PDGA's New Disciplinary Process

[ru4por]

Fair enough, I'm biased as I will never get a PDGA Membership after they screwed me.

Injured as a spotter during a high profile event and the Executive Director of the PDGA at the time promised they would take care of my medical bills.

I sent in the appropriate paperwork and they denied it.

Didn't have the time or money to contest it.

The point is, I'm not the only person who likes to play in tournaments, but doesn't want to be a member of the PDGA.

But by playing sanctioned events, you are essentially doing it partially on my dime. As JC pointed out, most sanctioned events make use of the PDGA insurance. In many instances, you would not be give the opportunity to play any events without the PDGA.

I am sorry to hear about you getting injured.

 

[cheesethin]

.. Just to be clear I never said the bolded part..

Yeah, no worries, didn't mean to imply you did. Someone else did I think, but I can't multiquote on mobile, and I wanted to respond to the idea.

...and offered two different scenarios for non-members to play in sanctioned events.

Both of those scenarios deter the interested newcomer to the sport. Playing am1 or Pro is a punishment for the newb. Age protected excludes the under 40 noob.

And 'put them in their own class' has a bunch of noobs wandering around unsure of the rules and etiquette, feeling like they're not allowed to play with the big kids.

This is from my perspective in a small relatively young scene. Other more developed scenes may well have greater opportunities for the noob.

But let's not deter visitors to our realm, when we don't even know the size of the dragon we're trying to slay.


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[Armus Patheticus]

But by playing sanctioned events, you are essentially doing it partially on my dime. As JC pointed out, most sanctioned events make use of the PDGA insurance. In many instances, you would not be give the opportunity to play any events without the PDGA.

Thank you brother, for the dime. I'm another who will never be a PDGA member.

 

[JC17393]

But by playing sanctioned events, you are essentially doing it partially on my dime. As JC pointed out, most sanctioned events make use of the PDGA insurance. In many instances, you would not be give the opportunity to play any events without the PDGA.

I am sorry to hear about you getting injured.

FWIW, non-members pay the $10 fee primarily for insurance reasons. It's a temporary membership so they're covered under the PDGA's policy. So they're not really doing anything on "your dime".

 

[Plastic Thunder]

I would be fine with this if PDGA members could not play club events.........Nothing like having your touring pro buddy showed up at a club event to take all the money from, oh say Cedar Hills Summer Doubles.....

It currently does this. You have to be current to play A tiers or higher. I would like to see it be C tiers or higher and only allow non-members to play leagues.

 

[ru4por]

FWIW, non-members pay the $10 fee primarily for insurance reasons. It's a temporary membership so they're covered under the PDGA's policy. So they're not really doing anything on "your dime".

Sorry, I assumed that the 10 bucks went right into the tournament. I did not know it was sent into the PDGA.

 

[DiscFifty]

I just don't see how the PDGA can claim to have ratings protected divisions and turnaround and allow non-members with no rating to play in them.

:clap:

Yep. Even though TDs DO have the tools to verify ratings in previous events of non members to make sure they are playing the correct division, it's rarely done unless someone brings up a player to the TD.

 

[Jay Dub]

:clap:

Yep. Even though TDs DO have the tools to verify ratings in previous events of non members to make sure they are playing the correct division, it's rarely done unless someone brings up a player to the TD.

Them damn lazy TDs. :\

 

[Cgkdisc]

I just don't see how the PDGA can claim to have ratings protected divisions and turnaround and allow non-members with no rating to play in them....No rating, you don't qualify for those divisions but here are some that are not ratings protected you can choose from.

This is a TD option, not a PDGA call. Non current PDGA members without a PDGA rating have no "rights" to play in any ratings break am division. TDs are allowed to tell the player they need to play in the top am division for their age or open/pro for their age if they wish to enter.

 

[Armus Patheticus]

:clap:

Yep. Even though TDs DO have the tools to verify ratings in previous events of non members to make sure they are playing the correct division, it's rarely done unless someone brings up a player to the TD.

What if the player is using an alias?

 

[F.Luke]

What if the player is using an alias?

Only a waste of space would do that.

 

[DiscFifty]

What if the player is using an alias?

If the TD doesn't know the person, at check in ask for a license/id ?

 

[jenb]

This is a TD option, not a PDGA call. Non current PDGA members without a PDGA rating have no "rights" to play in any ratings break am division. TDs are allowed to tell the player they need to play in the top am division for their age or open/pro for their age if they wish to enter.

If they are not current PDGA members. But if they just bought a membership and have no rating yet, and if there is a rec or novice division, they qualify for that division. IIRC, TDs are prohibited from denying entry to any current PDGA member in any offered division for which they qualify and that has at least three players in that division. Allowing the TD to make them compete trophy only until they have a rating would alleviate some issues.

 

[cheesethin]

. But if they just bought a membership and have no rating yet, ... ...Allowing the TD to make them compete trophy only until they have a rating would alleviate some issues.

In theory this is an avenue for abuse (accidentally or intentionally).

But in reality, just how big is the problem of 'unrated new member playing in inappropriate division'?

My answer (guess) is - not big at all.





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[_MTL_]

I would be fine with this if PDGA members could not play club events.........Nothing like having your touring pro buddy showed up at a club event to take all the money from, oh say Cedar Hills Summer Doubles.....

are you referring to 2012 when the touring guys showed up to Cedar Hills Doubles on Tuesday? Or another time?

 

[jenb]

I haven't played a tournament since 2015, but when I was playing men's rec and trying to just cash, it seemed like it was every single tournament. Some new pdga member would play rec and get a score that would have won intermediate or even advanced. Then all the local tournaments made men's rec trophy only to address it, so I could no longer have a goal of trying to cash. So I lost interest in playing men's rec, and I had already gotten pushed into advanced women with my 828 rating. I had no other ladies to compete against locally, and never a men's novice division around here, So no more local tournaments for me.

 

[_MTL_]

If they are not current PDGA members. But if they just bought a membership and have no rating yet, and if there is a rec or novice division, they qualify for that division. IIRC, TDs are prohibited from denying entry to any current PDGA member in any offered division for which they qualify and that has at least three players in that division. Allowing the TD to make them compete trophy only until they have a rating would alleviate some issues.

This is partially correct, partially incorrect.

There is no minimum division size. That language is no where in the book.

However, TD's have the right to limit divisions offered and set things such as minimum division size.

Here's the language I choose to use at my events:

"All PDGA divisions, except Novice, are offered, however there must be three people in the division with the exception of women and junior divisions."

This allows me what I consider the good middle ground. If three 70 year olds wanna play my event. Rock on! But I'm not openning a division because a 70 year old doesn't want to compete against 50 year olds.

 

[araytx]

Fair enough, I'm biased as I will never get a PDGA Membership after they screwed me.

Injured as a spotter during a high profile event and the Executive Director of the PDGA at the time promised they would take care of my medical bills.

I sent in the appropriate paperwork and they denied it.

Didn't have the time or money to contest it.

The point is, I'm not the only person who likes to play in tournaments, but doesn't want to be a member of the PDGA.

Fair enough. However, that specific reasoning is only tangential to the arguments here. Your "they screwed me" argument, however valid it may be, is not because of ratings or anything like that.

 

[jenb]

In theory this is an avenue for abuse (accidentally or intentionally).

But in reality, just how big is the problem of 'unrated new member playing in inappropriate division'?

My answer (guess) is - not big at all.





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This is partially correct, partially incorrect.

There is no minimum division size. That language is no where in the book.

However, TD's have the right to limit divisions offered and set things such as minimum division size.

Here's the language I choose to use at my events:

"All PDGA divisions, except Novice, are offered, however there must be three people in the division with the exception of women and junior divisions."

This allows me what I consider the good middle ground. If three 70 year olds wanna play my event. Rock on! But I'm not openning a division because a 70 year old doesn't want to compete against 50 year olds.

There is language that the TD can require at least 3 players for a division, so it is pertinent that men's rec always has more than 3, and the TD can not prevent a current pdga member that qualifies for that division from playing it. So a new pdga member with no rating must be allowed to play men's rec unless the tournament is full. Allowing the TD to make that new member compete trophy only, perhaps with a reduced fee or larger players pack, would create another option to address this issue besides making the division trophy only.

 

[cheesethin]

There is no minimum division size. That language is no where in the book.

Without going back and working out what everyone said and meant... there is some language about numbers in divisions.

2.01
K. A Tournament Director may, by indicating it on the registration form, restrict the divisions offered in their event. Absent such notice, the Tournament Director shall offer for competition any division which has four or more players that are eligible and who wish to compete. Tournament Directors may offer divisions with fewer than four players at their discretion. (See Section 1.03 I)

If I read it correctly...

A unless the TD has given prior notice that they are NOT offering certain divisions, they MUST allow any division that have 4+ players.

Or differently phrased. A TD can only refuse to offer a division if there are 3 or fewer players or the TD gave prior notice.


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