[Recommend] Next step up from a Leopard?

[SD86]

Last question...best disc of these three if going with 165g-168g weight:

DX Leopard
D-Line Heat
Prime Witness

Thanks.

TripleB

My answer also is "none of the above". I'd recommend a Leopard3 in that upper-160-class, and Champion plastic.

Also, I saw someone at my course throwing a Heat, and throwing it well. I haven't tried it, but in a good plastic it should do you well.

 

[dysmike]

None of them in base plastic, they won't last long

A Heat in X line is a pretty sweet disc in the weight you're looking at though.

Yea, for the Leopard I'd go either Pro or G-Star.

Or, pick up something like a Diamond or Jade and learn to hyzer-flip them

 

[ILUVSMGS18]

My answer also is "none of the above". I'd recommend a Leopard3 in that upper-160-class, and Champion plastic.

Also, I saw someone at my course throwing a Heat, and throwing it well. I haven't tried it, but in a good plastic it should do you well.

Wait, did we just discover an US disc that SD86 hasn't tried? I thought I'd never see the day. Honestly not a bad suggestion, though working on form would yield better results.

 

[SD86]

Wait, did we just discover an US disc that SD86 hasn't tried? I thought I'd never see the day. Honestly not a bad suggestion, though working on form would yield better results.

Oh yes, so many discs, so little time. Plenty of discs I haven't tried... yet!

 

[TripleB]

Those of you who advised me to stick with the Leopard, you were spot on :clap:

I absolutely love my 167g DX Leopard that's been through the ringer over the last two months...looks pretty beat up but flight is straight on anything under about 70% and has a right turn for anything over that. Didn't like the Leopard3 DX (168g) when I first threw it, mainly because I tried to throw it like my 167g beat in DX, but it obviously more stable since it's much newer. So now that I realize I have to throw with a bit more power to get it to fly straight...loving it as well now!

I would really like to get a more durable plastic in one (or both) of these but am afraid I won't get the same flight and glide out of it like I do the DX Leo and Leo3...would going lighter (159-163g) in say the G-Star allow me to get a similar flight and glide to what I get out of my 168g Leo3 or 167g Leo?

Again, thanks for all the help and the advice to stick with the Leopard!

TripleB

 

[discerdoo]

would going lighter (159-163g) in say the G-Star allow me to get a similar flight and glide to what I get out of my 168g Leo3 or 167g Leo?

I'd go with a 170ish Star Leo. Yes, it will start more stable than your beat DX but will beat in over time and be useful for years. Fresh it could slot between your leo and teebird. G* teebirds are nice flyers too.

 

[TripleB]

I should have mentioned I also have a Leopard 167g in Pro plastic and just haven't found any love at all for this version of the Leopard. It seems way too overstable...of course if I used it long enough that probably wouldn't be a problem - I'd either beat it in to get it less stable or learn to throw it better.

TripleB

 

[tbird888]

Until the Pro Leopard flies like your beat DX, you probably don't need to go to any faster molds.

 

[thirtydirtybirds]

FWIW pro leopards are the best understable fairway I've found. A VIP underworld is also good. The only step up from that I have liked is a recycled hatchet. Easy to hyzerflip, holds good lines for me out to 325' or so, but so does the leopard. Only reason I bag both is the hatchet is a little easier to hit low ceiling turnovers, no significant distance difference for me though.

 

[slowplastic]

I haven't got to compare a Pro to Gstar Leo side by side. But if your Pro is more overstable than you want right now, I have the feeling that no other Innova fairway will be less stable in anything but DX. So use the Pro Leo, beat it in, and get the form up. I remember it not doing much more than a slight drift on me until I could throw it 300 or a bit more consistently...as it beats in it will drift sooner. But it was laser straight 280-300 and a great flyer.

The Underworld suggestion is probably good as well, tons of glide and you get that in premium plastic. But keep using the DX Leo you like, and throw the Pro Leo on second shots all the time to work it in. Get the velocity up. As much as you like your DX Leo flight, the Star/Champ/Pro all fly like that with the correct velocity; it's a good mold as you know. The nice thing is that it means there is a Leo for almost every arm speed/distance as you keep getting your velocity up. What a DX Leo does at 270' a Star will do at 350' for example/generalization.

 

[Alexplz]

If you get the itch to throw premium fairways but have been frustrated by the relative overstability of the plastic, check out an underworld in whatever plastic you want.

I've had similar experience to you with premium leopards - even the pro ones are much different than a nice DX leo that has come in contact with some tree limbs. I will say the underworld is at the top of a very short list of premium plastic I have been able to turnover off the shelf, even at 170g in VIP. They flip, and they do not fade! Incredible euro-glide too.

 

[TripleB]

So use the Pro Leo, beat it in, and get the form up. I remember it not doing much more than a slight drift on me until I could throw it 300 or a bit more consistently...as it beats in it will drift sooner. But it was laser straight 280-300 and a great flyer.

But keep using the DX Leo you like, and throw the Pro Leo on second shots all the time to work it in. Get the velocity up. As much as you like your DX Leo flight, the Star/Champ/Pro all fly like that with the correct velocity; it's a good mold as you know. The nice thing is that it means there is a Leo for almost every arm speed/distance as you keep getting your velocity up. What a DX Leo does at 270' a Star will do at 350' for example/generalization.

Thanks for all this incredible information!!!

I went and played 9 holes yesterday and 1/3 of my bag was made up of Leopards...Leopard DX 167g, Leopard DX 168g (a little more stable than the beat in 167g), and a Leopard 3 168g. Unfortunately on my new home course I only got to throw the Leopard(3) three times...a long par 4 and two long par 3s. And thinking about the back nine I believe I'll only have a total of about 5 opportunities on the 18 holes to let the Leo fly (at least when playing from the reds - moving back to the blues should give me maybe 2 more opportunities).

Instead of moving up to a disc that flies like the Leopard maybe I should have been looking at moving down (in distance) to a disc that behaves like the leopard

Again, I appreciate everyone's help!

TripleB

 

[TripleB]

My answer also is "none of the above". I'd recommend a Leopard3 in that upper-160-class, and Champion plastic.

This recommendation was spot on!!!

I made it to a much more open and longer course today and the Leopard3 168g in DX plastic was the mvd in my bag. Long and straight (maybe a 10' fade at the end on some throws)...even worked well when I got my line a little higher than I was hoping. I didn't really realize the importance of this disc on the heavily wooded technical courses I had played on previously...today it really showed how valuable it is! On a couple holes I threw a 152g DX Sidewinder...if I threw it as hard as my Leopard3 it bailed right on me...if I threw it at the speed I needed to get a nice little S curve out of it then it never made it further than my Leopard3 - I'll stick with the Leo3 for driving duties now!!!

Now my task is to find a mid that flies like the Leo3. Love my Stratus when I need a left to right flight (RHBH). Love my Comet (most of the time) when I need a slight fade at the end. But nothing I trust like I do my Leopards to give me a perfectly straight flight. As far as my Truth...today was the first day out but not very happy with the result so far. No matter my release it seems the nose comes up and it heads left. I did love the flight of the Mirage...it's like a shorter Stratus.

TripleB

 

[Monkeypaws]

Without reading the thread - Saint. A very logical extension of the qualities of the LEO.

 

[wims]

The Underworld is *the* disc you want. Insane glide, very understable. Goes a long way for a slow arm. I would very highly recommend getting one in the VIP plastic at about 167g. Great disc, I'd still bag it if I didn't have a very beat up FD that flies beautiful turnovers and hyzerflips. The Underworld does that straight out of the box tho. It would almost certainly be your longest disc

 

[dorseymatt]

I know it's hard to resist going to a course, but doing some work in a field for an hour will be invaluable when working on figuring out new discs.

 

[Van1]

I'd try more field practice with the Leopard. If I were really smart I'd add that lightweight Sidewinder into that practice and figure out how to make it not turn and burn.

OFF THE TEE, Beat sidewinder in the woods (no wind), Mamba for wide open shots, some suck, find a good star or champ. Headwind wide open, beat Katana, premium plastic.

Save the Leo's for field work. They work miracles for practice and consistency.

Fresh DX Cobra sometimes work better in the woods with little wind depending on distance and layout.

 

[brandocommando9]

You need this sidewinder tripleb I will ship it to ya for free. It's a beat in 153 star sidewinder and should be perfect for your arm speed.

 

[kjr63]

From Innova at least champ Panther and star Wedge are Leopard kind of discs. Panther fast mid, wedge fast putter.

 

[TripleB]

You need this sidewinder tripleb I will ship it to ya for free. It's a beat in 153 star sidewinder and should be perfect for your arm speed.

AWESOME!!!! PM SENT!

TripleB