Hampstead
* Ace Member *
greens wants me banned, so this will probably be coming to an end as well.
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OTB Lawsuit Predictions
- Thread starter denny ritner
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greens wants me banned, so this will probably be coming to an end as well.
Your echo-chamber isn't serving you well.
Hampstead
* Ace Member *
Someone say echo chamber....?
Skamanda
Double Eagle Member
Just because a lot of people say it, doesn't mean it's an echo chamber. Sometimes it's just the truth.
Smigles
* Ace Member *
So now they are arguing about semantics and deadlines to hand in replies?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=41jd5I5gf9A&ab_channel=DiscGolfdotLaw
I think this is the wrong platform to have this discussion. The underlying question is what defines what a woman is. Some say gender identity, some say chromosomes, some say its complicated. That discussion should not be decided by a single person, be it a judge or whoever.
Still feeling like this is mainly a culture war at this point and i just hope for everybody involved that there will be a sensible solution at some point.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=41jd5I5gf9A&ab_channel=DiscGolfdotLaw
I think this is the wrong platform to have this discussion. The underlying question is what defines what a woman is. Some say gender identity, some say chromosomes, some say its complicated. That discussion should not be decided by a single person, be it a judge or whoever.
Still feeling like this is mainly a culture war at this point and i just hope for everybody involved that there will be a sensible solution at some point.
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From Natalie Ryan's Instagram:
"The DGPT is removing me from the OTB Open. No matter where they go I will fight them every step of the way. If you thought I was fighting hard before, just wait. They are going to burn with me."
It is difficult to support this. Fight for your damages, Natalite, but don't threaten our sport.
She lost me with this statement.
"The DGPT is removing me from the OTB Open. No matter where they go I will fight them every step of the way. If you thought I was fighting hard before, just wait. They are going to burn with me."
It is difficult to support this. Fight for your damages, Natalite, but don't threaten our sport.
She lost me with this statement.
I saw two interesting comments from Chris Clark of disc golf dot law.
1 - the overturning of the TRO was based on lack of jurisdiction -- they claimed Dodge was a Virginia resident and he was not -- he lives in Massachusetts. T
2 - the ruling "apparently" applied to DGPT's appeal and not PDGA's appeal.
1 - the overturning of the TRO was based on lack of jurisdiction -- they claimed Dodge was a Virginia resident and he was not -- he lives in Massachusetts. T
2 - the ruling "apparently" applied to DGPT's appeal and not PDGA's appeal.
biscoe
* Ace Member *
Apparently some of the other Dodges who do live in Virginia are shareholders in some minor way.
Thank you.
Attachments
Well #2 is interesting. I don't know all the fine points of law involved, but DGPT's stance on Natalie's eligibility is entirely predicted on the PDGA criteria. It seems odd that this would really affect the basic case.
biscoe
* Ace Member *
The acceptance of the appeal was on a procedural issue unrelated to the substance of the case (diversity jurisdiction). It was based on DGPT having shareholders who dwell in the same state (commonwealth technically) as Natalie and thereby did not apply to the PDGA.
She's not threatening my sport.
Where that would concern me is if I was DGPT obsessed and the whole idea that has been speculated that DGPT isn't profitable, that it's propped up on Todd Rainwater's dime. So if you drag DGPT into court you take resources that would be propping up DGPT and pay lawyers with them. The result for the players would be reduced income. In that scenario, the players would all make more money if they just let Natalie play.
I've got no idea if that's the actual scenario, though.
Also that's a DGPT issue and the DGPT could fail and my sport will be fine. Disc golf has always been and still today remains a grass-roots sport. Anybody who quits playing disc golf because there is no DGPT was going to quit playing disc golf the next time something shiny caught their attention anyway. Disc golf will be fine regardless.
Correct. Disc golf needs neither the DGPT nor the PDGA.
Professional disc golf, however, is becoming more and more reliant on the tour and less reliant on the PDGA.
The tour could spin off from the PDGA and be very successful. The PDGA's budget could significantly shrink without the tour.
If a player threatens the tour, they are selfishly threatening ALL professional players.
I understand people will be emotional about this, but her language is threatening.
In any other business situation it would call for an investigation. In a job it would be grounds for dismissal. Like it or not, the dgpt is an advance in our sport. It allows many people to earn a living playing it. One person is not more important than that just my 2 cents.
It the pdga and dgpt were smart, they would create a male and female trans division. No discrimination.
I understand that.
However, if the suit against the PDGA can still go forward in federal court, the result of a ruling in Natalie's favor would still allow her to play, as the DGPT is entirely basing the exclusion of Natalie on the PDGA criteria. The OTB Open is structured as a PDGA sanctioned event.
It may be that in order for the suit to go forward it has to be refiled or that some other procedural hoops have to be jumped through. That's why I was saying I don't understand the finer points of the law.
PLEASE understand...the PDGA and CERTAINLY the DGPT, are NOT my sport. My sport was founded by local, volunteer, casual play and my lifelong passion has nothing to do with either. I will go play Worlds this year and then I am finished supporting the PDGA, with Heinold at the helm.
No surprise that Three Putt beat me to this.
Smigles
* Ace Member *
I thought that too, but this is not enforceable under the current laws. Once transitioned, there is no way to identify (except for self declaration) if a person was born with a gender or transitioned into it.
You do you. People who try to make a living playing disc golf certainly disagree.
I work with plenty of people looking to make a living off disc golf. Shirt manufacturers, coffee roasters, tournament and event planners, course designers and builders, disc sellers....they will continue to toil and attempt to make money. It has NOTHING to do with this clown show.
I have NEVER really cared about supporting a couple hundred athletes and their quest to thrash my sport. They seem to have been laser focused on that result and appear to be very close to success.
crd 81
Double Eagle Member
- Joined
- Oct 16, 2007
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Imagine the shoe being on the other foot and someone from the DGPT or PDGA saying something similar. If they did say that, people would be saying the DGPT and/or PDGA is threatening the trans community. Are to believe that Ryan's language is not threatening?
Smigles
* Ace Member *
Directly contradicted yourself there :hfive: For dramatic effect?
If you just wanna enjoy casual disc golf, nobody is stopping you and the DGPT has no effect on you. So good for you, keep enjoying it. What a couple hundred athletes do has no effect on you, right?
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