"Disc Golf Not as Green as it seems"

[BogeyNoMore]

Ken has a friend. Ken's friend stretches truths and exaggerates just as much as Ken does.

Oh wait...

It's obvious to all of us that disc golf continues to grow in popularity, but history will prove how environmentally destructive it is. Many disc golf courses are slowly evolving from lush landscapes to much more barren spaces, where grass is replaced with mulch and trees have to be protected by fences. The change is slow, making some people think the damage in minimal or forgivable. But over time even the strongest trees will succumb to the constant assault to it's protective outer layers.

...he flat out makes things up too!

As much as I hate to admit it, everything in that quote is true. As Craftsman points out, it's a matter of having enough courses to handle the traffic.

My local course is likely the busiest in the state.
It has all of the problems that ken fears.

Imo, the problem isnt the course, its the lack of near by courses.
Dg will continue to grow and without multiple courses the lonely courses will take a beating.

Benton Hills and has taken a bad beating, and Kensington was even worse prior to pay to play. Even now, the new Kensington shows signs of wear and tear, but at least the park has been keeping up mulch and maintenance (probably because the fees make it economically self suffucient).

As the sport continues to gain popularity, existing courses will suffer if new courses aren't created. Perhaps that's an arguement for putting in a new course - easing some of the traffic on neighboring courses so they nature can keep up with the traffic. Hudson Mills seems to be aging quite well. I attribute it to:

- located further from large population than Kensington and Benton Hills = less traffic.
- the traffic it does see is spread over two 24 hole courses.
- large courses mean not everyone plays both courses everytime they visit, I often only have time for one round 24 hole round.
- course is well maintained.

FWIW - I advocate the use of logs, railroad ties, etc. on slopes and mounds to retain soil and negate erosion. I saw this technique sucessfully employed on several of the rollaway greens in the Charlotte area, and I can see how it really helps the hole retain the characteristics the designer intended over time, as the grass around the basket wears away (as it invariably does over time), exposing the soil, and leading to erosion.

Another thing I noticed is how much tougher it is on some courses when we play when the ground is still really saturated and soft; grass gets torn away much easier. Once that happens and the soil is exposed, it really accelerates erosion, as there's nothing to hold the soil in place.

 

[JTacoma03]

I was referencing the ridiculous hyperbole of "lush landscapes to barren spaces"

Most disc golf courses are on land that nobody wants anyway. There are a few exceptions, but we're already relegated to building on the dregs of available park-space and now these fools want to claim that we're somehow endangering others park experience as well as the environment...

These two are the O'Reilly and Hannity of misguided environmentalism.

 

[GRidge]

I was referencing the ridiculous hyperbole of "lush landscapes to barren spaces"

Most disc golf courses are on land that nobody wants anyway.

This is exactly what I was thinking. My home course is in a metro park that started when the farm land its on lost its fertility, no one else would want the land for any purpose.

 

[steady1]

Get over it CA. Man and nature are at odds. Maybe better planning. Lets add much more exhaust and asphalt to the natural world.

 

[Grungedude42]

I never understood the argument to begin with. "Not as green as it seems"? Who's out there claiming each course is Bambi's thicket, with Disney songbirds breaking out in chorus serving as backdrop to your profanity laced rants as you clank birdie putts off the chastity belt? It's exactly as "green" as I'd expect. Concrete tee pads, alternate baskets, with the common sense to avoid the habitats of endangered species and avoid major erosion and essential undergrowth damage should be enough to minimize environmental impact. It's not as green as a forest with only deer paths to navigate, but it's a damn sight better than a skate park. If a park board decides to develop a section of a park, they can do worse than a disc golf course. It goes without saying that leaving it undeveloped is "better for the environment". Willing to bet a paved walking path (or crushed stone) is more impact in most cases, though.

 

[Peterb]

As predicted, these folks are going after Pinto Lake, and Dela will be next. GGP will be in their sights especially if they're successful.

 

[texhop58]

As predicted, these folks are going after Pinto Lake, and Dela will be next. GGP will be in their sights especially if they're successful.

And this is why I did, and suggested others contact pdga. People like this don't go away, and I bet there will be more courses at stake. Remember your course could be next

 

[Peterb]

what's the PDGA going to do? This is not an issue they have any jurisdiction nor control over.

 

[texhop58]

Special interest. First we both read their website. It was awfully harsh on disc golf effects. It gives disc golf a black eye. Second if multiple courses shut down, it affects new players and old players having no place to play. Plus they don't want this to be a rolling problem where it's one course, then two, then 10.

 

[Peterb]

Special interest. First we both read their website. It was awfully harsh on disc golf effects. It gives disc golf a black eye. Second if multiple courses shut down, it affects new players and old players having no place to play. Plus they don't want this to be a rolling problem where it's one course, then two, then 10.

That's a real possibility. The only thing that can prevent it is some super activism by disc golfers.

 

[onemilemore]

What grounds can they try to get Dela pulled on? It's a well-established, PAY course...

 

[JTacoma03]

Get over it CA. Man and nature are at odds. Maybe better planning. Lets add much more exhaust and asphalt to the natural world.

Why are you calling out california/californians? Seems like a broad generalization, especially when the best disc golfers come from there (here)...

...I still can only half-identify, lol.

 

[JTacoma03]

As predicted, these folks are going after Pinto Lake, and Dela will be next. GGP will be in their sights especially if they're successful.

These fools can't get either of those courses pulled, lol. The parks department will laugh them out of the building.

DeLa used to be a landfill, I'd love to see them argue about natural habitats there.

 

[Peterb]

These fools can't get either of those courses pulled, lol. The parks department will laugh them out of the building.

DeLa used to be a landfill, I'd love to see them argue about natural habitats there.

I wouldn't be so sure about it. These folks are dedicated, knowledgable, and should NOT be underestimated. I've said it many times, I'll say it again: disc golf is going to be scrutinized as it expands and more people play, especially here in Northern California where there are so many people who value public lands.

 

[Peterb]

What grounds can they try to get Dela pulled on? It's a well-established, PAY course...

They can try to remove it on environmental grounds, or the threat to the surrounding residences from fire.

 

[humchris85]

Why are you calling out california/californians? Seems like a broad generalization, especially when the best disc golfers come from there (here)...

...I still can only half-identify, lol.

Agreed. CA is a huge state. To try to put us all in one box is ludicrous, and shows just how little they know about CA.

 

[DG_Before_Breakfast]

As predicted, these folks are going after Pinto Lake, and Dela will be next. GGP will be in their sights especially if they're successful.

Yep, this is real stuff. I'm going to insert part of an email that was sent out designed to spread the word on this issue and get people to the meeting this coming Monday where we could save Pinto Lake. If you are in Santa Cruz to play the Master's Cup Am's you could spend one extra night on Monday the 15th and come to the meeting. If we get 500 Disc Golfers to show up and support Pinto Lake, while there are 30 neighbors complaining, that makes a huge difference to the decision makers in County Government.
--

What can you do?

1) E-mail Santa Cruz County Supervisor Zach Friend ([email protected]) and let him know how you feel about Pinto Lake Championship Disc Golf Course. This will only take a minute of your time, but your input is valuable.

2) Come to the Parks & Recreation Commission meeting Monday April 15 at 7 PM and show your support for disc golf in Santa Cruz County Parks. The meeting will be held at the Simkin Swim Center, 979 17th Avenue, Santa Cruz, CA 95062 (in Live Oak, Soquel Ave exit from Hwy 1).

3) Forward this e-mail to anyone you know who could help support disc golf in Santa Cruz County Parks.

--

Also, visit this web site:

http://pintolakediscgolf.com

You can learn more about the issues there. In particular, the Testimonials on how the course cleanup for the 2011 Worlds has improved Pinto Lake are powerful arguments to me.

I see Zach Friend a lot socially because my wife works in County Government. I'll let him know personally why Disc golf is a valid, useful and positive force for public land use at Pinto Lake.

Generally, I stay out of anything political, but Pinto Lake is an awesome Disc Golf course that nicely shares the space with the general public. I always see friendly smiling people on the trails there that seem to have no problem with the presence of Disc Golf. Plus, I really want these groups to start loosing so they stop thinking it is a good use of their time, and don't go after Dela.


Why is California so bad in terms of this kind of NIMBYism?

My perspective is that their is a ton of liberal political energy left over from the 60s that has no outlet. Instead of trying to fight for the land use reform in places that really need it (Capitola comes to mind), they fight about their Neighborhoods with other liberal minded people with slightly different viewpoints, over small issues that they can actually fight their opponents safely. It is so bad in Santa Cruz that we can't even build a bike path, but I digress... The fact is even many "No Growth" advocates don't understand some of the anti-Pinto Lake arguments because this is public space, paid for by the county. We aren't trying to use new land, or change the usage of this land. We are using it exactly for what it is for - public recreation.

 

[DG_Before_Breakfast]

They can try to remove it on environmental grounds, or the threat to the surrounding residences from fire.

True.

Dela has one big thing going for it though - the City Government loves it. They only maintain the parking area, which they charge $2 to park in. So it brings in Tourism for almost no effort. They also love that the Course works with City on a lot of things, like its a great place for the city to dump fallen trees - which are quite awesome for avoiding going OB on a lot of holes for the DGers. The Dela DGC would be wise to maintain good relations with the City in this manner.

 

[ru4por]

Email sent.

 

[Grungedude42]

My brother lives near Santa Cruz. I sent him the link to this thread and the course site, and he's relaying it along to his ultimate club.