Are bad attitudes ruining disc golf??

[knettles]

These stupid forums and sissy complaining will ruin the sport quicker than a few frustrated pros.

Ha! Not trying to pick a side or anything, but if some of the forums of the infamous DGCR haven't ruined disc golf yet, I don't think they ever will.

 

[Nemmers]

I had the displeasure of watching bad attitudes and lack of respect for other players recently. Am I the only one that is seeing this progressing? And in the process, rewarding those players who have bad attitudes with sponsorships at major disc golf manufacturers. Makes guys like me, who are not top pros, never want to play a major tournament again. Does these manufacturers hold some responability on managing their talent? Do they not enforce rules on ethics and sportsmanship? Or is it really about getting that last dollar from us fans who buy everything no matter who is slinging it?

 

[ru4por]

The ultimate demise of our game is highly over-exaggerated.......here......daily.

 

[Zimmy]

I don't play tournaments (still pretty new), but couldn't you call the offending player out on his/her bad behavior and start taking adding strokes? By the rules, you have to follow the rules, and enforce the rules, or that's against the rules.

http://www.pdga.com/rules/official-rules-disc-golf/801-general/80104-courtesy

801.04 Courtesy
Last updated: Monday, December 24, 2012 - 18:20
Players should not throw until they are certain that the thrown disc will not distract another player or potentially injure anyone present.
Players should watch the other members of their group throw in order to aid in locating errant throws and to ensure compliance with the rules.
Players should take care not to produce any auditory or visual distractions while other players are throwing. Distracting actions include: shouting, cursing, freestyling, striking course equipment, throwing out of turn, throwing or kicking golf bags, throwing minis, and advancing on the fairway beyond the away player. Shouting at an appropriate time to warn someone in danger of being struck by a disc is not a courtesy violation.
Refusal to perform an action expected by the rules, such as assisting in the search for a lost disc, moving discs or equipment, or keeping score properly, is a courtesy violation.
Littering is a courtesy violation.
Courtesy dictates that players who smoke should not allow their smoke to disturb other players. Disposing of a cigarette butt by dropping it on the ground is littering.
A player violating a courtesy rule may be warned by any affected player, even if from another group, or by an official. The player shall be assessed one penalty throw for each subsequent courtesy violation of any type in the same round. Repeated violations of courtesy rules may result in disqualification in accordance with Section 3.3 of the Competition Manual.

http://www.pdga.com/rules/competition-manual/section-3-player-code-conduct/33-player-misconduct

3.3 Player Misconduct
Last updated: Monday, December 24, 2012 - 18:05
The PDGA adopts a strict policy of appropriate behavior during events, as well as appropriate comments to the media. Any conduct deemed to be unprofessional is subject to disqualification by the Tournament Director, and may also be subject to further disciplinary actions from the PDGA.

Players are expected to behave in a professional and sportsmanlike manner while participating in a PDGA sanctioned event. Actions that are in violation of this conduct include but are not limited to:

Repeated and overt use of abusive or profane language

Throwing items in anger (other than discs in play)

Overt rudeness to anyone present

Willful and overt destruction, abuse or vandalism of property, including animal and plant life

Cheating: a willful attempt to circumvent the rules of play

Physical attacks or threatening behavior to anyone present

Activities which are in violation of Federal, State or Local laws or ordinances, park regulation or disc golf course rule. Tournament Directors are granted the discretion to disqualify a player based on the severity of the offending conduct. An official warning prior to disqualification may be issued by a Tournament Director where appropriate.

The possession of illegal substances in violation of Federal, State or Local laws. The use of marijuana is not permitted at PDGA events, regardless of the possession of a medical marijuana card.

Excessive use of alcohol at the tournament site.

Possession of alcohol from the start of play until the player's scorecard is submitted is not allowed. Such possession shall result in immediate disqualification at PDGA events sanctioned at B-Tier or higher. The Tournament Director may, at his sole discretion, elect to issue a warning to the offending player in lieu of disqualification solely at PDGA events sanctioned at C-tier and below. If a player has been previously issued a warning for alcohol possession at the same event, all subsequent violations shall result in immediate disqualification.

Overt failure or refusal to enforce the rules of disc golf during competition.

Failure or refusal to cooperate with, or obstruction of any investigation by an official into the competitor's conduct or the conduct of another competitor.

Deliberately seeking to manipulate ones player rating through intentional misplay or withdrawal.

Tournament Directors are required to report any disqualifications to the PDGA as quickly as possible.

Disqualified players shall forfeit any prize money or merchandise and shall not receive a refund of entry fees.

Players who commit Player Misconduct may also be subject to disciplinary actions. To find out more information, see the PDGA Disciplinary Process

 

[Anon]

anybody that thinks negativity on a stupid message board is ruining the sport is WAAAYYYY too sensitive and lacks perspective.

disc golf is fine.

jahbless.

 

[Allurex]

Still, all I'm getting out of these complaints is vague, vague, vague, and more vague. Still no names or specific examples of behavior that they are complaining about, and certainly no specific complaints of behavior that isn't already handled by players giving out warnings or violations in accordance with PDGA rules.

People looooooove to complain about Nikko Locastro and a handful of other players that sometimes show frustration, or are more openly emotional than others. There are more guys, but Nikko is the one people love to bring up most often (at least around here).

Some people claim that these players are whiners, cry-babies, or have a bad attitude. Others will side with those players, arguing that they are just more open with their emotions on the course. Regardless of which side you are on, you have to consider what, if any, rules these players are actually breaking? And then, in the event of any behavior that does break the rules, are the proper steps being taken to reprimand or sanction them?

Another poster above posted some of the rules regarding player conduct, let's consider them.

Because if a player misses a putt, loudly groans out of frustration, punches their fist into the other hand, and then aggressively slams their driver into their bag...did he actually break any rules with that behavior? Maybe if those actions were disruptive while another player was getting ready to throw, but otherwise, what's the harm?

Some may argue that players at the top level of our sport should show less negative emotion while on the course, and keep those things to themselves unless behind close doors. I think that's absolutely absurd. That's not the status quo for any other sport I can think of, even the great comparison: Ball Golf. How many times have you seen a golfer in a PDGA Major smack his club into the ground after a bad shot? It certainly happens on occasion. It happens all the time in Tennis, one of the most well respected, 'gentlemanly' sports on the planet. You see players (big names too, not just amateurs) absolutely destroy tennis rackets after a bad shot, or yell at referees and argue their rulings.

Just ask yourself if you've ever seen Nikko Locastro, or any player for that matter, exhibit any type of behavior like the following-

- Repeated (and audible, not muttering under their breath) use of profane language
- Throwing items in anger
- Outward rudeness to players or spectators
- Physical attacks (honestly?)

Because those are the things that were bolded in the above post that specifically cited the PDGA Rules on player conduct. And if you did see any player act that way, were they disciplined accordingly? I mean, there are not only rules in place for these things, but specific guidelines for disciplinary action following them.

I've heard a lot of complaints about how certain players act on tour. People like to complain about all kinds of things. But I've never once seen or heard of a top player doing any of the things listed above. If I've heard of any player (Pro, Am, no name) exhibiting that kind of behavior, it was also noted how they were disciplined for their actions.

So what's the overall point here? Are some of us just idealistic, and we want 100% perfection from the players who represent our sport? I know that I've seen some amateur players who have considerably worse attitudes than the pro players that you guys like to complain about.

Maybe people like to complain because they know (in the back of their mind) that Nikko Locastro would absolutely dominate them on the course 365 days a year? The complainers know that they'll never be as good at anything as these guys are at disc golf, and they're jealous?

I don't know, but I think the whole thing is silly.

 

[scarpfish]

Still, all I'm getting out of these complaints is vague, vague, vague, and more vague. Still no names or specific examples of behavior that they are complaining about, and certainly no specific complaints of behavior that isn't already handled by players giving out warnings or violations in accordance with PDGA rules.

That's the thing with the internet. People want to rant anonymously from their soapboxes. If people had the cojones to actually name names, the accused eventually finds out about the s**t being talked behind their backs, goes to wherever site the ruckus is, tells their side of the story, which in 95% of cases, makes the OP look like a whiny self-absorbed douche. Its happened on here at least a couple of times.

 

[The Hammer]

I am fully aware of the subject of the OP. He has been suspended by the PDGA for his behavior before. He has gone as far as to threaten people, including TD's, when he doesn't get his way. He makes phantom calls (infractions that no one else has seen) on his card mates to mess with their heads. If called on anything, he flips into a tirade, then increases how often he tries to make these "phantom calls". IMO he should have been kicked out of the PDGA a long time ago. I believe he has been banned from several states' events due to his behavior. I know of people that will switch divisions, or drop from tournaments all together, if they see that this person on the tournament roster.

 

[namar]

"I once saw him scissor-kick Angela Lansbury."

 

[simpletwist]

Sounds like a little trash talking got to you. The best way to deal with pros with bad attitudes is to spank them on the course. They get beat often enough they'll just fade away.

And if the heat of the top tier gets to you maybe its time to step down or suck it up.

Disc golf is fine.

 

[Chiefstang]

I understand there's more pressure for the top pros to make a living, but...

The top pros I have watched are BY FAR the least professional division as far as general attitudes. I have never seen more bag-kicking and cussing than second card pros.

 

[46YearOldSlinger]

3% baddies is pretty dang good. most other sports its 3% goodies. disc golf is awesome and way friendlier than most other sports.

EXACTLY:hfive:

 

[AndyJB]

My card called a courtesy violation on the entire lead card of pros at Sakuna Matata, including Innova sponsored Joe Rover and Vibram Sponsored Mitch Sonderfan for cursing and throwing bags. It was a warning, and we had no issues after thay, but the TD did mention it to everyone during the awards.

To his credit (and because he is honest to God a really nice guy in or outside of disc golf) Mitch apologized at the event, and on Facebook on the club page and on the event page. At the Bloom tournament the next weekend, his attitude and behavior was easily the best of any player I saw. He is a true class act.

Sometimes the guys playing for money don't even really they are acting that way. All it takes is someone to call them on it, and, as Mitch proved, they see the error of their ways and strive to make amends. I can't emphasize enough how good of a guy he is.

Now random douche canoe Chuckers out on the course? That will likely never change.

 

[zenbot]

I understand there's more pressure for the top pros to make a living, but...

The top pros I have watched are BY FAR the least professional division as far as general attitudes. I have never seen more bag-kicking and cussing than second card pros.

I guess you've never seen John McEnroe or Jimmy Connors have a tantrum.

 

[threevok]

I guess you've never seen John McEnroe or Jimmy Connors have a tantrum.

Viswanathan Anand is the worst.

 

[Chiefstang]

I guess you've never seen John McEnroe or Jimmy Connors have a tantrum.

HAHA! McEnroe was EPIC!

 

[OKNate]

I am fully aware of the subject of the OP. He has been suspended by the PDGA for his behavior before. He has gone as far as to threaten people, including TD's, when he doesn't get his way. He makes phantom calls (infractions that no one else has seen) on his card mates to mess with their heads. If called on anything, he flips into a tirade, then increases how often he tries to make these "phantom calls". IMO he should have been kicked out of the PDGA a long time ago. I believe he has been banned from several states' events due to his behavior. I know of people that will switch divisions, or drop from tournaments all together, if they see that this person on the tournament roster.

I can only think off the top of my head of two player with the same initials for first and last name. One throws REALLY far, the other always wears a disgusting hat. And this is killin me because i wanna know! hah

 

[RyanisCorriganis]

I guess you've never seen John McEnroe or Jimmy Connors have a tantrum.

I watched McEnroe's last couple sets in his match Sunday, dude seemd pretty positive.

 

[Shipley]

If you follow Steady Ed's philosophy, disc golf, is ruining bad attitudes. opcorn:

 

[bogeyfreetilinfinity]

If you follow Steady Ed's philosophy, disc golf, is ruining bad attitudes. opcorn:

^THIS^ a million times!!

Last tournament I played I was really frustrated with a seven I took after throwing OB twice, so I asked my card if they would mind if I threw my umbrella in disgust. They all gave it the green light, so oh boy did it feel good chucking that umbrella!