BillyJackO's Form Adventure*

[sidewinder22]

So close. It's your balance or lack of balance on your rear leg that restricts your backswing and slows your weightshift.

 

[UhhNegative]

Dat power pocket. Nice!

 

[billyjacko]

One more from the side for good measure.

 

[sidewinder22]

Need to hop more over your left leg while still looking targetward and upright and then turn back inside or forward or in front of the rear foot. You are reaching over downward(rather than swinging back upright) and your shoulder and elbow are going more upward during the swing instead of longer forward. You can see how much taller and more upright Markus is starting the stride hopping over the rear leg and looking forward and then turns back and drops upright all the way into plant with shoulders and elbow making a longer swing forward more horizontally. Also note how his left shoulder and elbow are closer to target/center at the plant.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vhQzVIX4cVs&t=25s

 

[billyjacko]

So close. It's your balance or lack of balance on your rear leg that restricts your backswing and slows your weightshift.

Yup, IDK exactly what happened over the last few days, but my reach back is timed much more like it should be. I'm getting my hip turned back in the x-step and it's allowing me to get my shoulders to turn back in front of my rear leg, in turn reaching back further in balance. I'm feeling the tilted spiral in a way I never have. It's like I'm ahead of myself holding my spine, planting it in the ground and in an instant ripping it target ward, slingshotting the pendulum forward. It's hard to explain, but the feeling you get when you suddenly feel the weight of the disc at the top of the reach back, except with my center of gravity. It doesn't feel difficult or forced at all.

This isn't the greatest example here as I'm trying to not hit my the stuff in front of me, and for whatever reason when I don't have the weight of the disc in my hand I seem to pin my upper arm to my chest, which isn't there while throwing. Need to get some shots filmed.

 

[sidewinder22]

Backswing is looking better. Need to swing your shoulder forward lower closed and heavier like a battering ram into a door or wall after hips go through wall/door from hershyzer. Your shoulder is going up and open and hugging yourself as soon as you plant heel.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gOY4R_iNxF8&t=5m

 

[billyjacko]

That actually makes a ton of sense. I think it would help keep the disc down more near my chest with more room to swing outward pressing against the ground rather than just rotating around the heel.

 

[billyjacko]

I legitimately believe I've had a breakthrough over the last few weeks. The change in footwork has allowed me to feel my weight ahead of me a bit better, but now I'm figuring out how to turn back into position where the left side feels super connected and powerful. Instead of feeling like I'm pivoting or swiveling the hips, I feel like I'm doing a squat or exploding straight up with the rear leg. It's one of the first times I've seen the squeezed knee/rear hip rotation going into the plant/at the weight shift rather than after.

The difference is feeling a type of weightlessness in the back swing where the lead/right side feels completely neutral going into the plant, and the rear side feels loaded and ready to go. It's the instant when the shoulders turn past 90 degrees around the spine, but it tells me, "push" and the disc is just exploding out. It's weird because I feel the rotation around the spine more distinctly, but the action feels more linear. Like a clothesline on pulleys the left and right side running parallel around a circle.

I see I'm not getting the forward tilt at all, but I'll take what I can get right now.

Angle is a little crooked here.

 

[sidewinder22]

IDK, I guess the backswing looks better, but I don't think you are focused on the right thing... landing balanced and swinging on the front leg properly. Your CoG is too far behind to the right of your front heel, so have no space to swing thru over hip/knee and lose pressure on front toes too early(looking from camera behind tee).

Still looks like your front shoulder is popping up like Mike Demos below instead of swinging it forward on front leg like battering ram. Your rear foot appears to be going around to the left tee side instead of right tee side behind front leg when leaving the ground. Like you are trying to push over to the left too much or rotate instead of moving forward.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gOY4R_iNxF8&t=5m

Side note - were you throwing at the Black Course march 30?

Erin has battering rammed the front shoulder forward over the front hip/knee, and note how rear shoulder is forward of rear knee.

 

[billyjacko]

IDK, I guess the backswing looks better, but I don't think you are focused on the right thing... landing balanced and swinging on the front leg properly. Your CoG is too far behind to the right of your front heel, so have no space to swing thru over hip/knee and lose pressure on front toes too early(looking from camera behind tee).

Something I've always struggle with, but seems to be getting closer as I'm releasing the disc with my foot still pointed perpendicular of the teepad, just not planted bushing against it like you see every pro do. The disc are coming out faster with way less effort than ever when I've been at these distances, but still not pushing to the next tier of D.

Side note - were you throwing at the Black Course march 30?

Yup, have you played the new White course out there? It's my favorite course in the mid Ohio valley area (Forked Run is further south, but it's a great one too). I played back to back rounds White then Black course. I was whipped afterwards. That shot in particular was after both rounds, and not a particular good example of how I'm throwing right now. I still haven't got any good throws on film.

 

[sidewinder22]

Just stand up in fairly neutral standing stance(slightly stagger closed) and don't think about swinging. Put your front toes/instep on the ground and push your heel up and away from target, and then press your heel/CoG forward into the ground. You can do this with the front foot pointed slightly open targetward. The heel doesn't have to go land forward of toes, the heel just needs to be driven forward/targetward while toes are on ground, instead of coming straight down flat footed or spinning/backing away from target.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GxnhM5amro0#t=1m14s

Note how your front femur is more externally rotated, while Erin's femur is more internally rotated. The less you stagger closed going into the plant or more inline you stride, the easier it is to internally rotate and keep the foot/leg(both feet/legs) swinging underneath the pelvis nice and balanced. When you step over to the left staggering more closed it tends to externally rotate the femur and open up early because that is how you catch yourself off balance. It also moves your body into your swing path instead of keeping out of the way of it. Simon is a freak of nature with crazy balance and flexibility.

I have not played the White course. It's been about 8 years since I was there. Played the Black course with Paul and bunch of locals and guy from Timberdoodle, good times.

 

[billyjacko]

Made a quick video of the home course. Figured I'd share it here.

 

[sidewinder22]

Nice!

Kind of reminds me of Pat Pitts. Try keeping the arm/disc more vertical/inside in backswing and striding more left to right/feet out of the way, knees don't need to crossover.

 

[billyjacko]

That makes sense. I can see how far my x-step and reach back has come, but there are still glaring flaws holding my distance potential back. I can see how his more in-line x-step and plant allows him to engage his hips about 5 frames before me.

It's come a long ways, though. The 10' run up and disc dragging behind for half of it makes my brain hurt.

 

[billyjacko]

Just posting here to make sure I start overthinking my form again since I'm throwing further with more accuracy than ever.

 

[sidewinder22]

You crazy... socks on wood deck.

Looks like you don't really get balanced/leveraged on rear leg/hip depth/buttwipe and end up landing more stuck between your feet instead of moving from true one foot balance to other foot balance. Your front foot should be more stable balanced closer to toes rather than behind your heel.

Try walking perpendicular to target back and forth so your legs are more inline like normal walk instead of lateral split. Feel how your balances moves over the feet/legs perpendicular to target.
https://www.dgcoursereview.com/forums/showthread.php?t=136487

Instead of Simon Syndrome moving too diagonal staggered closed, try striding the opposite diagonal direction into plant and turn back front side and landing more pressure toes first and moving to right to heel. Your pressure is too much on rear toes and front heel and moving left toward toes, instead of spreading/rolling that pressure balanced through the foot/feet.

 

[billyjacko]

It's winter time, and you know what that means?!?! TOWELL TIMEEEE. I'm concentrating on staying wide and working on pumping my left hand toward the target paced with my rear foot a la battering ram (picked this up from watching all of Ezra's youtube vids). It's made it much easier to feel the super late acceleration, and it's matched with what I'm seeing in the vidja.


OLD

 

[UhhNegative]

Timing on off arm on the OLD looks better than the x-step to me. Off-arm looks a little passive on the x-step in comparison. But I mean... you've got a great throw now I was so scared for your arm hitting the wall on the x-step.

 

[billyjacko]

Timing on off arm on the OLD looks better than the x-step to me. Off-arm looks a little passive on the x-step in comparison. But I mean... you've got a great throw now I was so scared for your arm hitting the wall on the x-step.

Ya, hard to go full bore inside. I smacked a chair inside a few months ago and thought I broke my hand.

I've learned the off arm has a lot less to do with distant potential. There's a few dudes I play with in Austin that have no off-side counter and throw 450-500+.

Here's one of them.

 

[sidewinder22]

Not bad for a towel. OLD looks like your shin remains angled \ to the left, instead of going vertical or / to the right, so you are too over your toes. Shift/walk back to the right tee in OLD to the rear foot.