Golf Disc Durability Testing Video

[smarkquart]

From what I've read from this post (just the first 2 pages), most of you people just have no idea. Do you think pros are using Champion, Star, ESP, or Z putters? Hahahaha. Wrong.

This exactly.

A long-time player I have seen in local leagues has at least six different types of Magnets, or something similar in softness. All are at least four to eight years old but are so perfectly beaten and in different stages of wear that he could practical throw nothing else and still kick my ass hands down with both eyes closed. I am not a big fan of his temperament towards helping out or tolerating lesser players, but there is definitely no questioning his ability and disc selection.

 

[MDethCKR]

Can I ask whats 'comparable' ?
Like has been discussed, Z/ch esp/st dont have grip. r-pro is....useless. so that leaves el-x/pro?

i really dont know/see what plastic is anywhere close. but i dont care much for the actual molds
i'd like to see pro pig, etc with the vibrams

 

[craftsman]

No plastic's comparable cause it's rubber.
If the nit pickets what a comparable material test, it have to be with lightning, dga, and something like the rubber rattler. Lol

 

[Lewis]

What I get from this video and thread is that Vibram makes a single disc that you can both putt and drive with. There are putters that some of us might find more reliable in their own hands for putting, like an SSS Wizard, and there may be other putters, like the Cryztal Challenger, that are as durable and great for driving. Steven's point is that you have the option of using one Vibram putter to both putt and drive with, and not worry about deforming it when driving or missing the grippy the feel when putting. In other words, his main point is that there are no apples-to-apples comparisons because the Vibram disc is unique.

I love the Gateway Voodoo because it has a feel that increases my putting confidence. However, a couple of tree-hits (yes one to three, thank you haterade drinkers) deformed it to the point that, although it still generally retains its flight characteristics, it doesn't have the same consistent "feel" that I want in my putter. And I can't get it back to shape by manual manipulation or by the hot-water-and-encyclopedia method. If I can get a similar feel from a Vibram putter, I'll be happy to give it a shot.

Thanks for the video, Steve. I'm looking forward to your video comparing the X-Link discs vs. the other $15 putters. Also, have you considered hiring Vince Schlomi of Sham-Wow fame, or does he have too much baggage after being arrested for assault?

 

[StevenDodge]

Thanks for the video, Steve. I'm looking forward to your video comparing the X-Link discs vs. the other $15 putters. Also, have you considered hiring Vince Schlomi of Sham-Wow fame, or does he have too much baggage after being arrested for assault?

I think BP should be talking with the Sham Wow guy.

 

[zenbot]

Are there robots that can operate a Slap Chop at 5000' below the surface of the ocean? That could work.

 

[Lithicon]

I personally won't purchase one, but it's at least something new.

Either way you look at it. Beat in old base line plastic with 3-4 disc for stability.
Or you use 3 or how ever many molds Vibram has to account for stability.
If you look at it from a mold minimalist point of view, I prefer a few of the same mold in different wear. Companies love you buying back ups, lol.
But, the same effect is attained how ever you choose to go about it.

I'd really like you to repeat the initial test with either an R-Pro Dart, or R-Pro Aviar against the X-link, and the other disc if you'd like.
I'm by no means claiming it to be as strong, but I know that the R-Pro mid and putter blend of plastic isn't the same as the R-Pro driver blend that everyone hates. I would mostly for my personal pleasure like to see how the R-Pro putter disc hold up to the same abuse.

Now, the main reason I chose to make this post is a very peculiar topic that arose about gripping the chains. There can be too much grip in a putter. Now a lot of this is subjective to putting styles as well. You want a disc that doesn't instantly stick and grab chains, as it needs to hit the chains and slide some. So that it doesn't sit in the chains and get pushed back as the chains return to their normal position. You also don't want it to sit and stick; you want the momentum of the disc to spin in the chains some too. So that when it hits the chains it doesn't grab the chains and "spin out".
The lower base line plastics offer enough "grip" in the basket but still slip enough so they don't spin out. They'll also hit the chains and slide down, or flip up.(Which can also cause some pop outs due to the chains returning and pushing the disc out, as it goes up.) But, this is reduced some by the disc ability to slide down while the chains are returning too. And, is subjective to putting styles, as well as the majority of this can be affected to a degree by putting styles.

Now, this leads to the amount of grip that's in the putter effectively reducing the amount of putting surface you have available, so that the disc stays in. The more it grips the more to your spin side you have to hit. So that it doesn't spin out. As much as I'd like to say we're all dead on, even when we're "dead on" we're off by some. Reading from some people more knowledgable on the subject than I, the area decrease is roughly 30-40%. So with more available surface you have to make an effective putt attempt; increases your chance of making a successful putt. Which is generally given by these more baseline plastics.
Another reason I mentioned R-Pro; is R-Pro and SSS plastics verge on being too soft and sticks to the chains too long. As all runs of plastic vary to some degree, some aren't as bad as others. What's your opinion on this, and does that amount of grip in the basket still sound so great after reading what I've written above?

 

[Lithicon]

When I say roughly 30-40% I think they equated it to nearly 4-8" reduced target area; around your entire target. (Which would be your Non-spin side.) We all know how hard the basket is to hit anyway. So when you further reduce your "effective" target area, you reduce the chances of actually making a successful putt even more.

 

[elnino]

Vibram test good.

i think the rubber xlink is about the same as a champy star mix in feel....

those gummy star rhynos...that is what they feel like.....in the sun they do get rather soft so get a reg if you like a firm putter.

remember the feel of the material is based on each individual thrower...i hate star rhynos but my friend is money with them(pisses me off cuz i gave him the stupid disc and he is draining 50ft all day with it)....he will probably never need another one but i feel the same about my vp...I play a super wooded course 150holes a week and zero wear...do i crush trees of the tee well sadly the better i get the more i hit trees!

 

[StevenDodge]

Now, the main reason I chose to make this post is a very peculiar topic that arose about gripping the chains. There can be too much grip in a putter. Now a lot of this is subjective to putting styles as well. You want a disc that doesn't instantly stick and grab chains, as it needs to hit the chains and slide some. So that it doesn't sit in the chains and get pushed back as the chains return to their normal position. You also don't want it to sit and stick; you want the momentum of the disc to spin in the chains some too. So that when it hits the chains it doesn't grab the chains and "spin out".
The lower base line plastics offer enough "grip" in the basket but still slip enough so they don't spin out. They'll also hit the chains and slide down, or flip up.(Which can also cause some pop outs due to the chains returning and pushing the disc out, as it goes up.) But, this is reduced some by the disc ability to slide down while the chains are returning too. And, is subjective to putting styles, as well as the majority of this can be affected to a degree by putting styles.

I have not tested this theory. I have tested R-Pro putters and they beat up as fast as baseline, if my memory is correct.

 

[Carolina Crushers]

It really pays off to read a thread before you post on it.

Good work Steve and Vibram for making our sport a little more environmentally friendly.

Any plans on creating a understable putter. I love my Classic Aviar flight path, no bead. With the lack of "beating in" it would have to be really understable out of the box.

On that note any plans for a full line of discs?

Likewise

 

[StevenDodge]

I personally won't purchase one, but it's at least something new.

Either way you look at it. Beat in old base line plastic with 3-4 disc for stability.
Or you use 3 or how ever many molds Vibram has to account for stability.
If you look at it from a mold minimalist point of view, I prefer a few of the same mold in different wear. Companies love you buying back ups, lol.
But, the same effect is attained how ever you choose to go about it.

I figured out why the above statement has been being chewed over in my mind. I remember carrying three Cyclones for just this reason and I had a fourth brand new one ready in the wings.

Two thoughts on this multiple discs in various stages theory:

1. So we've got three discs in various stages of wear. One "newish", one "beat to stable", one "way beat to understable". How do we determine that a disc needs to move from the "newish" category to the "beat to stable" category? If we are a perfect thrower, than we determine this when the disc flies incorrectly. If we are not a perfect thrower, than we think maybe we released it wrong and we give it another try - resulting in another errant throw.

This would also lead to constantly tweaking our throw to account for the amount of beat in the disc, leading to more variability in our throws. So as I see it, there are two variables that determine if my disc flies correctly. The first is my form, the second is the disc's form. Using the "3-4 beat-in baseline plastic discs" method would result in the disc's form being inconsistent. I would choose to minimize the disc's variability in where my throws go - and the way to do this is to get a more durable disc.

2. Cost. You are constantly cycling through these discs, and if one category beats faster than the next, not only will you be buying new discs all the time, you'll have a glut of discs in one category. While this is potentially great for the disc stores and for the newbies that you give your beat discs to, in the long term, it is not great for your wallet.

 

[Pink Elephant]

Sorry for resurrecting this thread, but Steve got blasted for the tree thing earlier. A couple days ago I threw a Wizard (SS) off the tee and like a moron, hit the one tiny tree 30' in front of me. I hit it dead on, and my Wiz is noticeable warped. So yes, this can happen and has to me in real life on the course.

 

[StevenDodge]

I'm not by any means mad, I just find it funny when you take a vibram $15.00 disc and compare it to $8 dollar disc...when most of the other companies have MORE COMPARABLE disc in the same $15,00 price range. However that was not done, I am in no way saying that Vibram don't have strong disc, but rather..next time compare an apple to an apple not a grape...Thanks

 

[Carolina Crushers]

I never said that vibram didn't have strong disc, but I do like the video above, because in my opinion it was a closer comparsion to what I personally wanted to see. Even though the other disc were scratched, they were not warped like the dx plastics from the first video. I persoanlly think this video was a better comparsion, and would have to admit the vibram disc do seem more durable. I appoligize if earlier in the thread I came off like an ass. I am in retail and understand there are ways to make certain products look better, and one way is gennerally comparing to a little lesser grade in a different price range. HOWEVER, you proved 100% to me, that Vibram disc are stronger than the other major brands in this 2nd video. P.S.- I just ordered a Ridge X-link!