Nikki's force over

[Magnet69]

Nikko obviously has very good distance, would trying a controlled force over get me any more distance or is it not worth a shot??? Just looking for a little more distance on open drives...

Thanks in advance...

 

[BuiltTooLong]

It really depends on your throwing motion and even if it did add some initial distance, it may not be the best idea as it may induce off axis torque. You will certainly see more of a full S curve flight, however that flight is not going to be as direct, so the disc will have to travel further to get to the same distance.

I generally will only throw those force over flexes to get around something, as I can spin a disc faster releasing on a bit of a hyzer angle. Another danger of throwing a lot of flexshots is that you are exposing the flight plates to wind more often. I think it's an important shot to learn, even with fairway drivers and upshot discs as well (firebirds and zones) but I wouldn't try to implement it as your main driving technique.

 

[Big Nasty]

Nikko is able to consistently throw successful force over shots because he has been playing the majority of his life, has great form, and understands angles better than 99% of golfers int he world. If you are looking to improve distance, then you are best served working on technique and/or trying different discs to fit your arm speed. With that said, learning a big flexing distance shot can be useful from time to time.

 

[ThrowaEnvy]

I guess it depends how hard and wide you force it over.. A good nose down slight anhyzer angle isn't a bad way to throw. With the right disc you can stretch a very straight line but yes if it's the only way you throw you will be lelearning oat. Throw every which way but a light force over straight path shot is excellent distance!

For example if I take my Crave, Eagle, River etc and force it so it's a touch of anny nose down it will cut a tight anny line that swings out maybe 20' and comes back 30' and you have a nicely stretched S. That would be good.

A high anny stretched line is not as efficient, the wider the arc the more power/ distance is lost in it.

Case in point with OAT... I have thrown lots of Envy last couple years, almost exclusively except a Comet... picked up an Ohm this year which is more neutral, realized I was throwing too much touch of anny nose down shots... took a couple months to tune in the Ohm... now I'm throwing flatter and further than before because I'm not wasting energy on any extra movement sideways. Just flat and far, it translated back into driver distance as well

 

[Dcinmd]

I believe everyone should learn how to throw an anyhyzer with and over stable disc.

But realistically it should be one of the last type of throws someone should learn, and definitely not the first year or two.

 

[Meillo]

To me anny releases feel more natural than hyzer releases.

I think it's worthwhile to learn all release angles pretty much from the beginning (each with the whole stability spectrum).

I would not advice to learn to throw force-overs just in order to get more distance. If they would be the best technique, then more players would use them. Seems only those who are very comfortable and natural with anny releases use them. Thus it's probably not the best choice for the average player. ;-)


(If you like to experiment with overstable distance on open fields, then have a look at the ``distance lines'' article in the DGR archives. The high anny with an overstable disc panning out is an interesting throw, which gives me surprising distance.)

 

[RyanRehberg535]

I don't believe Nikko really forces the disc over. He just throws anhyzers with overstable discs. In my mind, forcing a disc over is to intentionally apply off-axis torque to the disc while thrown on a hyzer to make it turn in flight to an anhyzer angle. Not very efficient, honestly, and top pros don't do this. If you watch in slow motion, Nikko actually has a very smooth release with very little wobble. He just releases the disc on anhyzer.

 

[rocthecourse]

I don't think Nikko is throwing forced over shots because they get him more distance, but because they give him more control.

 

[BuiltTooLong]

I don't think Nikko is throwing forced over shots because they get him more distance, but because they give him more control.

For sure, it's definitely the way he's most comfortable releasing a disc. If one had to surmise the origin of this, I would guess it traces back to the old days of him throwing Gateway plastic. Being from STL and his uncle being Dave McCormack, he was probably throwing The Spirit for his distance driver growing up.

Gateway has always made fabulous putters, but had limited driver options, The Spirit being the most popular but is a fast and extraordinarily overstable disc. Pretty much the only way to get any decent distance with these, was to throw an exaggerated anny flex.

 

[sidewinder22]

To me anny releases feel more natural than hyzer releases.

My body disagrees with this statement.

 

[shyguy30]

I just came here to see who Nikki is...

 

[sidewinder22]

I just came here to see who Nikki is...

 

[Twmccoy]

Sometimes a controlled "force-over" can yield great distance. You take a disc that is normally too beefy to turn and just yank it hard on an anny line. The disc will fly an exaggerated S curve and usually end up pretty far along.

Do it wrong and you end up throwing a high, weak, hyzer stall.

 

[sidewinder22]

I don't believe Nikko really forces the disc over. He just throws anhyzers with overstable discs. In my mind, forcing a disc over is to intentionally apply off-axis torque to the disc while thrown on a hyzer to make it turn in flight to an anhyzer angle. Not very efficient, honestly, and top pros don't do this. If you watch in slow motion, Nikko actually has a very smooth release with very little wobble. He just releases the disc on anhyzer.

I disagree with the premise, the way pros use OAT vs ams happens in a different sequence, so when pros use OAT it's more like putting some English on the cue ball, while ams just yank it.

I would call Nikko's first shot here a force over. I used to watch the hell out these vids studying form, especially Markus.

 

[RyanRehberg535]

I disagree with the premise, the way pros use OAT vs ams happens in a different sequence, so when pros use OAT it's more like putting some English on the cue ball, while ams just yank it.

I would call Nikko's first shot here a force over. I used to watch the hell out these vids studying form, especially Markus.

That is really interesting and mind blowing. I stand corrected. Never watched that kind of throw in slow motion, I guess.

 

[Meillo]

My body disagrees with this statement.

How can your body disagree with my body feeling? ;-)

Is it just that you don't feel the same? That is expected.

Or do you think a human body cannot feel annies more natural than hyzers? Then I'd be curious why.

 

[sidewinder22]

How can your body disagree with my body feeling? ;-)

Is it just that you don't feel the same? That is expected.

Or do you think a human body cannot feel annies more natural than hyzers? Then I'd be curious why.

IMO the human body works more naturally swinging with gravity in a hyzer pendulum, instead of swinging against gravity like a rainbow or horizontal/flat. Starting the swing falling and letting gravity start the acceleration. Finishing upward allows gravity to help safely decelerate the arm after release. If you finish downward then gravity is accelerating your arm in follow thru and your front leg pumping the ground moves you inward toward the swing instead of extending/accelerating it out away.

 

[ThrowaEnvy]

Interesting, I also like a anny motion but flat from shoulder and a little downward. Not a rainbow but I totally get that pendulum analogy hmmmm put that together with that Ezra video the other day about "low to high swing nose down" snap thing and sounds like a plan for today's round

 

[Countchunkula]

Darling Nikki

 

[autocrosscrx]

Nikki's Force Over sounds like a band name.