Vibram Open 2012!

[jcrab66]

Not sure how else to do it on a national tour where you might not kill yourself to get across the country for a chance at getting 1000 instead of 600.

yeah except you are not just playing for the 400 diffference, you are playing for the event purse, its 6 events, the player with the most points should win, if only one player decides to play all 6 then why shouldnt they be rewarded for playing all of them, in the case of this year 2 of the ladies played them all and yet the one who played best in all 6 didnt win...

 

[patdb23]

... the player with the most points should win, if only one player decides to play all 6 then why shouldnt they be rewarded for playing all of them, in the case of this year 2 of the ladies played them all and yet the one who played best in all 6 didnt win...

The NT points winner is based on performance not endurance. As explained earlier, based on your position, you are saying that a player who plays six of the events finishing 5th in all events somehow outperforms a player that only plays five of the events while that player finished 1st in all five events.

Player A = five 1st place finishes = 500 points (5 * 100pts)
Player B = six 5th place finishes = 510 points (6 * 85pts)

Can you honestly tell me that Player B outperformed Player A? Player B never won an event, never finished in the top 4, never made it to a final 9, but because Player B played more events than Player A, then somehow that makes Player B the winner?

I'll take it one step further. In the past there have been 9 NT events in one year. Let's say for example:

Player A wins 8 events but didn't play one of the nine events.
Player A = 800 points (8 * 100pts)

Player B plays all nine events, finishing third in all of those events.
Player B = 819 points (9 * 91pts)

Again your position in this scenario is that Player B who has zero title wins, somehow outperforms Player A who has 8 title wins. You are weighing your position more towards a player's endurance than performance. How you can honestly say that a player who has 8 of 9 title wins is outperformed by a player with not one single win, not even one 2nd place finish?

Now, what you are really talking about is overall performance. And that is rewarded to the Player of the Year. But this award doesn't even take into account total score of all events played. I do understand your position, but I don't think you will find many, if any measurable amount, that will agree with it.

 

[elnino]

i don't get it looks like the math might be wrong and why is the tiebreaker the vibram and not the number of wins!!! for god sake what if val sat out the vibram open cuz she got hurt.....

Val got taken....I'm removing the vp from my bag.....stupid.

Val
The Memorial Championship 100
"Steady" Ed 95
Kansas City Wide Open 100
Beaver State Fling 91
Brent Hambrick Memorial 2nd 95
vibram 95
Cat
The Memorial Championship 95
"Steady" Ed 95
Kansas City Wide Open 91
Beaver State Fling 100
Brent Hambrick Memorial 4th place 88
Vibram 100

i don't see how val didn't win it.

 

[elnino]

top three of five....What lameness is that.....

looks like Cat wins but means nothing other than 400 bucks......

Val clearly is her main rival and is better in all but three events.

they should have split it.

 

[patdb23]

i don't get it looks like the math might be wrong and why is the tiebreaker the vibram and not the number of wins!!!... i don't see how val didn't win it.

http://www.pdga.com/national-tour

 

[patdb23]

i don't get it looks like the math might be wrong
Val
The Memorial Championship 100
"Steady" Ed 95
Kansas City Wide Open 100
Beaver State Fling 91
Brent Hambrick Memorial 2nd 95
vibram 95
Cat
The Memorial Championship 95
"Steady" Ed 95
Kansas City Wide Open 91
Beaver State Fling 100
Brent Hambrick Memorial 4th place 88
Vibram 100

Yes, your math is wrong. When player's tie in an event they receive the average points of those positions they are tied with. For example, both Val & Cat tied for the 2nd and 3rd position of the points awarded in the "Steady" Ed. 2nd position = 95 points, 3rd position = 91 points. Each player thus receives 93 points. If Val had outright took the 2nd position of the points and not tied Sarah in the Vibram Open, then Val would have received 95 points and she would have been the NT points winner.

 

[Halcón]

Didn't Val go like bogey-bogey-double bogey to end her last round at the Vibram?

I always root for her...that's a tough loss. IIRC, Sarah Hokum also played her last three holes poorly. Both her and Val were tied for the lead late in the last round.

Cat had an awesome year though. I look forward to the continued great play out of FPO.

 

[Dyoel182]

yeah except you are not just playing for the 400 diffference, you are playing for the event purse, its 6 events, the player with the most points should win, if only one player decides to play all 6 then why shouldnt they be rewarded for playing all of them, in the case of this year 2 of the ladies played them all and yet the one who played best in all 6 didnt win...

I can see where you're coming from but Val lost under the current rules this year. I followed her finish the other day and cringed when she didn't finish strong.

 

[jcrab66]

I can see where you're coming from but Val lost under the current rules this year. I followed her finish the other day and cringed when she didn't finish strong.

i agree, under the current system Cat won so congrats to her but the system is quite flawed. "We're sorry Mr Biffle, you dont win the Sprint Cup championship even though you had the most points because we dont count all the races" :wall:

 

[giles]

i agree, under the current system Cat won so congrats to her but the system is quite flawed. "We're sorry Mr Biffle, you dont win the Sprint Cup championship even though you had the most points because we dont count all the races" :wall:

You have a valid point but they all knew that all events wouldn't be counted before the season started...

 

[jcrab66]

The NT points winner is based on performance not endurance. As explained earlier, based on your position, you are saying that a player who plays six of the events finishing 5th in all events somehow outperforms a player that only plays five of the events while that player finished 1st in all five events.

Player A = five 1st place finishes = 500 points (5 * 100pts)
Player B = six 5th place finishes = 510 points (6 * 85pts)

Can you honestly tell me that Player B outperformed Player A? Player B never won an event, never finished in the top 4, never made it to a final 9, but because Player B played more events than Player A, then somehow that makes Player B the winner?

I'll take it one step further. In the past there have been 9 NT events in one year. Let's say for example:

Player A wins 8 events but didn't play one of the nine events.
Player A = 800 points (8 * 100pts)

Player B plays all nine events, finishing third in all of those events.
Player B = 819 points (9 * 91pts)

Again your position in this scenario is that Player B who has zero title wins, somehow outperforms Player A who has 8 title wins. You are weighing your position more towards a player's endurance than performance. How you can honestly say that a player who has 8 of 9 title wins is outperformed by a player with not one single win, not even one 2nd place finish?

Now, what you are really talking about is overall performance. And that is rewarded to the Player of the Year. But this award doesn't even take into account total score of all events played. I do understand your position, but I don't think you will find many, if any measurable amount, that will agree with it.

actually what i am saying is that both Val and Cat played all the events and Val scored more points but didnt win and thats pretty lame. You can come up with all the different scenarios you want but i dont see a problem with a system where if you want to have a chance to win a points series you have to play the most events AND do well at them. Thats the way most state points series work that i have seen and some of them have bigger payout then the $1000 NT winner gets. Really dude, you want to use "endurance" to describe playing in 6 tournaments over the course of 6 months or so? Take a look at other sports that use "series points" and see how they work. Really though your argument is moot here because Val and Cat both played all the events so all the events should be used to determine who wins

 

[Cgkdisc]

The best X out of Y events NT points system is more appropriate as it stands because we don't have a tour where the same players can play week in and week out like NASCAR or PGA. When there's enough money in the system for enough players to be able to afford to play a pro tour of 10-12 events, then you might consider overall performance. Even then, a best X out of Y system is still going to be better and more fair to allow players to miss a few events for whatever reasons, many times beyond their control. (I had nothing to do with the NT Points system. Just an observer but agree with the methodology.)

 

[Dana]

i don't get it looks like the math might be wrong and why is the tiebreaker the vibram and not the number of wins!!! for god sake what if val sat out the vibram open cuz she got hurt.....

Val got taken....I'm removing the vp from my bag.....stupid.

Val
The Memorial Championship 100
"Steady" Ed 95
Kansas City Wide Open 100
Beaver State Fling 91
Brent Hambrick Memorial 2nd 95
vibram 95
Cat
The Memorial Championship 95
"Steady" Ed 95
Kansas City Wide Open 91
Beaver State Fling 100
Brent Hambrick Memorial 4th place 88
Vibram 100

i don't see how val didn't win it.

You realize its not Vibram that made the points series rules, right?

 

[Dyoel182]

Really though your argument is moot here because Val and Cat both played all the events so all the events should be used to determine who wins

I actually agree with you on that and it should at least be one of the tie breakers. But they were both playing under the same rules from the start so even that is a moot point this year. When the PDGA (or someone like Visa) starts flying folks to events so they can all compete at every event they can drop that rule.

 

[The Hammer]

Funny to watch everyone get their chonies in a wad over something that doesn't have any affect on them.

 

[the_lung]

Funny to watch everyone get their chonies in a wad over something that doesn't have any affect on them.

^ Agreed.

The only thing I feel bad about is telling Catrina that she won the NT Points Series, only to be informed by Big Dog a few minutes later that the calculations were in doubt and that Val won, and having to go back out and break the bad news to Cat. And then it was reversed yet again. :doh:

 

[giles]

conversation and questions do not equal panties in a wad...

 

[PMcBeth]

Think about it like the super bowl.... Regular season doesn't mean anything... You give youself a chance to win but if you don't perform on the big stage you still lose right?

 

[Osmo]

conversation and questions do not equal panties in a wad...

 

[Osmo]

Think about it like the super bowl.... Regular season doesn't mean anything... You give youself a chance to win but if you don't perform on the big stage you still lose right?

:clap: