Stop asking if you are outside the circle!

[krupicka]

The better answer than stand and deliver is deliver and stay (when not on the tee). Most people already are doing this when not jump/step putting. (Play a round and pay attention to what you do naturally):
(Please note these are not current rules, nor are they slated for 2025)

802.07.A If the lie has been marked by a marker disc, then when the disc is released, the player must:
1. Have at least one supporting point that is in contact with the lie and remains there until balance is demonstrated; and,
2. Have no supporting point closer to the target than the rear edge of the marker disc; and,
3. Have all supporting points in-bounds.

This solves half of the jump putt problem by requiring that a foot stays on the lie after release. You can still run-up, you can still follow-through.
The slightly more radical approach to also address the current need to gauge whether a forward foot lands before release is to allow it.

802.07.A If the lie has been marked by a marker disc, then when the disc is released and until balance is demonstrated, the player must:
1. Have at least one supporting point that is in contact with the lie; and,
2. Have no supporting point that is both closer to the target than the rear edge of the marker disc and less than 10m from the target; and,
3. Have all supporting points in-bounds.

 

[Money_Shot]

I begin with a story. Lead card, final round, scores were tight. A player who is notoriously problematic asks if he is outside the circle for a jump putt or not. He was right at the circle's edge, no tassels in the ground.

As I say no, another player says yes. He is confused, beginning to get frustrated, and asks for clarification. The fourth player on the card says he doesn't know, I say just jump it, I don't care. He step putts, misses, rolls to 30, misses the come back putt and takes a bogey.

He's upset, and wants answers. "You guys could have given me a straight answer instead of that back and forth bullsh*t."

It's not my job to help with your decision making on the course. It's not my job to help you avoid breaking the rules. Sure there should be a clear indicator where C1 is on every course, but that's just not how it is. It's up to me to call you on rules violations, that's it. I have a system where I walk-off almost every C2 attempt. Anything 11 steps and over, I jump, anything close or under 11 steps, I treat as a C1 attempt. I don't ask, I don't verify, it's up to my card mates to call me on a foot fault if they believe I broke the rules.

Asking, "am I out" slows down the game, takes pressure off you as a player and puts it on your opponents. Stop it. Take accountability for your lie and your actions, leave me out of it.

End Rant.

I personally don't play tournament, but play competitive with friends that do play in tournaments and want our competitive play to be "by the rules". I have one in particular that asks when in question a fair amount and the other will ask too when uncertain. To say the time it takes either one of them to ask "am i out of the circle" is too much and slows the game down is absolutely ridiculous. The only time it would take maybe even 1 minute if it was so close that there was a disagreement between players, at which point there should be discussion. If you don't want the question, maybe there shouldn't be the option to call another player on a foot fault altogether? the time it takes to ask that question and someone to respond to it is at best....5 seconds. Chill out man, its a game and 5 seconds is probably considerably less time than it would take that guy to assess that situation on his own while trying to ensure he is playing by the rules.

 

[Steve West]

The better answer than stand and deliver is deliver and stay (when not on the tee). Most people already are doing this when not jump/step putting. (Play a round and pay attention to what you do naturally):

This solves half of the jump putt problem by requiring that a foot stays on the lie after release. You can still run-up, you can still follow-through.
The slightly more radical approach to also address the current need to gauge whether a forward foot lands before release is to allow it.

Even though they are quoted and look official, those aren't real rules yet, right?

 

[krupicka]

Even though they are quoted and look official, those aren't real rules yet, right?

Those are just how the rules would look if it was desired to go down that route.

 

[F.Luke]

Those are just how the rules would look if it was desired to go down that route.

I would stop using a marker disc if that became a rule.

 

[DeanMoriarty]

Am I outside the circle?

 

[Sewer bill]

Am I outside the circle?

Only if you're going to turbo.

 

[gammaxgoblin]

"In or out?" - 2 seconds to ask, 2-3 second reply....not seeing much time added here =)

 

[ILUVSMGS18]

Only if you're going to turbo.

I'm going to use that as a response at some point...

Those are just how the rules would look if it was desired to go down that route.

Can we go down that route, or at least explore going down that route?

 

[F.Luke]

…Can we go down that route, or at least explore going down that route?

I really hope not.

 

[Steve West]

I really hope not.

Please elaborate. (Or point me to a post you already made which I'm too lazy to look for.)

 

[F.Luke]

Please elaborate. (Or point me to a post you already made which I'm too lazy to look for.)

I don't believe step or jump putting is an issue when legally used.

 

[Dcinmd]

I don't believe step or jump putting is an issue when legally used.

And you easily debunked the idea of using a marker as a reference for the type of throw allow.

I am not in favor of any rule that limits the follow thru of a shot. I have enough knee and hip issues without trying to keep both feet behind the lie during a throw.

 

[krupicka]

And you easily debunked the idea of using a marker as a reference for the type of throw allow.

I'm not sure what you are referring to. Can you explain what you are talking about?
I think you might be misunderstanding the use of marker disc in the rules, but it may be I'm completely missing something else you posted.
Current rules:

802.07.A If the lie has been marked by a marker disc,...

802.05.D ... The marker disc, or marker, is the disc used to mark the lie according to 802.06.

802.06 Marking The Lie

 

[R-Ogre]

Standstill is totally a skill. Throwing a standstill well still often involves following through past your lie since body rotation is important, especially for those of us with aged joints... There needs to be some provision in the rules to allow people from a certain distance to follow through. That distance can be adjusted and wouldn't bother me. Different by division would be ok too but would make ratings that much more of a headache... (I stand no benefit, I only step/jump in pretty specific situations and have no issue spin putting out to 70', even here at 5000' elevation. Sea level it feels like putts can just go forever...

It would get rid of a lot of whining about fairway conditions too. "iTs ToO rOuGh/SlIpPeRy FoR a RuNuP" well then throw a standstill ya numpty, this isn't some Nancy sport, we play out in the woods. Dealing with wet grass, slopes, rocks, roots, stumps etc is part of the skill set.

 

[Dcinmd]

I'm not sure what you are referring to. Can you explain what you are talking about?
I think you might be misunderstanding the use of marker disc in the rules, but it may be I'm completely missing something else you posted.
Current rules:

Luke stated he simple would not mark his lie.

Hence the new rule would not effect a throw shot that is not marked. Is that incorrect?

802.07.A If the lie has been marked by a marker disc, then when the disc is released and until balance is demonstrated, the player must:

 

[krupicka]

That's why I quoted the subset of rules above. In the rules, a marker disc is either your thrown disc or your mini, depending on which you use. The part bolded in your quote is the current text in 802.07.A and is used to differentiate between a lie on a teeing area vs a lie elsewhere.

 

[Dcinmd]

That's why I quoted the subset of rules above. In the rules, a marker disc is either your thrown disc or your mini, depending on which you use. The part bolded in your quote is the current text in 802.07.A and is used to differentiate between a lie on a teeing area vs a lie elsewhere.

Thank you for clarify. It would be much simple to call it a throw disc like 802.06.A rather than a marker disc. The word marker implies one had made a mark.

 

[biscoe]

It would get rid of a lot of whining about fairway conditions too. "iTs ToO rOuGh/SlIpPeRy FoR a RuNuP" well then throw a standstill ya numpty, this isn't some Nancy sport, we play out in the woods. Dealing with wet grass, slopes, rocks, roots, stumps etc is part of the skill set.

Unfortunately the game (presumably led by the Pro Tour) has been running away from "play it as it lies" for a few years now.

 

[DumfriesLizzie]

I don't think there is a currently-legal technique in disc golf (perhaps other than tapping in) that does not require some degree of skill. Even the obviously-hated step and jump putts. As some have mentioned, if you are throwing after leaving the ground, you not only are illegal but just killed some (most?) of your power. Why do that? The ground provides the leverage to generate the power. Also someone mentioned that the forehand was previously a no-no. And probably the roller too at some point. And floppy putters like the Blowfly, I suspect. I say let the sport evolve. Whatever is such a bad idea that a majority of players hate it will die a natural death.