RHFH Technique question

[PhillyPhan69]

Unfortunately I am not savvy enough to post a video....so I will describe my situation as best I can.

I have only recently been able to throw forehand, and have been practicing it once a week although outside of 1 desperation mid range shot I have not and do not desire to use it in a game due to my lack of accuracy and consistency. I did a thread in the newb section about a month ago in regards to what discs are good forehand discs....I was told by 1 individual "duh" (well that part was unnecessary) any disc you can throw rhbh you can also throw rhfh....I am finding this to be untrue in my limited test run/practice.

I generally throw disc rhbh in the 150-154 range (at least in regards to drivers), as I don't really have enough torque/snap for higher weight discs....yet rhfh it is the opposite my 167 champion valky has been my consistent longest thrower and most accurate (171 & 175 teebirds close behnd), but I can't throw them accurately rhbh....My consistent rhbh discs 150 & 152 leopard and teebirds, turn over when thrown rhfh after about 125-150 feet and then roll for another 100 feet or so....I kind of like this as I am not advanced enough to where I have practiced rollers or thumbers just yet. Anyway they turn over whether I release them flat and low or angled and high.....no matter what I do they become rollers....is this normal or do I likely have some OAT (or OTA) issues? Not sure how much help you can give without visual evidence.....I am working hard on my form elbow close in, hand facing up, follow through, flat/level low throws....I am getting decent distance compared to my rhbh, but my accuracy/consistency is very poor at this stage. Any tips or video suggestions would be appreciated!!!!!!

 

[tylerc]

those light discs are going to be tough to throw even with a good forehand, those are understable discs and when thrown with a forehand, which usually a forehand has a lot more speed and less spin than a backhand, are going to act way more understable than they do backhand. I would suggest trying out some heavier discs for on the course. but don't get highspeed or overstable discs. a valk is a great learning disc for a forehand.
try throwing your lighter discs forehand again but release them on a hyzer angle and take some speed off of them and focus on snapping the disc at the end. that should make them fly better

 

[Mike C]

Without seeing you throw or knowing the condition of your discs it's tough to say whether its your form or the discs.

The advice you were given is true. Every disc can be thrown RHBH or RHFH.

However, most people have much cleaner backhand form than they do FH.

Most people throw their flicks with anhyzer without realizing it. You'll see me mention that some in my embedded video.

Most people also generate a different spin and arm speed ratio with the two throwing styles. For any given throwing style, arm speed tends to destabilize a disc, while spin stabilizes it. Throwing any disc with high amounts of spin will cause it to hold the angle of release better, regardless of throwing style or release angle.

So the combination of low spin (Lack of wrist flick at the end and over reliance on strong arming), higher arm speed, accidental anhyzer and / or OAT is probably the cause of what you are seeing.

Light, flippy discs can certainly be flicked. I can control Magics on a 200' flick, 155g Craves on 300' flicks, 155g Inertias and Impulses on 375' flicks etc. But it's not as consistent for me as a stable mold, and that is after 3 years of practice.

Your RHFH and RHBH sound like they don't match up very well in certain areas, whether its the spin / speed ratio, overall power generated, or more OAT with one style compared to the other, so they are showing pretty different behaviors out of your disc. Posting a video would help us help you.

I'd suggest two things in the meantime you can do with those discs you're working with. Try to incorporate more wrist flick and less overall arm movement, and try throwing with some hyzer. Make sure you are lining up your shoulders with the hyzer release angle instead of trying to use just your arm to set up the follow through. A very common problem people have with flicks is trying to throw hyzer, but not getting their shoulders set on the hyzer line, so the result is trying to force a hyzer release with arm movements and they usually follow through flat. Going from hyzer to flat mid-throw imparts OAT on the disc and makes it fly more understable than a clean flat release.

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The easiest way to post a video is to record yourself with a digital video camera, or even a digital camera on video mode. Use a smart phone if you have nothing else. Then copy the file to your PC and upload it to youtube. Then post a thread in form analysis and while posting you'll notice a youtube button. Click that and it makes tags, like the tags used to make a word bold (Hold ctrl and press B while typing a reply to try that function out). Copy the youtube link, which looks like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b5Bu3_2Amvk See all that gibberish after the "v=" ? That is what you put in between the tags to make a video embed into your post, like this:

 

[PhillyPhan69]

Thanks for the advice so far!!!! I am heading out of town in a few days, so I might try this video thing in a couple of weeks......I am 45 and not really into possessions or technology....I still have an old flip phone (and rather than wanting a smart one I long for the day when I can throw it in the trash all together).....I do have a cheap digital camera....so perhaps I will try that....I am smart enough to watch a you tube video.....but uploading (or downloading...don't even know the proper phrasing) may be a whole different story even with your help....Thanks!!!!

 

[Mike C]

Feel free to PM me if you want more detailed advice on the video part of things. If you can tell me the model of camera you have I could walk you through it step by step most likely.

 

[PhillyPhan69]

Feel free to PM me if you want more detailed advice on the video part of things. If you can tell me the model of camera you have I could walk you through it step by step most likely.

I appreciate the advice and generous offer (It seems you are consistent in your attitude and willingness to help other DGers)...really wished someone offered lessons in this neck of the woods.....I will likely take you up on this offer in a couple of weeks, if I can't figure it out own my own....If you ever find yourself on the eastern shore of MD, give me a shout, I frequently get in trouble with my awesome wife by opening our house up to wayward travelers!

 

[The Mad Cow]

imho, the Valk is a great disc. FH, BH ... it's all good. you may not like it as much for FH in the beginning... but it will come.
for me personally, i had to start with my main focus on the " flick " part of the FH.
lead with the elbow, palm to the sky... then imagine you are trying to snap someone w/ a dish towel..
or crack a bull whip.
once i had control of the shot, THEN i added more reach back and THEN started playing w/ anny and hyzer. i carry a 175 champ valk, and when the line to the basket has to be dead straight... thats the disc i reach for. it will fade a bit more FH.... but as mentioned above, i feel thats a spin / speed issue.
i also like a champ Orc, and MVP Volt.the Orc is very forgiving if you are a lil off of a flat release.
it will straighten up and " fly right" quickly. the downside is: it also finishes right... sometimes WAY right lol.

 

[rhatton1]

Sorry bit late to this thread - but see attached drill which is a longer video for the Blake T sekret technique drill - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f9WC2NUJC_U (made for friends too lazy to do the reading themselves)

It is a brilliant drill for getting a lot more spin (and as Mike says stability) on any of the discs. I'm pretty sure following Blakes ideas (+ a ton of practice) is how Mikes sidearm has got so good. It focuses totally on the feeling of the strong disc pivot built by timing and needs minimal arm movement to achieve. More arm/body movements can be added later to increase distance further once you have the feeling of the "hit" down.

 

[Onyx]

Thanks for the bump rhatton1 you're helping with a local connection. I missed this thread completely.

PhillyPhan69 I live in Salisbury and play Schumaker and Horsebridge regularly. My primary throwing style is rhfh and if you'd like I'd be more that willing to come out and throw with you. I'm no Pro by any means but I should be able to give you some pointers regarding sidearm throws.

I'll call myself out because I also believe that any disc can be thrown forehand. I think it is a common misconception that you need a disc that is super overstable in order to sidearm. My primary go-to discs are the Ion, Envy, Crave and Resistor and other than the Resistor none of those discs are the "meathooks" that most backhand players would tell you to throw sidearm.

The primary focus for me is keeping my shoulders level with whatever angle i'm throwing on, not rolling my wrist over and turning my hips through the throw so that I don't try to throw using only arm strength.