Trying to Learn (video form critique)

[ClydesdaleDan]

I just started disc golfing about two months ago and would like some help on my form (primarily RHBH). In the last week I realized I was strong arming my throws pretty bad as well as hugging myself on the reach-back. Since then I have attempted to correct things by rotating my spine/shoulders and reaching straight back. With this new form I can throw a champion Teebird about 300' consistently and it flies dead straight with a little fade at the end. My Buzz and Roc go 260'-280' with very little turn or fade. As shown in the second video, I occasionally have release issues (Griplock?) and yank the disc way right of where I aim, these throws often have some anhyzer and fly farther than my good throws :doh: . One of these throws with a dx Roc flew about 330' today, which surprised the hell out of me.

Also, please ignore the stupid faces I make while throwing.

I do notice my right foot lands toe forward instead of toe back but i'm having issues correcting it at full speed.



Why does this happen?



I occasionally use my forehand and can get decent distance and control with it but I would much prefer to be a predominantly backhand player.

A little background info. - I have played most sports in high school: Football(O/D-lineman), Track(400m&shotput), Basketball, Baseball. I'm am pretty good at learn proper technique and form from these sports but, I'm accustomed to having a coach or mentor of some kind to teach in person as opposed to videos and online research so this is a new challenge.

Thanks in advance for any help, sorry for the long first post.

 

[hazed_0ut]

Don't think your videos are working but...

"I'm having issues correcting it at full speed"

Slow down.

http://www.heavydisc.com/2014/11/slow-down-and-throw-far.html?m=1

Do everything slow until you get it. Start from a stand still, and then work in one step, then two steps, then the full x step.

https://youtu.be/nED7gcXobEo

 

[sidewinder22]

Your rear foot is completely backward and trying to push off your heel from non-athletic horse-stance and balance on/behind your heels. You should maintain your posture and balance in forward athletic position and drive off your rear instep loaded through your hip(your core needs to turn back into it further). Watch how GG's rear heel never touches the ground and maintains athletic posture and balance with the rear foot more turned to the target so he can make a forward move from it.

 

[ClydesdaleDan]

Don't think your videos are working but...

If you click the pics it should link you to the video in my photobucket.

"I'm having issues correcting it at full speed"
Slow down.

Do everything slow until you get it. Start from a stand still, and then work in one step, then two steps, then the full x step.

https://youtu.be/nED7gcXobEo

Will do, I have spent some time practicing it all slower and I felt that I was able to do it pretty well but I lose that feeling when I speed up. I'll take some time and go back to a standstill throw and work up to a slow x-step then faster and see if that helps.

Your rear foot is completely backward and trying to push off your heel from non-athletic horse-stance and balance on/behind your heels.

The nickname Clydesdale was given to me by a middle school football coach because my tendency to be heavy footed reminded him of a draft horse :\ ... so on the bright side, I've dealt with this issue before

 

[hazed_0ut]

For speeding up, just remember, its not how fast you go thru your runup and xstep, that won't add any distance. It's about going slow and then accelerating at the LAST possible moment, not keeping the speed thru the hole throw.

 

[ClydesdaleDan]

I think i'm getting my left foot/leg positioned better now but I think I maybe still need to work on my right foot (crushing the can).

Am I on the right track?

By the way, Thanks for all the help already.

 

[sidewinder22]

Holy splits ClydesdaleDan! Maybe better? IDK, your balance is so far off/back. You are tilted your upper body(spine) so far back behind your rear leg and trying to make a huge weightshift and stride, but doing that throws your balance off and out of good athletic posture to move quick in any direction. Your head needs to stay inside your feet and knees. When you come down from your x-step your head is well behind your rear knee. You want to stay more upright/centered, and your weight will shift automatically and be more compact and powerful.

 

[ClydesdaleDan]

I guess I'll work on shorter steps and staying more upright? :doh: it looks to me like part of why my weight got so far behind me is because my left foot had to cross so far behind my right foot in the x-step to get pointed toe-in, that it actually got ahead of my upper body. Then to regain balance, I'm taking that massive step with my right foot. So does anyone have any advice on how to get the toe of my left size-15 past the heel of my right size-15 without taking an exaggerated x-step?

 

[sidewinder22]

Yep, your x-step is massive which starts your balance to tilt. Working from a standstill/ 1-step will make your progress go faster. You can take a tiny step behind and turn back later(should be turning back later in any form), or you can hop and go airborne which gets your feet vertical and out of the way, or you can do a non-x hop like Moser.

 

[sidewinder22]

 

[ClydesdaleDan]

Thanks again, I'll probably take some time and do way more standstill throwing than I did tonight and add in a step at a time when I'm comfortable. I think I'm trying to fix a broken form when I'd probably be better off rebuilding from the ground up. I'll post more videos as I run into issues.

 

[ClydesdaleDan]

I've been working on my standstill form and focusing alot on arm movement/timing. I hit about 340ft with a champion teebird on this throw.
<embed width="600" height="361" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowFullscreen="true" allowNetworking="all" wmode="transparent" src="http://static.photobucket.com/player.swf" flashvars="file=http%3A%2F%2Fvid1161.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq514%2Fclydesdale80%2FTB-340ft_zpss4gh2flb.mp4">

SloMo
<embed width="600" height="361" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowFullscreen="true" allowNetworking="all" wmode="transparent" src="http://static.photobucket.com/player.swf" flashvars="file=http%3A%2F%2Fvid1161.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq514%2Fclydesdale80%2FTB-340ft-Slo_zpshxzcaquw.mp4">

Things are feeling better and I'm throwing farther now than I was with a run-up so I must be doing something right. How does it look?

 

[ClydesdaleDan]

I've been working on my standstill form and focusing alot on arm movement/timing. I hit about 340ft with a champion teebird on this throw.


SloMo


Things are feeling better and I'm throwing farther now than I was with a run-up so I must be doing something right. How does it look?

Sorry about that, I fixed the video links here.

 

[sidewinder22]

Your grip disc alignment is major nose up. Your reachback is too over the top, need to swing back under and change your balance toward your knees and toes. The plane that your arm is swinging on should be a roller, but your grip puts the nose up so it doesn't go into the ground. You need to swing your arm level/flat or under for hyzer, so your arm finishes higher, so you are throwing upward with the nose down.

https://www.dgcoursereview.com/dgr/resources/articles/gripittoripit.shtml

 

[ClydesdaleDan]

Here is where I'm at after some time focusing on more athletic stance, weight over toes/knees, and nose down angle on disc.

http://vid1161.photobucket.com/albums/q514/clydesdale80/teebird slomo_zpsx3lmpcla.mp4

Consistency definitely has improved.

Thoughts?

 

[sidewinder22]

Setup with your weight more 50/50, not 0/100 back. And move/rock your weight back and forth a little, be dynamic/rhythmic not static. You are striding way too far to ever get balanced on your front foot.

 

[ClydesdaleDan]

Setup with your weight more 50/50, not 0/100 back. And move/rock your weight back and forth a little, be dynamic/rhythmic not static. You are striding way too far to ever get balanced on your front foot.

First off, thanks for all the help so far, I know I probably still look like a clumsy noob flailing awkwardly long limbs around but, my consistency and distance have both improved much more quickly than I expected thanks to your advice.
I read this last night and reread it this morning and wasn't really comprehending it. I couldn't figure out why I should start my weight shift with half my weight already in the direction I was going what you meant about moving back and forth more. After thinking about it more, I think what you are trying to tell me is to start at 50/50 then rock back to nearly 0/100 to get a little bounce before the weight shift to 100/0.

Also if I understand you correctly, my large stride is causing me to finish the throw with my balance behind my right foot and I need to finish with my balance over it. Basically I'm finishing with my body aligned like this -
torso......|
femur..../
shin.....|
And I need to finish more like -
torso.......\
femur....../
shin........\
Sorry for such primitive illustrations.

Am I understanding you correctly on these points? If not please correct me.

 

[slowplastic]

Your shin should be on a similar angle to the femur...never let any joint drift past the one below it/the plant foot. So your knee should be behind your ankle/instep/heel. I'm not sure what viewing angle you were drawing those lines on, but I just want to make sure you're not bending your knee forwards and drifting past the heel.

 

[sidewinder22]

First off, thanks for all the help so far, I know I probably still look like a clumsy noob flailing awkwardly long limbs around but, my consistency and distance have both improved much more quickly than I expected thanks to your advice.
I read this last night and reread it this morning and wasn't really comprehending it. I couldn't figure out why I should start my weight shift with half my weight already in the direction I was going what you meant about moving back and forth more. After thinking about it more, I think what you are trying to tell me is to start at 50/50 then rock back to nearly 0/100 to get a little bounce before the weight shift to 100/0.

Correct, if you watch most pros they actually setup 100% weight forward because that's the hitting and finish position. Then they work their way back into the backswing. When you push your arm/disc back into the backswing, the weight/pressure actually increases on the front foot to counter at first, then it moves back with the swing of the arm/disc. Moving your weight back and forth before the backswing helps set the rhythm and settle your posture into the ground.

Also if I understand you correctly, my large stride is causing me to finish the throw with my balance behind my right foot and I need to finish with my balance over it. Basically I'm finishing with my body aligned like this -
torso......|
femur..../
shin.....|
And I need to finish more like -
torso.......\
femur....../
shin........\
Sorry for such primitive illustrations.

Am I understanding you correctly on these points? If not please correct me.

Kind of, not sure about the cave man drawing, but you should finish stacked upright and balanced on the front foot, not over/past it or behind it. You should be able to squat/support a bunch of weight over your shoulders/under your feet.

 

[ClydesdaleDan]

So right after SW22's last post I got invited to spend a day going to a few courses with my friends. I didn't get a chance to do any field work with the advice you gave me but decided i'd try a shorter step and more dynamic movement while playing that day... every drive I threw that day went exactly where I was aiming and I was throwing just as far as I ever had before but on low laser lines and so much more consistently than i'd ever been able to before. It was awesome. Thanks to you guys, I looked like I was good at disc golf for a day.

but then, I got busy at work and had some family things come up and make life busy for the last couple weeks, and I never got out to the field to practice until the last few nights and I can not for the life of me get back that feeling that I had before. Its still more consistent than previously but not like that one day.

looking at my videos from tonight, I think I'm standing too upright again and something wonky is happening in my pull-through that is causing flutter and nose-up on the disc.

http://vid1161.photobucket.com/albu...e Uploads/20150913_183405_001_zpsfoipkhdr.mp4
Rhyno-245'

http://vid1161.photobucket.com/albu...e Uploads/20150913_190330_001_zpsfjyatirk.mp4
TeeBird-300'

http://vid1161.photobucket.com/albu...e Uploads/20150913_190419_001_zpsfcrzb1wn.mp4
Viking-320' (came out lots of flutter and anny)

http://vid1161.photobucket.com/albu...e Uploads/20150913_190459_001_zps1mr5jdxs.mp4
Tesla-305' (slight hyzer trying to compensate for previous throw)

http://vid1161.photobucket.com/albums/q514/clydesdale80/20150907_193830_001_zpsxsps2b6i.mp4
This last throw was from a couple nights ago and I was throwing flatter but had had less speed/distance.

soooo, what do you think? going from field work 2-3 nights a week to 2 weeks without touching a disc has screwed with me alot, I feel like I'm all over the place with timing and everything. any advice? thanks in advance.