The average hole length there is over 650 feet. That doesn't really sound like all that much fun if there's no obstacles, why not just throw in an open field?
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Disc and Ball on the same course?
- Thread starter ralbrecht
- Start date
If golfers want exclusivity they can join an exclusive club.
MikePinchico
Double Eagle Member
Lava Creek in Paradise CA is a nine hole ball golf with 18 disc golf holes
- Joined
- Dec 19, 2009
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- 6,841
Probably the best answer is that it CAN work. No one can say for certain whether it will work at any given golf course. However, the cost of adding disc golf is so cheap, and the payback so quick, that for many ball golf courses it makes sense to go ahead and try the experiment.
That's the approach we're taking with Wirth Par 3 and Fort Snelling. Nobody is really sure if it will work. If it doesn't, then the Minneapolis Park and Recreation Board will just have to find someplace else to install 36 King Pins. What a problem to have!
I think most ball golf courses are not good candidates for disc golf. Probably about one in four could add disc golf, at most. Since there are 16,000 golf courses, that would more than double the number of disc golf courses! And let's face it: even the smallest, most run-down golf course is a lot bigger and better maintained than almost any park.
Good candidates would be those that need extra revenue, aren't busy all the time, don't have really serious golfers, are shorter, are publicly owned, and have not submitted to the relentless demands by golfers to remove every tree or patch of long grass that ever gave them any trouble.
The design of the disc golf course can make or break it too. As many people have commented, it's no fun to just throw real far again and again.
For that reason, and to try to slow down the disc golfers to better match the pace of golfers, I put two disc golf holes per golf hole. At Fort Snelling, that still resulted in the longest 18-hole disc golf course in the Twin Cities, I think. That actually surprised me when I added up the numbers; it doesn't "feel" long and open. Probably because most players will hit a tree on almost every hole, and there are plenty of short holes. Or maybe because you can use a cart.
(Shameless plug.) I have a pamphlet about adding disc golf to a golf course. If anyone has a course they'd like me to contact, just let me know. Use the contact information at www.stevewestdiscgolf.com.
That's the approach we're taking with Wirth Par 3 and Fort Snelling. Nobody is really sure if it will work. If it doesn't, then the Minneapolis Park and Recreation Board will just have to find someplace else to install 36 King Pins. What a problem to have!
I think most ball golf courses are not good candidates for disc golf. Probably about one in four could add disc golf, at most. Since there are 16,000 golf courses, that would more than double the number of disc golf courses! And let's face it: even the smallest, most run-down golf course is a lot bigger and better maintained than almost any park.
Good candidates would be those that need extra revenue, aren't busy all the time, don't have really serious golfers, are shorter, are publicly owned, and have not submitted to the relentless demands by golfers to remove every tree or patch of long grass that ever gave them any trouble.
The design of the disc golf course can make or break it too. As many people have commented, it's no fun to just throw real far again and again.
For that reason, and to try to slow down the disc golfers to better match the pace of golfers, I put two disc golf holes per golf hole. At Fort Snelling, that still resulted in the longest 18-hole disc golf course in the Twin Cities, I think. That actually surprised me when I added up the numbers; it doesn't "feel" long and open. Probably because most players will hit a tree on almost every hole, and there are plenty of short holes. Or maybe because you can use a cart.
(Shameless plug.) I have a pamphlet about adding disc golf to a golf course. If anyone has a course they'd like me to contact, just let me know. Use the contact information at www.stevewestdiscgolf.com.
I love this, it really adds the D to the holes. Long holes that use lots of OB to force a landing zone, YES PLEASE. I grew up playing ball golf, got to check out disc golf in 1994 but after a few months it was back to the ball and stick for me. When tees courses are done and manage to have a few tight drives and fairways with at lease 2 tough mando or tunnel shots you've got a winner. I have been lucky enough to play on courses that were once ball and now are disc and the other way around. A well done course is a well done course.
leftyone
Birdie Member
I actually played tupelo bay in garden city sc last week at their ball/disc course and here is what i noticed. Most holes 7 out of 9 favored a right hand thrower, basket was on the left side of the green and plenty of obsticles on the right. so the design wasnt something I enjoyed. But the thing I didn't like most was the amount of waiting i did at every tee for the group infront of me to finish. I only played 9 holes and the 3 groups infront of me did let me play through but there was still more waiting than i prefer. If i was playing with a group of 3 or more it might have been made the time factor a little different.
maansmit
Double Eagle Member
There is a combined course in Trafalgar, IN (18 DG holes on a 9 hole ball course). I haven't played yet but will soon if it ever stops raining.
The current highest rated course in the state of Indiana is on a ball golf course:
http://www.dgcoursereview.com/course.php?id=2741
I played it once last summer and had a blast. Plan on getting back there in early June if not sooner.
And it's funny that the ball golfers were worried about disc golfers slowing them down. Throwers play at light speed in comparison to bolfers.
http://www.dgcoursereview.com/course.php?id=2741
I played it once last summer and had a blast. Plan on getting back there in early June if not sooner.
And it's funny that the ball golfers were worried about disc golfers slowing them down. Throwers play at light speed in comparison to bolfers.
garublador
* Ace Member *
I think it could lead to a really symbiotic relationship between ball and disc golf if done properly. I know a lot more people that enjoy ball golfing than disc golfing and I'd love to go out and play in a mixed group. Even if the course isn't as interesting as a disc golf course, getting to hang out with friends that you don't normally get to see in that type of situation would be fun. I can't be alone on this, either.
I'd think that you'd get more disc golfers interested in ball golf (or at least paying to play on ball golf courses) and more ball golfers interested in disc golf. Unless you play both you probably don't understand the advantages of both. Disc golfers will get to appreciate the amenities of the courses and just how hard it is to play ball golf and ball golfers get to see how laid back disc golf is and appreciate the variety of shots and lines you can get with a disc.
I'm not sure it's something I'd pay to do by myself or with other disc golfers that often, though, which seems to be how most people think when they consider playing disc golf on a ball golf course.
I'd think that you'd get more disc golfers interested in ball golf (or at least paying to play on ball golf courses) and more ball golfers interested in disc golf. Unless you play both you probably don't understand the advantages of both. Disc golfers will get to appreciate the amenities of the courses and just how hard it is to play ball golf and ball golfers get to see how laid back disc golf is and appreciate the variety of shots and lines you can get with a disc.
I'm not sure it's something I'd pay to do by myself or with other disc golfers that often, though, which seems to be how most people think when they consider playing disc golf on a ball golf course.
Technohic
* Ace Member *
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- Jul 27, 2009
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- 8,517
I have absolutely no interest in playing a course that is as wide open as a ball golf course. That being said; I have seen ball golf courses with good patches of trees and hills mixed in around the OB area so if someone could cleverly arrange the disc golf course to make use of that rather than just stick to the ball golf fairway, it could be interesting.
There are a lot of golf courses around that I could see a disc course on the same property, but not on the same course. And that's where so often it doesn't work so well -- disc golf and ball golf have totally different hazards and obstacles (except for water, of course). It's going to take some creative design to make the disc golf challenging.
JoshEpoo
* Ace Member *
It's a novel idea. In a perfect world, I could see some really bad ass setups. I used to play a lot of golf but paying 40$ a round to play a decent course and another 50$ for food and booze every weekend isn't in the budget anymore.
A disc/ball complex would really have to meet in a weird middle ground where the golf course is crappy but the disc course is sweet to give both players a sense of value if you expect them to pay even close to the same thing.
A disc/ball complex would really have to meet in a weird middle ground where the golf course is crappy but the disc course is sweet to give both players a sense of value if you expect them to pay even close to the same thing.
^You guys are talking as if they don't already exist. Guess what, they do! And it works great! And we are not talking about high quality courses here, either. They are typically set up on blue collar golf courses where the greens fee never exceeds $20. Additionally, they usually charge about half the price for DG.
Other 'you may not have known' facts:
-All ball golf courses I have played disc on play the putting green OB, so there is a big, round OB on every hole.
-They also play bunkers OB, so that adds to the fun as well.
-Some courses have exclusive DG tees off to the side, often wooded a bit for line shaping.
-The pins are usually off to the side and shorter than the bolf hole since we typically use shorter distances. Sometimes, they are behind the hole, which creates a small 'lake' right in front.
-They sell beer right there on the course! Once again, these are blue collar courses so they rarely exceed $5 a piece.
I have played on ball golf courses quite a few times and the vibe is way cool. It gives you a little more self respect knowing your sport CAN be taken seriously, instead of finding yourself in a situation skipping a hole because children are playing hide-and-seek in the middle of your sporting field.
Other 'you may not have known' facts:
-All ball golf courses I have played disc on play the putting green OB, so there is a big, round OB on every hole.
-They also play bunkers OB, so that adds to the fun as well.
-Some courses have exclusive DG tees off to the side, often wooded a bit for line shaping.
-The pins are usually off to the side and shorter than the bolf hole since we typically use shorter distances. Sometimes, they are behind the hole, which creates a small 'lake' right in front.
-They sell beer right there on the course! Once again, these are blue collar courses so they rarely exceed $5 a piece.
I have played on ball golf courses quite a few times and the vibe is way cool. It gives you a little more self respect knowing your sport CAN be taken seriously, instead of finding yourself in a situation skipping a hole because children are playing hide-and-seek in the middle of your sporting field.
JoshEpoo
* Ace Member *
I don't think you're going to get much more respect playing the dregs of the ball golf courses than playing a pay to play disc course. The flow of play and quality of the property is right up there with good golf courses at good P2P disc courses.
If anything most golfers would not consider paying the sub $20 greens fees out there for a crappy round of golf, but may consider playing a nice disc course that already serves cheap[er] beer (ex-BRP). That being said, I do think it's possible to integrate the two in a manner that works well for both sides, just very very tricky, and difficult to work out the finances since there is such a large disparity between the price of even a bad round of golf and a fantastic round of disc at the existing facilities out there.
Playing bunkers and greens as OB is about as fun as roping off an area and calling it OB. It adds to the challenge, but not the fun and doesn't really make for pretty scenery like a river/lake/drop off/heavily wooded area does.
^Ok, negative nancy!
It still sounds like you don't even WANT it to work. You keep saying its tricky, but there are courses that have been doing it for years and everything is a-ok. I don't understand what is so tricky about it. The golfers think its a little weird at first, and then they get over it.
Also, these disc golf on ball golf courses are not the only courses out there. Sometimes I feel like playing a wooded course, and sometimes I like playing a wide open course with silly fake OB's and a golf cart.
It still sounds like you don't even WANT it to work. You keep saying its tricky, but there are courses that have been doing it for years and everything is a-ok. I don't understand what is so tricky about it. The golfers think its a little weird at first, and then they get over it.
Also, these disc golf on ball golf courses are not the only courses out there. Sometimes I feel like playing a wooded course, and sometimes I like playing a wide open course with silly fake OB's and a golf cart.
JoshEpoo
* Ace Member *
I like the idea I just haven't seen it done. I live in the twin cities, which has a pretty good disc community, where we already have 6 or 7 high caliber pay to play disc courses and a bunch of solid free courses, and never even heard about the courses that Steve got put in last year on ball golf courses here, so I will have to check em out. I'm curious how the pay structure works at the courses out there already and how the quality of disc holds up against all the other 4+ star courses in my area.
Playing bunkers and greens as OB is about as fun as roping off an area and calling it OB. It adds to the challenge, but not the fun and doesn't really make for pretty scenery like a river/lake/drop off/heavily wooded area does.[/QUOTE]
The greens and sand traps are OB so we don't throw our discs onto and slice up the greens, or walk all over the sand traps and not rake them smooth for the ball golfers. More course maintenance than challenge. There's enough idiot ball golfers that don't fix their ball marks on the greens or rake their traps that we don't need to contribute. Emerald Isle (RIP) in Ocenaside, CA had greens and traps in front of a lot of baskets and there was a lot of damage to the greens. Mission Trails (again RIP) San Diego, didn't, so a much faster smoother flow. (10 disc golfer groups backed up on hole 10 during their tournament). Sun Valley in San Diego has some baskets behind greens but most are reachable by most players, so not too much damage. I play a lot of ball golf and am pissed at the inconsideration ball golfers have for their own responsibilities about cleaning up ball marks and raking. The game is hard enough! One very cool thing about playing on a mowed fairway is a roller goes forever!!!
The greens and sand traps are OB so we don't throw our discs onto and slice up the greens, or walk all over the sand traps and not rake them smooth for the ball golfers. More course maintenance than challenge. There's enough idiot ball golfers that don't fix their ball marks on the greens or rake their traps that we don't need to contribute. Emerald Isle (RIP) in Ocenaside, CA had greens and traps in front of a lot of baskets and there was a lot of damage to the greens. Mission Trails (again RIP) San Diego, didn't, so a much faster smoother flow. (10 disc golfer groups backed up on hole 10 during their tournament). Sun Valley in San Diego has some baskets behind greens but most are reachable by most players, so not too much damage. I play a lot of ball golf and am pissed at the inconsideration ball golfers have for their own responsibilities about cleaning up ball marks and raking. The game is hard enough! One very cool thing about playing on a mowed fairway is a roller goes forever!!!
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I don't like the idea of using the green as out-of-bounds that would come into play a lot. First, because it could hurt the green, and second, because it's too "yellow-rope" for me. Most of the holes on my courses have the basket short of the green (actually, half are nowhere near the green). For the few holes where the basket is long, the green should be easily avoided.
As for sand bunkers, I make them buncrs. If the disc lands in the sand, it magically slides directly away from the basket to the grass on the far side of the bunker, no penalty. I did this because I wanted to put baskets right in front of the sand. That way, if a ball hits the basket, the golfer will be happy that the shot was saved from the bunker (in theory, but are golfers ever happy?). And, as we all know, OB directly behind the basket just isn't right.
As for sand bunkers, I make them buncrs. If the disc lands in the sand, it magically slides directly away from the basket to the grass on the far side of the bunker, no penalty. I did this because I wanted to put baskets right in front of the sand. That way, if a ball hits the basket, the golfer will be happy that the shot was saved from the bunker (in theory, but are golfers ever happy?). And, as we all know, OB directly behind the basket just isn't right.
^I agree, except about playing the greens ob 'hurting the green.' The only reason they play them OB is BECAUSE discs hurt the green, therefore, they are OB. The only course out here where that comes into play is the worst of the 3 'DOBG' courses (lol) in the area. Whenever we have played it, though, has been at night, and our discs have always slid to the other end of the green pretty effortlessly. So, no penalties for us!
The night-play is the only real draw to this place. Baskets, lots of grass, and really good lights.
The night-play is the only real draw to this place. Baskets, lots of grass, and really good lights.
slimshadyemb
Birdie Member
ummm... math = fail. 400 yard hole = 1200 ft. 376 yd hole DOES NOT EQUAL almost 1500ft. Careful with the number keys on your keyboard. 1 yd = 3 ft.
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