Help a beginner out please.

[skurf]

PLUS, the added bonus of throwing something harder and farther (even with less control) helps build muscle memory and muscles that the same thrower obviously lacks (as proven by the short distance).

Basically, I don't agree with anything you've written and it is the exact opposite of how anyone should go about approaching any sport, but I'm just going to reply to this one part since I don't feel like writing an essay. You mentioned muscle memory, but he'd actually be building incorrect muscle memory by throwing something way too fast for him. When he goes back and tries to throw drivers that are within his skill range he's going to over-torque them because his muscle memory is that of throwing a disc that is WAY too fast for him. Also, just because someone throws short doesn't mean they obviously lack muscles, it means they obviously lack proper form and technique. I've seen twig-men launch well over 400' drives and gym-rats lucky to reach 250'.

 

[JMONEY]

People that have the ultimate background experience tend to do real well and quickly too. Good luck

 

[simpletwist]

Not necessarily so. Case in point. I play a local course, Emery Park. The first hole is 934ft down a ski slope with a double dog leg. Its a par 5. Regardless of how anyone keeps score this IS a legitimate par 5 hole. I am not a long thrower by any stretch of the imagination. But by playing smart (read short, but in the fairway) I've made par.

 

[simpletwist]

this argument only works if you are playing a short distance.
if you are playing longer, the guy who is accurate @ 200 yards will add a shot to his "consistent play" everytime. He will always be +1 or more depending if he makes his play. Whereas, your son, will always have the potential to be -1,0 or +1 based on his play. Whats the worst thing that happens, he shanks, and takes the same 1 stroke that the old man took to get the same distance. (Same score count). The old man always beats you because he doesnt mess up and is consistent in all facets of his game, not just his drive. If you played doubles with him, and he used your drive for the distance, i bet he'd kill you based on the extra distance and same consistency factor. Distance matters.

In the short range, the difference of 25-50' can be an entirely different shot selection and or disc selection.
By odds and statistics, in the beginning and until you are good enough, longer is better.
That doesnt account for the "ego factor" that with the short throw, you look like you "suck" in comparison to your experienced friends. I think most would rather have errant throws with comparable distance verses a slow and steady approach.

Refute the logic....
Golf is a matter of distance and "penetration". Getting closer is almost always better. If my 2 shots equal your 3 shots, who wins? I might shank one and need an extra shot, but i am still @ 3.

And another thing, you seem to be contradicting yourself. Your first reply talked about just playing to have fun, but this reply talks about being competitive. :\

 

[skurf]

Which would be better for a beginner a Surge SS or Avenger SS ? Gonna order a BuzZz and one of those.

Neither, but if you had to choose one I'd go with the Avenger SS, although it's still going to be very hard to control. I would recommend to start with a fairway driver instead of a distance driver. My personal pick would be a JLS by Millennium. A Leopard is basically the same thing and would also work.

 

[waynewf]

djjeremiahj - I think your posts on this thread equate to some of the worse advice I've ever heard given when it comes to playing disc golf. One thing I learned long ago...even when you really feel strongly that you are correct, when the majority of the people around you are telling you that you're not, you may want to pause and reconsider your stance/philosophy.

I'm not trying to get into it with you or anything, but you seem very stubborn, very young, and your logic is horribly flawed. Hey, do what you want and spend your money however you like...but when giving advice to others, the most conservative approach is probably the best...especially this is a topic that has been hashed out dozens of times in these forums and your advice runs counter to the advice of nearly everyone on here...including those of us who have been playing for 10 plus years.

So you can keep pumping out your bad advice and wasting time, but realize that you being so far in the minority, most any reasonable person will disregard everything you say in the place of sound, measured, and logical advice.

 

[waynewf]

Neither, but if you had to choose one I'd go with the Avenger SS, although it's still going to be very hard to control. I would recommend to start with a fairway driver instead of a distance driver. My personal pick would be a JLS by Millennium. A Leopard is basically the same thing and would also work.

Agreed 100%.
The only complaint I've heard with Leopards is that some people don't like the thin rim. But it's a solid starter.

 

[waynewf]

this argument only works if you are playing a short distance.
if you are playing longer, the guy who is accurate @ 200 yards will add a shot to his "consistent play" everytime. He will always be +1 or more depending if he makes his play. Whereas, your son, will always have the potential to be -1,0 or +1 based on his play. Whats the worst thing that happens, he shanks, and takes the same 1 stroke that the old man took to get the same distance. (Same score count). The old man always beats you because he doesnt mess up and is consistent in all facets of his game, not just his drive. If you played doubles with him, and he used your drive for the distance, i bet he'd kill you based on the extra distance and same consistency factor. Distance matters.

In the short range, the difference of 25-50' can be an entirely different shot selection and or disc selection.
By odds and statistics, in the beginning and until you are good enough, longer is better.
That doesnt account for the "ego factor" that with the short throw, you look like you "suck" in comparison to your experienced friends. I think most would rather have errant throws with comparable distance verses a slow and steady approach.

Refute the logic....
Golf is a matter of distance and "penetration". Getting closer is almost always better. If my 2 shots equal your 3 shots, who wins? I might shank one and need an extra shot, but i am still @ 3.

Your logic totally falls apart here. If you're talking about adding 50 feet of distance, at the sake of accuracy and technique, then how can you possibly say that you will have an easier time making par on a 500 foot hole then someone who throws accurately 50 feet less. In my mind, that inaccuracy you get with your extra 50 feet of distance, means that the extra distance may not have actually taken you closer to the hole, which will probably cause you an additional shot yourself to get into putting range....Plus, unless the hole is completely open, forget about it. I've thrown holes so tight that 5 feet to the left or right is going to cost you 2 strokes messing around with trees...
Driving is just for show man....just for show....

 

[skurf]

this argument only works if you are playing a short distance.
if you are playing longer, the guy who is accurate @ 200 yards will add a shot to his "consistent play" everytime. He will always be +1 or more depending if he makes his play. Whereas, your son, will always have the potential to be -1,0 or +1 based on his play. Whats the worst thing that happens, he shanks, and takes the same 1 stroke that the old man took to get the same distance. (Same score count). The old man always beats you because he doesnt mess up and is consistent in all facets of his game, not just his drive. If you played doubles with him, and he used your drive for the distance, i bet he'd kill you based on the extra distance and same consistency factor. Distance matters.

In the short range, the difference of 25-50' can be an entirely different shot selection and or disc selection.
By odds and statistics, in the beginning and until you are good enough, longer is better.
That doesnt account for the "ego factor" that with the short throw, you look like you "suck" in comparison to your experienced friends. I think most would rather have errant throws with comparable distance verses a slow and steady approach.

Refute the logic....
Golf is a matter of distance and "penetration". Getting closer is almost always better. If my 2 shots equal your 3 shots, who wins? I might shank one and need an extra shot, but i am still @ 3.

Distance matters, but what you're suggesting will actually limit their overall potential distance. You're way too concerned about adding instant distance when the goal is to add consistent distance. Someone might get an extra 20' by throwing a Katana, which honestly if they're throwing less than 250' I don't even think that's true, much less adding 50' instantly. Basically, every fast distance driver is going to act the same when throwing at that distance because none of them will ever go fast enough to reach their "gliding point." Within a month or two of practicing proper form a person throwing under 250' should be able to increase their distance by at least that much, if not more, AND they are going to have more control over the discs they're using since they won't have to over-torque them to get them to go straight.

 

[ERicJ]

this argument only works if you are playing a short distance.
if you are playing longer, the guy who is accurate @ 200 yards will add a shot to his "consistent play" everytime. He will always be +1 or more depending if he makes his play. Whereas, your son, will always have the potential to be -1,0 or +1 based on his play. Whats the worst thing that happens, he shanks, and takes the same 1 stroke that the old man took to get the same distance. (Same score count).

One of the flaws in this thinking is that a shanked drive will yield only a one stroke "penalty" to make it up. If that were true I and many other players would be going for broke on just about every tee shot. But it's not true. Often a poor drive leaves you in the rough/woods/water/OB and you're taking at least two or more strokes to recover. Especially at lower skill levels.

Everyone's heard the old expression "drive for show, putt for dough".

It sounds like you're advocating the ego boost that comes from throwing as far as your buddies. Whereas many here are advocating disc choices that will facilitate the ego boost that comes from writing a lower score total than your buddies on the card at the end of the round.

 

[kcplease]

to answer the surge ss avenger ss question, avoid the surge. I wish I would've avoided the wraith (surge's innova counterpart) until i threw over 320'. Avenger ss is gonna be nice for you.

 

[BrotherDave]

I'm staying out of the DG philosophy debate.

OP: Here's what I would do. I'm guessing you play some pretty wooded course hence your friends' hate-on for DX plastic, so I'd keep the Aviar and Mako, snag a ESP Buzzz and either a Stalker or a Leopard AND NO OTHER DRIVERS FASTER THAN THAT. DX is good for seasoned pros and cheaper but if you are gonna hit more trees than not I'd stay away from it honestly at first. Once you get some accuracy and learn to thread through the forest try the DX/pro D stuff out. If the Aviar fades too much on you try an APX/Reef, Soft Banger GT, or a Magic.

 

[Technohic]

YOu are going to outgrow discs pretty fast so I would say just get a Leopard and go from there until you get about 250', then get a Teebird.

 

[Roc1Time]

I think that a buzz will be a waist because the mako that you already have. Im not hating on it but my Discrap buds say the same thing. I think that a TL and or a Leopard will be a must as well. Try out different putters as well. If you want Gateway putters call Dave and you can get a box of xouts for cheap and try out all of gateways putters. Other then that try a Play it Again and hit up the used bin. You can get alot of plastic for cheap and if you dont like if you can use it for trade bait.

 

[Steal Your Face]

Yeah actually i just called one of my buds to see if he had some old disc, jsut anything to use or to trade with, well he needed money bad so i gave him tenbucks for a :

New Champion Beast (Unknown gram)
New Champion Valkyrie 150g
Used Star Valkyrie (unknown gram)
New Champion Monster 172g
Used Champion Sidewinder 175g
New Champion Panther 170g
Used DX Roc 175g

What should i keep and what should i trade?

 

[Roc1Time]

Try it all. If you dont like stuff get rid of it. Dont get rid of it until you know you dont want it. Throw it all more then just a couple times. Go out to a field and try it over and over then make your mind up.

 

[BrotherDave]

New Champion Beast (Unknown gram) Keep for later
New Champion Valkyrie 150g trade
Used Star Valkyrie (unknown gram) keep
New Champion Monster 172g TRADE
Used Champion Sidewinder 175g Keep and try a lot
New Champion Panther 170g Keep unless your Mako is definitively better
Used DX Roc 175g Throw, throw, and throw some more



My 2 cents

 

[waynewf]

Heck yeah! Keep them all and have some fun with them. If you don't like something, stow it away until later when you get better or maybe to give out to a noob yourself one day...

 

[discjon]

Start with mids and putters, for sure.
And buy a few discs and LEARN them, like people have been saying.

I kick myself in the butt every time I play for buying so much plastic the first few months of playing.

 

[shoe59]

New Champion Beast (Unknown gram)
New Champion Valkyrie 150g
Used Star Valkyrie (unknown gram)
New Champion Monster 172g
Used Champion Sidewinder 175g
New Champion Panther 170g
Used DX Roc 175g

Very Nice! I agree with everyone who said use a couple discs and learn them before you go off buying fancy looking plastic. Don't take out more than one putter or one midrange -- use one of each and make them work for all the shots you need.

If I were you I'd take your 2 mids (mako and aviar), the used star valk, and maybe the lightweight valk. The valkyrie will be fine as a driver for starters, and with two of them you can learn the difference between light and heavy discs.

You got a great deal by the way!! (you already knew that). Beast and sidewinder are both solid drivers, hell you're 19 you might be able to throw them just fine already.... but like others said it's best to work up to the "bigger" (faster) drivers. The monster is a very overstable (hard curving) disc, you might find a use for it though.