is somehow botching the whole chain in some way). From there, you might find muscular isolation helpful at some points depending on the issues. I can tell based on how you're writing that you're getting trapped and fixated looking at the wrong details trying to solve the "swing problem." Seen it hundreds of times now. Been through it. Relax. Learn the posture first. Get everything settled into a way that makes you move for easy power and you can hang other concepts and moves to it.
I will try to simplify your goal again. Just try to get your body to hold the bag or jug more like SW there. Don't worry about abs or fiber bundles or tendons or a 9-dimensional representation of the multiverse or whatever right now. Just this:
Once you get it (reliably), we get swinging again.
There is a reason a lot of golf instructors spend so much time on it and make people swing ropes, clubs, hammers, etc. before they worry about what the left pinky toe is doing (unless that pinky is somehow botching the whole chain in some way). From there, you might find muscular isolation helpful at some points depending on the issues. I can tell based on how you're writing that you're getting trapped and fixated looking at the wrong details trying to solve the "swing problem." Seen it hundreds of times now. Been through it. Relax. Learn the posture first. Get everything settled into a way that makes you move for easy power and you can hang other concepts and moves to it.
A local pro has given me advice to plant more in front of my body in order to keep my hips closed for longer. I think that may help my x-step more than my standstill, but I am planning to try both.
Something I recently started thinking about was the downward pressure on the plant foot and lag. I can see that you appear to be starting to pull the disc through just as your plant foot is coming down. This looks familiar to me, as I believe I struggled/am struggling with this.
What seems to be helping with with lag at the moment is thinking about my off shoulder, and using the force of winding the coil to push the plant foot into the ground. See if you can do a walk/run up, no disc, just footwork, and let that left shoulder push forward into the plant foot before you start the swing. What this does for me is help create lag and more downward pressure on the plant foot. This forward shift is what causes the loose arm to follow through with less pulling on the disc. It's this full coil that also creates the offset (window) in the plant stance.
The other bit is try to resist letting your chest open up to the target. Hope that helps
What seems to be helping with with lag at the moment is thinking about my off shoulder, and using the force of winding the coil to push the plant foot into the ground. See if you can do a walk/run up, no disc, just footwork, and let that left shoulder push forward into the plant foot before you start the swing. What this does for me is help create lag and more downward pressure on the plant foot. This forward shift is what causes the loose arm to follow through with less pulling on the disc. It's this full coil that also creates the offset (window) in the plant stance.
So I'll try saying what I think jupiter is saying in a different way and then see if I'm right.
I think what he is saying is as you coil (rotating in the back swing) focus on your left shoulder and visualize it coming forward and pushing your plant foot down. It sounds weird at first but it should technically be closer to your front foot than your right shoulder if you're coiled correctly.
I was intrigued by that comment as well and not sure I understand it either.
So I'll try saying what I think jupiter is saying in a different way and then see if I'm right.
I think what he is saying is as you coil (rotating in the back swing) focus on your left shoulder and visualize it coming forward and pushing your plant foot down. It sounds weird at first but it should technically be closer to your front foot than your right shoulder if you're coiled correctly.
Yeah, and it's not a "visualize" but a feel. You can feel the rotation and left should going counterclockwise as it pushes you plant foot into the ground. Then the brace gets a steady, quick increase in pressure as the rest of the train comes through. It's definitely something I feel, and noticing it helps create the needed lag.
Interesting. I like the idea, and it certainly seems helpful for delaying the upper body.
Does doing that make you over rotate or lean too far targetward during your backswing?
A local pro has given me advice to plant more in front of my body in order to keep my hips closed for longer. I think that may help my x-step more than my standstill, but I am planning to try both.
Posture is a little better. You still have a touch of spine extension. Keep doing the jug posture correction.
Your chain and effort looks nearly the same as before.
You need to get off your rear foot everting in to lead your weight into the plant rather than leaving the whole rear leg behind and tipping off of your rear heel.
Tamm is fundamentally doing this move with more braced tilt due to his momentum. You need to get off the rear foot like he does, landing with the posture that he does:
Try setting up with your plant foot heel lined up with your rear foot toe for now. Make sure you feel resistance in the ball of your rear foot heading into the backswing rather than slipping/spinning out of it. Your legs should feel like springs.
I might also try practicing keeping your eyes with the disc as you exit the peak of the backswing. Tamm does it and you probably wouldn't argue about it if it helped you throw as far as him. Every time my head rushes out of the backswing it creates other issues.
I might also try practicing keeping your eyes with the disc as you exit the peak of the backswing. Tamm does it and you probably wouldn't argue about it if it helped you throw as far as him. Every time my head rushes out of the backswing it creates other issues.
What issues does it create for you? I've tried fixing it but never personally felt or observed any difference. That's the reason it's been low priority, and I've just let my head move naturally. I can focus on it if it's a big problem.
What issues does it create for you? I've tried fixing it but never personally felt or observed any difference. That's the reason it's been low priority, and I've just let my head move naturally. I can focus on it if it's a big problem.
Interesting. I like the idea, and it certainly seems helpful for delaying the upper body.
Does doing that make you over rotate or lean too far targetward during your backswing?
For me, if I start to lean back or forward I lose the pressure. Only when my weight is pretty centered can I feel it. There's a sweet spot, but you have to keep the centered posture through the throw.
When I started I would reach back and lean back, but that makes an upward lift instead of downward pressure.
I can stand, rotate, and bounce and feel it driving my foot into the ground, and the force feels like it starts in the off shoulder.
Note the diagram over the photo in the thumbnail (like you could miss it). This is what I'm on about.
It seems like I am doing it like SW says to do here? I don't lean my head forward, just rotate it.
It probably would look cleaner if I was actually on the tilted axis...
It seems like I am doing it like SW says to do here? I don't lean my head forward, just rotate it.
It probably would look cleaner if I was actually on the tilted axis...
Quick question:
How do you gas pedal while dropping? I keep ending up raising up when I do that despite knowing I should be using gravity to come down harder. The leg wants to straighten rather than bend if I push off with my left toes.
You need to get off your rear foot everting in to lead your weight into the plant rather than leaving the whole rear leg behind and tipping off of your rear heel.
Also, does it work just as well to land with the left calf extended then drop the knee in as it does to somehow time both with the plant? That would be a lot easier for me to accomplish, I think.
