2017 Glass Blown Open

[Stardoggy]

They're good courses for filming and spectators. Centrally located, so more people can make the journey. And they put on great tourneys with good sponsors.

That doesn't mean the courses are great, though.

 

[biscoe]

Top notch courses is WAY down the list of things an area needs to host a big event.

 

[onemilemore]

They're good courses for filming and spectators. Centrally located, so more people can make the journey. And they put on great tourneys with good sponsors.

That doesn't mean the courses are great, though.

I had very little respect for the Emporia courses until I saw them in person. As much as it looks like a hyzerfest on film, there's a lot more nuance to them than comes across. They're better than people give them credit for.

 

[Stardoggy]

I had very little respect for the Emporia courses until I saw them in person. As much as it looks like a hyzerfest on film, there's a lot more nuance to them than comes across. They're better than people give them credit for.

I don't doubt that...but I have plenty of friends that travel down to play the GBO, and have told me personally that the courses are nothing special.

 

[esdubya]

I really enjoyed the coverage from Jomez and CCDG. The courses to me look to be top notch. Olpe films as really nice balance of open and wooded with a fair amount of drama inducing risk/reward shots to be forced out of the best players. If people are criticizing Olpe or Jones Park that just shows that the internet trolls will criticize anything because they can. Keep up the good work Emporia scene. Can't wait to see next years edition.

I wonder if tournament organizers can reserve the Sunday for a make-up day in the case of bad weather? It really doesn't look good to just have to end a tournament without playing the final round. I know players schedules would be impacted, but if they all knew about this up front - to keep Sunday open in case of bad weather - it could work no? Easy for me to say sitting in my comfy desk chair I know..

 

[DinosaurThunder]

I wonder if tournament organizers can reserve the Sunday for a make-up day in the case of bad weather? It really doesn't look good to just have to end a tournament without playing the final round. I know players schedules would be impacted, but if they all knew about this up front - to keep Sunday open in case of bad weather - it could work no? Easy for me to say sitting in my comfy desk chair I know..

Only thing that comes to mind for me - this would force each competitor to book an additional nights stay for a day that may, or may not be used. I would bet anyone on a tight budget/travel schedule would risk it and not book the additional night. By all accounts, this is pretty odd to happen to 3 top tier events over the past 6 months.

 

[lyleoross]

Last year, after world's and the birdifest it was, I didn't think much. Clearly some adjustments were made or the wind changed. Nope, they aren't Maple Hill or some of the other amazing courses out there, but someone is working hard to increase the experience.

You don't have to look far to see why this is an NT. The DD guys are working their donkeys off.

Best pro commentators, Nate and Jerm
Best full coverage commentators, Terry and Robert
Best edited commentators, overall, Ian and the quarterback guy... Cory

 

[JC17393]

Only thing that comes to mind for me - this would force each competitor to book an additional nights stay for a day that may, or may not be used. I would bet anyone on a tight budget/travel schedule would risk it and not book the additional night. By all accounts, this is pretty odd to happen to 3 top tier events over the past 6 months.

This is exactly right. It's not like we're talking about something like the PGA tour where things can spill over into Monday in the event of inclement weather. Nearly every competitor there does it for a living and doesn't have a job to get back to once the tournament is over (other than the next tournament). Odds are also good that an extra night's accommodations wouldn't even put a noticeable dent in their prize winnings for the weekend, even for the last paid spot. Can't say the same about a disc golf tournament where typically the top prize is, at best, barely going to cover the winner's expenses for the weekend.

 

[biscoe]

I bet we will see some tournaments in 2018 who put a provision for an extra day in place should a day get canceled due to weather.

Growing pains.

 

[DinosaurThunder]

I bet we will see some tournaments in 2018 who put a provision for an extra day in place should a day get canceled due to weather.

Growing pains.

I hope not - That favors our top earning competitors or those who live in a traveling vehicle. These tournaments would be nothing without selling out competitor fields and promising that amount of traffic/eyeballs to sponsors. Disc golf still needs to make decisions with the whole field in mind, not just the top touring pro's (safety, accommodations, additional costs etc.). There is no guarantee the extra day would be nice weather, so they could easily be caught in a lose lose scenario.

 

[_MTL_]

I hope not - That favors our top earning competitors or those who live in a traveling vehicle. These tournaments would be nothing without selling out competitor fields and promising that amount of traffic/eyeballs to sponsors. Disc golf still needs to make decisions with the whole field in mind, not just the top touring pro's (safety, accommodations, additional costs etc.). There is no guarantee the extra day would be nice weather, so they could easily be caught in a lose lose scenario.

THIS!!!

The middle level pro who travels in and plays randomly is really what funds top pros. Top pros should be doing ANYTHING they can to increase field sizes because all it does is increase the purse and their odds of finishing within the cash.

 

[Cgkdisc]

A change in the U.S. that would help with pro tour expenses in general is using more cuts to Semis and Finals like Europe and other International events have been doing for years. It's been the format in disc sports Overall events since they started in the 70s. Ball golf cuts after two of four rounds. Not only would cuts reduce expenses for those likely to miss cashing, but it would allow more flexibility in delays and rescheduling the remaining players if weather becomes a factor. Plus at least in the case of ball golf and Vibram, those who make the cut get paid. So playing an additional day due to a delay is a bit less painful.

 

[_MTL_]

A change in the U.S. that would help with pro tour expenses in general is using more cuts to Semis and Finals like Europe and other International events have been doing for years. It's been the format in disc sports Overall events since they started in the 70s. Ball golf cuts after two of four rounds. Not only would cuts reduce expenses for those likely to miss cashing, but it would allow more flexibility in delays and rescheduling the remaining players if weather becomes a factor. Plus at least in the case of ball golf and Vibram, those who make the cut get paid. So playing an additional day due to a delay is a bit less painful.

I'm way less likely to travel to a large event with a cut because I'm traveling for the experience.

If I'm only guaranteed two rounds, I'm not traveling.

 

[biscoe]

I hope not - That favors our top earning competitors or those who live in a traveling vehicle. These tournaments would be nothing without selling out competitor fields and promising that amount of traffic/eyeballs to sponsors. Disc golf still needs to make decisions with the whole field in mind, not just the top touring pro's (safety, accommodations, additional costs etc.). There is no guarantee the extra day would be nice weather, so they could easily be caught in a lose lose scenario.

Some (probably not me) would argue that until there are events which cater ONLY to the touring pros there is no actual pro tour. Of course that brings about all sorts of chicken or the egg questions about major sponsorship, etc.

 

[biscoe]

I'm way less likely to travel to a large event with a cut because I'm traveling for the experience.

If I'm only guaranteed two rounds, I'm not traveling.

yep- this.

 

[DGStein]

Cut the field after round 2 in all divisions. There would be less congestion and backups on the final round. Cut line will be determined by the number of participants and where the payout falls in each division. Maybe the players that make the cut are within 2 or 4 shots from last payout.
If weather interferes with the final round, all divisions would be canceled except FPO and MPO. With smaller fields, they could try to fit it in later in the day. Otherwise they should schedule it the following morning. If your not able to play the final round on the make-up day, you go on a opt-out list. Depending on how many players choose to opt-out, you could still place and cash out. If you were the top positioned players on the opt-out list, you will be the first opt-out players to receive cash, but after all of the players that decided to play the final round.

I have a feeling most top players would play the make-up day if something like this was implemented. For the GBO, I feel like this could have been possible since the final round was scheduled for Saturday.

 

[Cgkdisc]

I'm way less likely to travel to a large event with a cut because I'm traveling for the experience.

If I'm only guaranteed two rounds, I'm not traveling.

Then you are thinking like many amateurs not a pro, similar to the many pros who likely think this way. The way to handle that would be for event hosts to always have a rebuy-in event on a different course for those who do not make the cut, weather permitting. Wasn't there an optional event for those cut at USDGC some years?

Note that bigger PRO fields do not always help the top position payouts if you have a fixed amount of added cash. Skeptics can test this with the PDGA payout calculator.

Quick example with $100 entry fee and 40% paid places in both cases:

Added cash $10,000
Field: 25 1st place=$3250
Field: 75 1st place=$2485
Field: 150 1st place=$2455

Added cash $5000
Field: 25 1st place=$1950
Field: 75 1st place=$1715
Field: 150 1st place=$1900

When you consider true pro play is about entertainment to generate spectators and viewers and we can only cover one group live with the women's clips inserted, wouldn't restricting the field size to maybe the top 16 men and 8 women for NT and ET events be the smarter thing to do so they can truly have a shot to survive on tour? If this model proves sustainable financially, more players can be added in the future.

We're only talking about the elite events. Lower ranked/rated open players would be able to play in all of the other A-tier events to try and qualify to make it in the restricted NT/ET events. One added benefit with these elite events would be the ability to sometimes set up a few safari holes to take advantage of the limited foliage or elevation on some course sites. Some holes might cross others or use the same pin. But if done well, there would not be any interference with only 6 foursomes moving in a pack on the course.

 

[onemilemore]

I'm way less likely to travel to a large event with a cut because I'm traveling for the experience.

If I'm only guaranteed two rounds, I'm not traveling.

This encapsulates exactly where the sport is right now. It's at a crossroads between which segment of players to cater to, and I am not sure there is a correct answer yet.

 

[_MTL_]

This encapsulates exactly where the sport is right now. It's at a crossroads between which segment of players to cater to, and I am not sure there is a correct answer yet.

Until there is larger sponsors and we aren't playing for each other's money, we really don't have a choice of which end to cater to.

Our sport still is concerned with quantity and not quality. When that shift happens, look out.

 

[sjberry2017]

When you consider true pro play is about entertainment to generate spectators and viewers and we can only cover one group live with the women's clips inserted, wouldn't restricting the field size to maybe the top 16 men and 8 women for NT and ET events be the smarter thing to do so they can truly have a shot to survive on tour? If this model proves sustainable financially, more players can be added in the future.

We're only talking about the elite events. Lower ranked/rated open players would be able to play in all of the other A-tier events to try and qualify to make it in the restricted NT/ET events.

So, sort of like how there is the PGA tour, and then the Web.com tour? I like the idea, but I'm not sure if having the entire tour schedule (whatever tour it is) would be the way to start, although I could see the sport growing to where that would be possible.

What I would do is have two parts to the tournament; the first part is the first two or three rounds where pros compete for payout based on tournament entry fees, and then a final round where a qualified few compete for added cash bonuses. You'd have, say, a prequalified top 16 [could be whatever number, I'll use 16] for the bonus round who get to play for the added cash provided they met a certain threshold during the regular tournament (say, finished in the cash or top 50% or whatever), then the top 4 players from the weekend who aren't already qualified get a bid into the bonus round as well (expand to top 5, 6 or what have you based on players who did not meet the threshold but were qualified). This bonus round could be a Final 9 or a full 28 or any sort of permutation you want, and could be flexible based upon the weather, if that means pushing it back a day or shortening the round to fewer holes. If the round just can't be played, the added cash gets divided based on the regular tourney. If a player can't stick around, their finishing order is based upon which players left and either a points system for the season or their finishes in the regular tournament, and the remaining players battle it out.

Now, in my mind, the prequal could be set in two main ways. Either it's based on whoever finished in the top 16 of the added cash round the last tournament, or a points system based off finishes in the elite tour and possibly A-tiers, PDGA points, or any other meaningful rank of the player's ability. There could also be past world champ and tour champ exemptions, winner of that tournament exemptions, etc.

This way people traveling to play have something to play for, are guaranteed a competitive round, whoever adds the cash still gets lots of eyeballs at the tournament, the top pros have a way to get some extra cash, and there is some flexibility on the event of weather.