The PDGA Should Suspend The National Tour

[ToddL]

Queue PDGA apologists MTL or JC...

Cue the spelling nazi

 

[JTacoma03]

Pro disc golf needs to split away from the PDGA, let the PDGA handle the am side, it's what they do best anyway.

I think this is one of the biggest growing pains that we're experiencing as a fanbase, and it is inevitable frankly that it happens.

but...

By the same token, the PDGA should wait for the DGPT to be much better established, before handing over the reins of a chunk of the pro tour.

This ^ - The DGPT for the first 4 years had the unfortunate combination of taking two steps forward, one step back in terms of being progressive while going only one forward and two back in terms of growing a brand.

What "most people"?

The mostly-Am PDGA membership keeps voting for directors who follow the current path---or acquiescing by not voting.

Food for thought:

In 2010 there were roughly 1/3rd as many active PDGA members as compared to 2018's year end numbers (most recent data) ~ 15k to ~45k

The ratio of Ams to Pros, you're right, has stayed constant. The Amro membership ratio is 3:1

We also know that PDGA renewal rates are constant too, funny enough also 1/3rd of registered #'s are active.

--

Now consider:

A rough demographic sketch - 61.24% of members in 2018 were between 20-39 yo. - which roughly translates to "Millenials".

There are now about as many members in the 30-34 yo bracket as there were in the 20-40yo bracket in 2010 (just shy of 10k people)

DG media consumption skews slightly younger - 15-35 is the big chunk of the distribution.

--

I think there is a change brewing in the answer to the old fallback question of "what do the ams want?" I think we are on the verge of seeing foundation-level changes to the wants of the average member, which will now more assertively demand a fan experience. This will necessitate the PDGA adjusting the strategy, or it will risk squandering this growth. People don't have to be PDGA members to play, nor do they have to be members to be fans right?

I also don't think Joe Chargulaaf is the kind of guy to enact change by walking in and flipping the table upside down. He's taken a patient approach, which I don't mind personally. Being a careful shepherd is fine, so long as you're listening to the flock.

This way of thinking is going to bite the PDGA in the ass one day.

At the same time, nobody is perfect, and people trying to pretend to be perfect to get exclusive positions has a ton to do (I feel) with why we don't generally trust politicians. It's a fine line to walk, and basically impossible to craft flawless blanket policy about.

You learn far more from failures than successes, I think it's more important to ask what experience is needed to help craft good policy than to try to police morality. It's not like this committee can enact policy anyway, it's an advisory board.

 

[JTacoma03]

Eh - missed the edit window. I don't like my phrasing of "police morality" - it brings in angles I'm not intending to address.

Let's pretend I said "rather than to play hall monitor"

 

[brutalbrutus]

I was thinking about this earlier. IF we ever get to a point where there are a couple hundred 1020+ "touring pros", and maybe the DGPT keeps expanding and/or the NT just merges into the DGPT, instead of doing the NTs maybe the PDGA could do a Q-school type series?

Whether they intended the Weema rule to be the first stage or not, it has opened up the future for an elites only tour. We are still plenty aways off I think but....opcorn:

 

[JTacoma03]

I was thinking about this earlier. IF we ever get to a point where there are a couple hundred 1020+ "touring pros", and maybe the DGPT keeps expanding and/or the NT just merges into the DGPT, instead of doing the NTs maybe the PDGA could do a Q-school type series?

Whether they intended the Weema rule to be the first stage or not, it has opened up the future for an elites only tour. We are still plenty aways off I think but....opcorn:

I think that ultimately would be the best possible outcome of a cooperative effort.

That would essentially have the PDGA be the orgnization helping guide people from amateur and college competition to minor league status, and then the DGPT handles the "Tour" aspect of being a professional.

I also wouldn't mind in this arrangement if the PDGA still maintained a large degree of control over Majors (similar to now).

 

[Steve West]

...
That would essentially have the PDGA be the orgnization helping guide people from amateur and college competition to minor league status...

Isn't that what Next Gen says they're doing?

 

[JTacoma03]

Isn't that what Next Gen says they're doing?

Their messaging is so convoluted I genuinely don't know what their ultimate goal is, other than to obviously become profitable.

I think they're trying to focus on Ams who want to be a pro...with the revolutionary idea of giving them cash!

...and having age protected divisions...

...and having a "Team" of touring pros...

I genuinely don't understand the connection between their gameplan and their goals (other than to make money). No disrespect intended, I'm sure it's well-meaning and all...

 

[trasf]

I always thought ngdg is just ama focused clone of dgpt, they just put a lot more effort on marketing that brand for every average joe out there. It could potentially pull a lot more players across nation and it needs to do that to get attention of bigger sponsors. It is risky to try keep it that large, but it's still better than dozen smaller ones fighting for players and small sponsorships.

 

[bogeyfreetilinfinity]

After reading the first section only, my response is this would be better recieved written by anyone other than Steve Dodge. I don't like what he's saying, as a fan, The NT events have a certain air of importance that get me excited for them and are well covered by the media. I'm going to give the article a chance and finish reading it, but jeeeeez does it sound like childish self promotion and dismissive of other people's efforts so far.

 

[DiscFifty]

but jeeeeez does it sound like childish self promotion and dismissive of other people's efforts so far.

Just in case you're out of the loop, Dodge does board games now and is not part of the DGPT anymore. Yep....board games. Among them...disc golf board games. yep..again..the game that you love to play outdoors, can now be played indoors...with cards and boards. Gets my adrenaline flowing just thinking about discs..and cards...and boards.

 

[Hampstead]

Just in case you're out of the loop, Dodge does board games now and is not part of the DGPT anymore. Yep....board games. Among them...disc golf board games. yep..again..the game that you love to play outdoors, can now be played indoors...with cards and boards. Gets my adrenaline flowing just thinking about discs..and cards...and boards.

Life is a board game about, uh, life. People living their lives still played it though.

 

[Hyzflip10]

I disagree that UDisc is better or easier to use than DGCR. And even though the courses I've designed are each rated about one star higher on UDisc, I don't really trust UDisc's ratings. Can you find extinct courses on UDisc? I haven't yet.

Just curious why extinct courses are that important to you?

 

[Casey 1988]

Just curious why extinct courses are that important to you?

He was just telling a thing that Udisc does not have, just so we can see in reviews or the like as to why an extinct course got closed as to not repeat some mistakes fixable that are under the design control or the poor location or the way the course never got broken parts fixed.

 

[DavidSauls]

If you're trying to look up a course that you only vaguely remember the name of, it's better to find it---marked extinct---than to keep trying and getting blank responses. At least you know when to give up.

 

[MikeK]

I'd put DGPT in charge. Sure, they still have a lot to learn, but the PDGA wants out of the business of running the NT, and eventually DGPT will take over anyway.

Wow how's that for prophecy?

And y'all just say I'm trollin'.

 

[ChrisWoj]

If you go back and read the conversation at that time - almost every response was "they look stable financially now, but let's wait and see."

But sure, enjoy the victory lap Mark.

 

[Broken Shoulder]

Wow how's that for prophecy?

And y'all just say I'm trollin'.

You get less and less likeable every day.

 

[DanJon]

Wow how's that for prophecy?

And y'all just say I'm trollin'.

If they could manage to run for a year or two without needing an infusion of cash I might agree with you. Right now they seem as likely to be gone in 3 years as to be in existence. Sugar daddies don't grow on trees.

This is still a great response considering that the DGPT can't survive two lawsuits.

 

[Serious-OLD]

Sorry, bad take.

Yes, the guy is morally reprehensible.

dgpt sucks.