How you can tell course ratings are BS on here

[smyith]

More population=more noobs or non serious DGers with access who dont appreciate a challenging design...more bad reviews

Less population=only seasoned and serious DGer who appreciates challenging design will venture there and thus more postive reviews

just saying

good point didn't think of that one

It seems obvious that the OP wants DGCR to set standards on the reviews its users submit, I don't necessarily think this would a be a bad thing but I think there is a place for opinionated and standardized reviews

ABSOLUTELY NOT!!!!!!!!!! NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO! NEVER!

 

[Danger]

If you think the ratings are BS here, you can certainly go to another widely respected disc golf course review site

That being said, I generally agree with the overall ratings of the courses I have played.

 

[mashnut]

you still dont get it. the best of the best has it all, not just my criteria or your criteria, but everyones, there is nothing that cant be improved. you honestly want to tell me that this course couldn't use several more upgrades? i cant stand all these 5 disc ratings that people dish out for courses that are seriously lacking in multiple courses.
plus a course that is near a 5 disc should qualify to be picked apart by all. im just using this course cause ive been watching the reviews lately and its climbing the charts with the same BS ratings the Flip City gets. "ive only reviewed 1 or 2 courses and this a 5!!!" reviews are over abundant. 19 of 38 reviews on flyboy are by people with less than 5 courses played/reviewed.

another reason why think some of the more "popular" raters, rate these courses high is cause they dont want their :thmbdown: to go up.

If the only way for a course to get a 5 is if there's absolutely nothing that can be improved, then there should never be a 5 rating here for any course. 5 is the best of the best, meaning that if someone thinks that the design of a course pushes it above other courses with good amenities, that's an entirely valid opinion. Not everyone who gives a popular course a 5 rating is a 1 review wonder or someone who only wants to get thumbs ups by rating a top course. That certainly happens, but there are a lot of legitimate reviews for all those top courses too. Try the TR only filter and see what happens.

 

[jhgonzo]

the bluberry hill and flyboy comparison isn't very fair. If you never been up there then you wouldn't know, but there ain't $%^& for population to draw from. the town of Highbridge, WI consists of a few (i mean a few) houses, a cementary, a place that i assume is a bar (looks like a house but had beer signs everywhere and a large gravel parking area), and the course. to go to a store you have to travel 25mi. atlanta isn't that far from flyboy it has a much larger populous to pull from. the closest town near atlanta's says is a couple hundred miles away.

We're actually on the same page in this regard; maybe you didn't see that I compared the Flyboy reviews to the huge influx of Idlewild and Flip reviews, while I noted that a top-notch course like Blueberry tends to NOT suffer from the same 5-disc/1-course-played technique the aforementioned receive.

Given that Flyboy is quickly ascending the Top Ten (and rightfully so, based on everything I've seen and heard!), I expect the Flip and Idlewild locals will continue to bombard the site with brief, poorly written yet not-very-concise reviews in order to boost "their" course, while Blueberry will continue to be reviewed by those serious DGers that make the trek up to no-man's-land.

 

[wkelly42]

you still dont get it. the best of the best has it all, not just my criteria or your criteria, but everyones, there is nothing that cant be improved. you honestly want to tell me that this course couldn't use several more upgrades? i cant stand all these 5 disc ratings that people dish out for courses that are seriously lacking in multiple courses.

I don't know anyone else's criteria. I probably don't even care about most peoples' criteria. I care about what is important to me, and if the course hits all of that, I should give it a 5, regardless of whether I have anyone else's permission to do it.

Pro shop? Who cares?! Bonus if the course has it, but I don't care if it doesn't. Picnic tables? Playground for kids? On-site five-star restaurant with a celebrity chef and reasonable prices? None of that impacts my round of disc golf. Practice basket? Yes, if I'm giving a 5 the course had better have one. THAT impacts my round. Trash cans? I'm a big boy, and I know how to pack my trash out myself. I pity anyone who can't, but a lack of trash cans doesn't impede me from enjoying a round or two. Teepads that are in poor condition do, but I don't require concrete pads, so I can't rationalize deducting anything from my rating because a course has rubber or natural pads.

 

[Jukeshoe]

A little off the subject of the thread, but I think that is sort of irrelevant to including the condition of the tees as a pro or con in a review. If the tees are bad, they're bad regardless of what led to that. I have sympathy for the people working to maintain a course where they don't have the option to put in their first choice of tees, and I absolutely appreciate the work they do, but I don't think that my reviews would be as fair and consistent if I adjusted based on constraints like that, especially since I play so many courses where I would never know the full story behind the installation and maintenance of the course.

Now that said, natural tees aren't always a con if they're well maintained, level, and free of ruts, roots and rocks etc.

I understand exactly what you're getting at re: consistency, knowing the full story, etc.; however, I disagree. If you're aware of the reason why concrete tees can't be installed, no reason punishing the course ratings-wise for something they can't control. But that comes down to a difference in philosophy, I think, and we probably aren't going to sway each other to the other side of the argument.

 

[smyith]

I understand what you're getting at, but I don't agree with it at all. Like Opti, the only way things like tees and baskets would ever factor into a rating I give a course is if they are vastly inadequate or dangerous. What I do consider more than anything is how much I want to play there again, and the overall design of the course, mainly in terms of the quality of the holes (at least in my eyes). Neither of the courses I gave 5 discs to have any trashcans. One has no tee signs, homemade baskets (which catch better than any others I've ever played), and carpeted tees, with a few benches scattered along the walk through the course. The other has wonderful concrete tees, great tee signs, next hole signage, and benches at every hole. But none of these things are reasons why I consider them 5 disc courses. They're 5 disc courses to me because I found the designs to be amazing, and I would love to play them every day. I will admit that I am sometimes drawn in by aesthetics, which I probably shouldn't be.

tldr: it's all opinion.

To you that is true, but it isnt to everyone, some people couldnt care less about the amenities, some couldnt care, about the teepads, some couldnt care about if they have toilets, garbage cans, or tee signs, do you really expect them to use the exact same critera as everyone else? Thats not fair to say someone else criteria is flawed. I am one who values everything but like I said I can look past no benches, no tee signs, poor teepads, etc etc etc and still rate a course highly, but to get a 5 it needs a little of everything as you will see by Winter Park only getting a 4.5. If it had good teepads it would be a 5 for sure, but the teepads are bad enough that it took the whole rating down in my opinion. Then the courses I have given 5's to have a little of everything . . . Blue Ribbon Pines and Bracketts Bluff

to both of these. i keep trying to put this across to you guys; a best of the best has EVERYTHING it lacks NOTHING. Everything is installed near perfect and is consistent throughout the course. it has everything you could want at a park (some things are just perks. such as a pro shop and by no means is a requirement). there may be little things that you may like tweaked, but that will always be.

this is how i generally think of a course when putting a rating together:
1 disc for Fun
1 disc for Challenge
1 disc for Land Use (best possible course for available land)
0.5 disc for Amenities (Trash Cans!!!!/Bathrooms/Water/Benches/etc.)
0.5 disc for Flow
0.5 disc for Teepads (dirt/cement/rubber doesnt matter just consistency and well maintained)
0.5 disc for Tee Signs (Distance must be marked! to earn full half disc)
Bonus 0.5 disc for Aesthetic appeal

by no means do i think everyone should judge a course like this but i use this model to keep myself in check. i also havee this posted in my DGCR profile so that people can understand my values in the rating. if i went off courses i absolutely adore as being 5 disc quality, i'd be another one of d bags with a ton of 5 disc courses none of which are truly 5 disc courses, the reason for the above model.

 

[craigd]

I gave Flyboy a five and defended it in "other thoughts" section of my review. As of now I have played and reviewed 58 courses and this is far beyond anything I have seen or experienced. I am sure if I played some of the other courses that are on the top ten I might change my opinion but as worn out as it sounds, you really have to go there. It is the whole experiance that makes the rating. For what it's worth I have only played courses in the southeast so I know there is lots of new things out there to see.

By the way, the SouthEast Collegiate Open @ Flyboy Aviation was this past weekend and I am sure that has some folks logging on to tell of their thoughts. That is where the new reviews are coming from...

 

[drgnslyr221]

Play Beaver Ranch and you will realize dirt pads fit the course.Non dirt tee-pads would look so out of place there.

 

[bikinjack]

to both of these. i keep trying to put this across to you guys; a best of the best has EVERYTHING it lacks NOTHING. Everything is installed near perfect and is consistent throughout the course. it has everything you could want at a park (some things are just perks. such as a pro shop and by no means is a requirement). there may be little things that you may like tweaked, but that will always be.

this is how i generally think of a course when putting a rating together:
1 disc for Fun
1 disc for Challenge
1 disc for Land Use (best possible course for available land)
0.5 disc for Amenities (Trash Cans!!!!/Bathrooms/Water/Benches/etc.)
0.5 disc for Flow
0.5 disc for Teepads (dirt/cement/rubber doesnt matter just consistency and well maintained)
0.5 disc for Tee Signs (Distance must be marked! to earn full half disc)
Bonus 0.5 disc for Aesthetic appeal

by no means do i think everyone should judge a course like this but i use this model to keep myself in check. i also havee this posted in my DGCR profile so that people can understand my values in the rating. if i went off courses i absolutely adore as being 5 disc quality, i'd be another one of d bags with a ton of 5 disc courses none of which are truly 5 disc courses, the reason for the above model.

My point is that this is your opinion, and others, myself included do not share it. I'm glad you have a system, so do I, and others. I applaud you for it. One of my criteria is that I generally won't review a course I've only played once. I like to take a second look. I have reviewed a few courses (4 I think) after only one playing, but they were short and simple, and not to much to take in, and also had few if any reviews, and I thought putting up a review for an unreviewed or underreviewed course was more important thing to do for such a short, simple course. But I don't knock others for playing something once and writing a review. Harr, mashnut, DSCJNKY, heelboycraig, and many others write terrific reviews after only one playing. I wouldn't be able to do as well on something other than a pitch and putt.

 

[hangwind]

I don't have a lot of diverse experience with courses...

But I really don't see how you could improve on Fountain Hills. The aesthetic is there, the tee pads are good, well marked, relatively easy to navigate the first time. Let 'er rip holes, water, technical, good course set up. First hole is a good challenge but will hold novice to pro. The course was thought out with season and time of day thought out. Good use of limited elevation, trees and your arm.

I don't think it is the best, I think it is one of the best and deserves a high rating. The only thing it does not have is a pro shop, everything else is there.

We have a lot of desert/rock courses, some forest courses and a couple of grass courses, Arizona has a good cross section of types of courses but Fountain Hills is a must play.

Opinions indeed, it is a very subjective subject.

I hope everyone has a good course that they love, could care less about the rating.

 

[sillybizz]

this is how i generally think of a course when putting a rating together:
1 disc for Fun
1 disc for Challenge
1 disc for Land Use (best possible course for available land)
0.5 disc for Amenities (Trash Cans!!!!/Bathrooms/Water/Benches/etc.)
0.5 disc for Flow
0.5 disc for Teepads (dirt/cement/rubber doesnt matter just consistency and well maintained)
0.5 disc for Tee Signs (Distance must be marked! to earn full half disc)
Bonus 0.5 disc for Aesthetic appeal

I put much more value on Challenge and Land Use than you do. Amentities/Flow/Tee Pads/Tee Signs: This is like 0.5 for me for all four.

There are several Trusted Reviewers doing reviews on Flyboy Aviation that are giving it very high ratings and you have as many thumbs up as you do thumbs down so who's opinion is worth more to me? You figure that one out...

 

[RussMB]

You bring up a good point. Not all courses (such as courses in certain federal or state parks) are allowed to pour concrete tees.

This is true! Case in point: The Sarge It's in a state park, and due to the ecological setting and them not wanting to disturb the sanctity of the park. The don't have Concrete tee's. It's a great course, and I can't dock them for not having them. It doesn't bother me that the tee's are au naturale, but I would rather have that than to have nothing at all. I agree with what Optidisc said a few posts earlier. I look at each course differently, and look at the overall experience. If the course is well maintained and clean, then I'm probably going to be less inclined to complain about the lack of garbage cans. If the courses is filthy, and there are no garbage cans, then I'm definitely going to address it.

Although, the burst of flyboy reviews has caught my attention. What can I say, except: I need to go check it out and come to my own conclusion. (If I wasn't so tired from my trip in Sept, I would have! So close, yet so far!)

 

[RussMB]

to both of these. i keep trying to put this across to you guys; a best of the best has EVERYTHING it lacks NOTHING.

I think what everyone is tell you, is that there is no such course. It doesn't exist! Every course is going to have a flaw of some kind. (Flip, Idlewild, Flyboy, Tupelo Bay... (pardon the sarcastic HBB ) This is what I was talking about in the thread I posted a couple months back. Idlewild has a hole crossing. You have to cross a fairway to get to the next tee. Do I count that as a flaw? absolutely! Was it enough for me to drop it less than a 5. No! It is still a 5 disc course, and rightfully so.

So, what then?

Do we have no 5 star rating? Then you'll complain about the 4.5 rated courses. I think we all agree, I won't speak for you, but 5 discs doesn't equal perfect. It means it's a damn good course; a course you would put on a road trip or drive off the beaten path to get here;It's tough and challenging. Strategy is required;Par is earned, not given; etc... I'll digress, These are high qualities. These outrank a disheveled teebox. or lack of a bench. I could care less about a bench. They're nice, but unless it's in front of me, I'm not thinking about it. Amenities are nice, and should be commended. But Amenities does not a 5 disc course make.

 

[prerube]

you still dont get it. the best of the best has it all,

You don't get it! No course has it all. As scarpfish said, all courses have a flaw.
It is imposible to make a course that everyone will find as a 5 star. Courses that are challenging enough for pros are too much for rec players. You can not please everyone.
It sounds like you are just upset that some other course got bumped. I have been on this site since Ellison and Widner were in the top 10. Things change!

 

[bboykin]

I've found that the courses with the most trash cans actually have the most trash - not in the cans. Ironic.

 

[prerube]

this is how i generally think of a course when putting a rating together:
1 disc for Fun
1 disc for Challenge
1 disc for Land Use (best possible course for available land)
0.5 disc for Amenities (Trash Cans!!!!/Bathrooms/Water/Benches/etc.)
0.5 disc for Flow
0.5 disc for Teepads (dirt/cement/rubber doesnt matter just consistency and well maintained)
0.5 disc for Tee Signs (Distance must be marked! to earn full half disc)
Bonus 0.5 disc for Aesthetic appeal

you are missing so much!

To remember everything you have to take into account:
left vs. right dog legs, signature holes, blind holes, foiliage, tight vs. open hole number, variety in shot length, multiple pins, multiple tee pads, outside traffic, dog poop, wildlife, "Appalachian Beauty", the course's ability to play to beginners and still entertain advanced players, Elevation changes, Novelty barriers, Course signage and flow, Water Hazards, OB's, ticks, thorns, road crossings, bike paths, availability of a map and Message board, pay to play, number of holes, type and condition of basket, type of tee, length of tee, poison ivy, mud and drainage issues, cleanliness, garbage cans, course maintenence and landscaping, other activities and course users, number of disc golfers on the course, bathrooms, benches, water fountains, disc lost and found, practice basket, potential for growth, and distance from other courses and highways, friendly locals, nearby attractions...shall I go on?

 

[lokirising]

There is no such thing as a perfect course. If all courses were perfect, we wouldn't need to rate them, would we?

 

[wkelly42]

to both of these. i keep trying to put this across to you guys; a best of the best has EVERYTHING it lacks NOTHING. Everything is installed near perfect and is consistent throughout the course. it has everything you could want at a park...

OK, so in the future I will give NO 5 disc ratings unless the course has valet parking and an on-site five-star restaurant. It has to lack NOTHING, right?

The problem is exactly what you said in your quote -- "Everything is installed NEAR perfect ..." And the disagreement lies in how NEAR that NEAR is. The people who have ACTUALLY PLAYED Flyboy (and I haven't, though I want to) have decided that the NEAR is pretty darn NEAR. By your own standard, that warrants a five disc rating. Problem solved.

 

[Hector Chain]

reduction ad absurdum

you still dont get it. the best of the best has it all, not just my criteria or your criteria, but everyones, there is nothing that cant be improved. .

He's right. I've seen some 5-disc courses that didn't have a single on-site masseuse. Not one!

Then I looked around for beer taps to bring me a pint of craft brews (not just any craft brew, it needs to be a finely malted milk stout, of course), but there were NONE!

Those are not 5-disc courses because they're not perfect to me.