Pro Worlds Tiered Registration (not the way you think)

[Cgkdisc]

Players can earn both Am and Pro points during the year based on the divisions they enter. However, the only point total that counts for an invite to Am or Pro Worlds is the one that matches your current member status in the PDGA whether Am or Pro. Pros with enough Am points do not get invited to Am Worlds and Ams with enough Pro points still do not get invited to Pro Worlds.

 

[Khao Pra]

And when your member status changes during the year?

 

[JC17393]

Last years am world champ competed in mpo the previous two years before winning am worlds, did that make him a pro playing am worlds?

Am Worlds champs earn an invite by winning Am Worlds. But that isn't what we're talking about here. I never said Ams can't play Pro Worlds. I said Ams aren't invited to Pro Worlds.

When the deadline passes for those invited members to sign up (according to this schedule), registration opens to amateurs over a certain rating (July 3) then any member of the PDGA (July 10). However, if the tournament fills before that, then no amateur is going to have a chance to take advantage of that.

The person I was responding to in this thread said that ams would be signing up and blocking higher rated pros from getting in. That is impossible because am members aren't invited and therefore can't sign up for Pro Worlds ahead of those invited high rated players.

 

[Cgkdisc]

Your member status (Am or Pro) when you renew in 2015 determines which 2015 Worlds you get invited to enter if you had enough points earned in that category in 2014 regardless of your member status at any time in 2014.

 

[Khao Pra]

Fair enough. Nobody can sign up before invited players though, regardless of membership status or player rating. You get an invite, you have this many days to sign up before the gates are opened...

 

[JC17393]

Fair enough. Nobody can sign up before invited players though, regardless of membership status or player rating. You get an invite, you have this many days to sign up before the gates are opened...

Right. And only pro members are invited, so no amateurs are going to "block" a high-rated pro from getting into Worlds.

 

[Khao Pra]

Your member status (Am or Pro) when you renew in 2015 determines which 2015 Worlds you get invited to enter if you had enough points earned in that category in 2014 regardless of your member status at any time in 2014.

So if I was an am who earned 1500 mpo points in 2014 (but accepted no cash) and signed up as am in 2015 and accepted cash in January, I'm defaulted to mpo but still don't get an invite based on my 2014 mpo points?

 

[Cgkdisc]

I'm not sure your Am status changes to Pro automatically in the PDGA database when you accept cash. The PDGA mainly catches it when you renew the next year and you have to renew as a Pro. Or, the PDGA will usually catch it if you tried to enter an Am Major the rest of that year.

 

[Khao Pra]

Right. And only pro members are invited, so no amateurs are going to "block" a high-rated pro from getting into Worlds.

Ok I'm just nit picking here but you said in your last post that the am worlds winner gets an invite to pro worlds and while I don't disagree with that in the slightest, that also means that it isn't only pro members who get an invite to pro worlds because he was am to play am worlds, and winning am worlds doesn't make you a pro

 

[Khao Pra]

I'm not sure your Am status changes to Pro automatically in the PDGA database when you accept cash. The PDGA mainly catches it when you renew the next year and you have to renew as a Pro. Or, the PDGA will usually catch it if you tried to enter an Am Major the rest of that year.

I hear what you're saying but in my opinion the TD needs to catch something like this and update the pdga, not leave potentially an entire year hanging in the balance. If I were an am player I wouldn't feel too happy about playing against someone who has been cashing all year but has to wait for January 1 to roll around to update a database.

Likewise if I were the am player earning mpo points that meet the invite requirement I would feel slighted to get an am invite even though I earned enough mpo points and accepted cash

 

[JC17393]

Ok I'm just nit picking here but you said in your last post that the am worlds winner gets an invite to pro worlds and while I don't disagree with that in the slightest, that also means that it isn't only pro members who get an invite to pro worlds because he was am to play am worlds, and winning am worlds doesn't make you a pro

Mea culpa here...I confused Worlds and USDGC on this one. Am Worlds champ gets an invitation to USDGC, not Pro Worlds. Of course, until recent years, Pro Worlds didn't fill so the Am World Champion generally had the opportunity to enter Pro Worlds at the last minute anyway.

My intent has only been to refute the first point that ams will sign up for Pro Worlds and block more "deserving" pros from getting in. An amateur can accrue Pro points all year long, but as long as they are still registered as amateur when invitations go out in February, they're not invited to Worlds. So no low rated am is going to prevent a high rated Pro from getting in. And frankly, since the dates of registration have been published since December, no Pro should have any excuse for not signing up the moment that registration opens.

 

[Cgkdisc]

It looks like last year's Am World Champs got invites to Pro Worlds this yea,r as long as they renewed as pros this year, even if they didn't have enough pro points in 2014 to get an invite.

 

[Rol6566]

When I said "AM" i mean someone who pays pro membership, earns pro points, but is only 940 rated, definitely not "pro". Such player would be middle advanced and couldnt compete in open

 

[Cgkdisc]

By that definition, most pros under age 40 are Ams. Gotta be at least 1020 to truly compete in Open at Worlds.

 

[Rol6566]

By that definition, most pros under age 40 are Ams. Gotta be at least 1020 to truly compete in Open at Worlds.

exactly, so why not just have it be those guys competing for worlds? Cut the size of the fields down and only have the best of the best.

The registration should be by ratings first, 1000+, then 970, 950, then open to all if it makes it that far, not a free for all like its going to be

 

[Cgkdisc]

Because then it wouldn't be a Worlds for PDGA members who actively participate the previous year and contribute to the purse they hope to shoot for even if it's not winning. The points system still remains an effective way to reward players for participation and doesn't undermine the chances for the top players to get in because they'll earn enough points by default.

 

[Rol6566]

Because then it wouldn't be a Worlds for PDGA members who actively participate the previous year and contribute to the purse they hope to shoot for even if it's not winning. The points system still remains an effective way to reward players for participation and doesn't undermine the chances for the top players to get in because they'll earn enough points by default.

But the way its set up now, a top pro could be left out if they dont reg fast enough

Im saying open it up to top players first, then the masses after. Right now they have it open for international, then canada, then a free for all.

 

[Khao Pra]

Because then it wouldn't be a Worlds for PDGA members who actively participate the previous year and contribute to the purse they hope to shoot for even if it's not winning. The points system still remains an effective way to reward players for participation and doesn't undermine the chances for the top players to get in because they'll earn enough points by default.

The points system works for me but it does probably need to be bumped higher again. I also prefer the old original format where your points are compared to your region first.

1,000 mpo points is nothing for a player from most major cities nowadays but is highly restrictive to foreign players with limited access to courses and sanctioned events.

My closest course is 1,000 miles away and has 1 sanctioned event per year. I literally have to fly at least 8-10 hours to compete and that makes points and rating difficult and expensive to maintain but if my points are compared only against others in my region I would still get an invite

 

[Cgkdisc]

International invites may not be based on points. At least in the past, any current International member was allowed to enter when reg opened.

 

[Khao Pra]

International invites may not be based on points. At least in the past, any current International member was allowed to enter when reg opened.

if that were the case this year i would have signed up for mpo, but i had only just over 500 mpo points last year, and i was only allowed to sign up for mpm where i had 0 points