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Throwing putters

HyzerUniBomber

* Ace Member *
Joined
Sep 9, 2013
Messages
2,036
Location
Denver, CO


I added some slow motion (1/2 speed) to the first 4 drives to help it be a bit more visible.

I know I'm not taking a big last step - I was just throwing putters and I was hitting between 250-280 and I have been suffering from some tennis elbow so I was trying to keep things really mellow and "easy".

I did notice that when I throw putters I turn on my toes, instead of heel. when I throw drivers I always pivot on my heel - I wonder if I'm unconsciously trying to make sure I don't dip my shoulder and put annie on the putters.

Any input is greatly appreciated.
 
You lean your spine backwards in the backswing, off balance, and you don't brace against your front leg effectively so you seem to be spinning out and leaking power.
 
You need to keep your knees bent and lean over more. You're coming upright too soon. I can't really see too much, but you might want to throw them a bit higher to get more distance.
 
Pull through is a little low while being so upright.

How far are they flying for you and what type of shot shape are you getting? Was your grouping consistent?
 
You lean your spine backwards in the backswing, off balance, and you don't brace against your front leg effectively so you seem to be spinning out and leaking power.

I think I know what you're saying... that I should have my upper body more upright at the furthest point in the reach back. Shoulders against the invisible wall. Bracing the leg is something I've always struggled with, especially in grass. I will work on that today, thank you!

You need to keep your knees bent and lean over more. You're coming upright too soon. I can't really see too much, but you might want to throw them a bit higher to get more distance.


More bending of the knees where exactly? I *feel* like I'm keeping my knees pretty bent - but I am very good at fooling myself.

Pull through is a little low while being so upright.

How far are they flying for you and what type of shot shape are you getting? Was your grouping consistent?

I was hitting between 250-280' on those drives, and definitely was throwing them a bit low a few times (losing about 50'). As I threw a bit higher, I was able to get them out longer for sure, but then I also seem to get more un-intentional turn. Still trying to balance the height with throwing them flat enough to avoid nose up stalls and turning them over.

My grouping is 4-5 of 8 putters are typically within 15-20' of the bucket from 250-260'. 3-4 putters will be 20-30', and I'll usually have 1 that's outside of 30'.

If I try to throw for pure distance and hit 300', I am way less accurate... typically 2 putters from 300' within 20'.
 
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I broke my form down a little bit against Will and Paul - I'm definitely bending at the waist during my reach back.

My approach line is a bit too closed.

I definitely have some room to pull the disc through my chest higher and closer.

Knees need to bend more "in" - right now I'm too straight legged.

I spent some time yesterday working on really hitting my plant foot and pivoting through on my heel. That really helped and stretched a few putters out to 325'.
 
your left arm is hindering more than helping your throw. Make it a part of your motion to increase efficiency.

Definitely will put that in the grey matter to work on soon. Thank you.

So more video... more throwing... more reviewing... more throwing.

cylAWbs.jpg


Slight improvement on having less closed stance and less leaning back.

Needless to say, changing your mechanics is TOUGH. I tell myself "no leaning back"... I feel like I'm staying way more upright, review the footage and I'm leaning back.

The screen shot above was the best of the round in terms of staying more upright.

The bending knees thing that Will is so adept at doing is HARD. Totally throws off rhythm.

I did notice that even the slight variation of leaning more forward did increase distance a bit, but more drastically it made me more precise (just not accurate yet).
 
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Watch the difference in balance during the x-step and the length of the x-step. You step way too deep and balance goes right behind the rear heel, toes lift off the ground, rear side posture/leverage gone. Need to keep your posture dynamically upright like a skier turning through moguls. You can turn your core back further upright than you can try to lean it.
 
SW - that's what I'm shooting for now. Espen definitely has more upward hop, which is helping me avoid that leaning backwards.

It's really difficult work trying to tweak all these things, but I'm determined to get it right.

Focused on the upright hop, upright reach back and spinning on the plant foot instead of stepping through.

Thanks guys.
 
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Another round of fieldwork. Making some small progress. Still over my back leg, though less than I was.

Only throwing putters. Lots of groupings at 280-300 with the furthest hitting 325, with a 5-10mph headwind. That's definitely better than I was throwing a week ago.

SW - I went through that video and broke it down to really see some good reference points :

http://heavydisc.blogspot.com/2014/06/getting-picky-on-backhand.html
 
Some good analysis in there and looks a little better. I wouldn't say the pros spin out, they pivot. Spin out is bad, that means there is a loss of resistance to torque against which results in a long slow spin of the foot typically. Pivot is a kinetic release of torque and is typically super fast and short. You are spot on about being uncoiled as late as possible in the x-step, I'm loose as a goose until my front foot begins striding forward past the rear foot and then my core loads down into the rear leg/hip as the upper body stays back(still in posture against the rear leg) with the front foot moving forward.

Moser does a different hop than others like Ulibarri used to where the rear leg never crosses behind, and they do a little two hop on the rear foot. You have to maintain good balance to do this type hop move or you will fail miserably. I'd also note Moser doesn't throw quite as far as the other top guys, but he putts and approaches lights out!

The Brinster, GG, Feldy type hop is what I've become most comfortable with although I can throw nearly as far from a non hop x-step, but I tend to spray more left and right without the hop. I feel the hop helps pivot the body back in the backswing as you move forward, it's more like a dance move and it adds rhythm and consistency on long bombs, and more weight shift which helps direct the energy more forward.

Will's technique seems to be the hardest to replicate, it's actually similar to a backhanded bowling technique. His technique is also quite similar to the Jarvis brothers but his posture is more folded and hence doesn't quite throw as far as them as his rotation or speed is restricted, but this maybe a compensation for accuracy as he is braced to the max like throwing the momentum of a bowling ball against the front leg.

The first frame of your pic, looks like you are hopping too far forward, as your balance is leaning forward. The hop should be a little more vertical so you don't have to lunge your front leg forward so you don't face plant. Going more vertical also helps load your weight more back(down into rear foot as a scale would read higher than your actual weight) into the rear foot/leg/hip as you come down and then stride forward to plant, then brace the lower spine against the front leg so the scale would then read higher than your actual weight but still maintaining dynamic athletic upright stacked posture(skier turning). The front leg has to resist turning to torque/post against it.

In the second frame of your pic, your arm is already hugging. Your elbow never has a chance to get forward so your release is really like a foot or two behind where it should be, see Masterbeto vid where he talks about "going from back here to up here adds anywhere from 60-100' or more". You should either have your shoulders turned back another 45 degrees with the same arm/disc position, so your right shoulder blade is facing the target, or your elbow should be forward of the shoulder with the disc near the right pec at that point. Your posture is not stacked with the shoulders over hips over knees over toes. Rear foot is flat on the heel and TOES OFF THE GROUND! Try throwing a jab with your rear toes in the air and heel on the ground, you can't move your weight forward into the snap of the jab that way.

The third frame is massive hugging and high shoulder and rear side posture/leverage gone trying to push off the rear heel. Your upper arm should be more Barry Shultz/Nate Doss wide, so the shoulder and arm are more connected to whip a heavy momentum(sledgehammer) forward. Your shoulder is too high, far ahead of the arm and open around to the target, so your whip ends up around your body to the right instead of straight through your core/center targetward from a lower shoulder position unless you are content throwing high anhyzers and rollers.
 
That analysis is fantastic, do you mind if I add into the blog post (attributed to you)? I have to dig through some more footage tonight, thank you!
 
I'm going through some of your videos, trying see the points where I'm early or late. I can see that I'm opening early - probably due to being forward in the hop from the start (off balance).

That's what I'll work on today, less forward momentum in the hop. Weighting the back foot during landing - transferring it forward from my rear foot toes.

My shoulder is definitely high, and my putters are all flying on annie lines unless I throw it drastically nose down or on a hyzer.

Going to close that plant foot more perpendicular and get the chin down.

I will see what I can do about the hugging - I do think I'm getting elbow out front - but I'm not taking full advantage of the whip by opening up early.

HAuCbCL.jpg


Clearly my head and shoulders are open here - substantially more.

Since so much happens in about 1/8 of a second it's really hard to get it all right... more work to do.
 
Rewatched the beto video, put the kick into action - helps a bit. But I'm still reaching back sometimes - bending at waist, still struggling to really plant my spine against my plant leg.

Take it down to just the basics, really slow... still not doing it right, with the added problem that my release is also jacked because I've gotten accustomed to opening too early.

Soooooo frustrating, very very difficult day in the field. I'll post some truly horrid video in a bit.
 
Still leaning out of posture back and forth and trying to push off the rear heel with the rear knee extended.

Check these vids:
http://www.dgcoursereview.com/forums/showthread.php?t=106710

and this vid you can see in the previous pic where I'm maintaining my tilted axis and chest trapped forward into compression against the knees and you are jumping out of posture:
 
So I went out to try to incorporate the video above - head on the inside, tilted. The best way I can describe it, is that I know where I'm supposed to end up... but now I'm very stuck even at the slowest pace getting into that position dynamically.

Meaning, I can get myself into that braced position - but once there, I don't feel like I can throw, and I can't seem to "slide into" that position in order to throw.

Is there a way to think about it that makes this transformation easier? Should I be thinking along the lines of hockey stopping or ski checking speed - and then having all my energy pivot up and right?
 
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