DGPT: Nick Hyde

[lyleoross]

I don't think Ricky "voicing his opinion" is a black eye or bad for the sport. I just think it makes him look like an *******.

I think you and I have a different opinion about defining an *******. While what Ricky aid was silly enough, it just wasn't that big a deal.

Question? When Paul said he wasn't going to play the final DGPT last year, did you think he was an *******? When Val called out Innova, an organization that has quite supported women, if not to her liking, did you think she was an ********? When Ken Climo whined about a sign that blocked his view during a round, for ten minutes, did you think he was an ********? I can go on because many of these guys do things like this.

 

[JoakimBL]

I don't think Ricky "voicing his opinion" is a black eye or bad for the sport. I just think it makes him look like an *******.

This is the quote from the ultiworld article. If there is something else, then please share. But which part exactly makes him look like an ******** (whatever that was, I'm guessing it's not a good thing)

"If you're a competitor, you play to win," Wysocki said. "And sometimes winning isn't always winning from wire to wire or winning from start to finish…Just the fact that the elements canceled out this tournament — and, like I said, USDGC — it's a pretty distraught feeling having this happen two times in the past six or seven months. It's definitely a bummer. With the way the weather was, I was only two strokes back, but in that weather that two strokes is nothing. In those conditions you're not gonna be shooting 10 or 12 under, so there's a lot more room to make up strokes in the weather. And that's another thing I excel in, is playing in the rain."

[...]
"I think it was an awful call," Wysocki said. "I don't want to call anyone out or anything, but I think they called it too early. The weather — as soon as they called the tournament, the weather broke and it didn't rain one drop after they called it. I think they could have prolonged it a little bit more."

[...]

"Teepads would have been a little bit slippery, but that's just the element you have to battle with," Wysocki said. "That's just part of the game. Just because the teepads are slippery, that's not a reason to cancel the event."

The absolut worst he is saying here is that he thinks it was an "awfull call". Now either the censoring at DCCR is very strict, or your definition of what constitutes an ********* is pretty broad.

 

[curt]

So you're saying that the vast majority of players have real jobs? How high were you when you posted that?

Unlike the USDGC which had a major hurricane complete with mass evacuations clogging up every available hotel room in the area, this one could have easily finished on Monday.

Call in sick on Monday if you have a real job because you can't make a living playing disc golf full time.

All I'm saying is Ricky has a flipping point, and you overreactive snowflakes saying expressing his opinion is somehow a black eye to the sport, are totally contradicting yourselves when you don't support playing on Monday like the real sport of ball golf does. Wake up and stop sniffing the plastic.

I think you have an inaccurate view of where the sport of disc golf is right now. Disc golf simply isn't a "real sport" where you can expect the entire field to play as a full time job. There were 112 players in the field at Nick Hyde, and probably 20-30 of those guys are full time touring players. The majority of the field is definitely going to work during the week to pay the bills. Don't forget that anyone playing this tournament has already taken at least Friday off, and taking a second day off can be tough to justify, especially if you're competing for a few hundred dollars or entirely out of it.

 

[Reniger]

In before Landfill!

 

[curt]

I'd like to see the PDGA publish some guidelines for this type of situation, so that players can have a clearer understanding of what may happen when nasty weather is in the forecast. There have now been two events in the last 6 months that were shortened because of foreseeable weather conditions, and both events could have gone a lot more smoothly for the players if there was a clear plan in place from the beginning. To be clear, I am not commenting on whether the TDs did the right thing in either situation. This is clearly a difficult thing to handle, which is why PDGA guidelines would be helpful. I'd like to see some suggested time frames on cancelling a round if the weather looks especially bad and some suggestions on how to readjust the schedule to get rounds in a shorter time frame. For example, if you switched to a shotgun start, you could get 3 rounds in on the course a day. Then splitting the field into 2 flights everyone could get 3 rounds in over 2 days. There would certainly be questions about fairness and it would be a huge pain for the tournament staff, but you could get the holes in. I don't know if that is the best solution, but simply having an expectation when you sign up for the tournament would be nice. This could also clear up some of the grey areas in the standards. For example, technically, the Nick Hyde doesn't meet the standards for an A-tier now, and there's no clear understanding of what that means. (This isn't a critique of the decision to shorten the tournament, which probably made the right decision, but just an observation).

 

[JC17393]

Question? When Paul said he wasn't going to play the final DGPT last year, did you think he was an *******? When Val called out Innova, an organization that has quite supported women, if not to her liking, did you think she was an ********? When Ken Climo whined about a sign that blocked his view during a round, for ten minutes, did you think he was an ********? I can go on because many of these guys do things like this.

Paul? Yes. Val? No. Climo? No idea what that is in reference to so I leave it at I don't know.

Let's be clear here. Anyone's free to say whatever they want. But that doesn't mean I can't disagree with them or *gasp* think poorly of them for what they say and perhaps more importantly, how they say it.

I thought McBeth went off half-cocked with his silly "boycott" and I seem to recall being quite critical of him at the time. On the other hand, I thought Val was rather diplomatic and well-thought out in her statements, both written and in her interview on Smashboxx's podcast.

I didn't find anything Ricky's quoted as saying to be diplomatic at all. Maybe Steve left out something in crafting his story, but nowhere does Ricky acknowledge that the TD's decision was difficult or that he understood why they did it even if he didn't like it. He calls it "disheartening" and "a bummer" and "awful", then says they called it too early. But he doesn't "want to call anyone out or anything". Seems to me that's exactly what he was doing whether he wanted to or not.

 

[JC17393]

For example, technically, the Nick Hyde doesn't meet the standards for an A-tier now, and there's no clear understanding of what that means.

Yes it does. Scheduled for at least 54 holes is the standard for A-tiers. The Competition Manual covers what happens if weather forces play to be shortened.

1.7 Suspension of Play

I. The Tournament Director will make every effort to complete all rounds of the tournament as scheduled.

1. If a total of 54 holes or fewer holes are scheduled. All players must complete a minimum of 18 holes for the event to be considered official.
2. If a total of 72 holes are scheduled. All players must complete a minimum of 36 holes for the event to be considered official.
3. If these criteria are not met, all efforts will be made to reschedule the event. If rescheduling is impossible, a full refund will be issued minus player's package, PDGA, and other associated event fees.​

 

[curt]

I definitely missed that. The competition manual gets me every time.

 

[lyleoross]

Paul? Yes. Val? No. Climo? No idea what that is in reference to so I leave it at I don't know.

Let's be clear here. Anyone's free to say whatever they want. But that doesn't mean I can't disagree with them or *gasp* think poorly of them for what they say and perhaps more importantly, how they say it.

I thought McBeth went off half-cocked with his silly "boycott" and I seem to recall being quite critical of him at the time. On the other hand, I thought Val was rather diplomatic and well-thought out in her statements, both written and in her interview on Smashboxx's podcast.

I didn't find anything Ricky's quoted as saying to be diplomatic at all. Maybe Steve left out something in crafting his story, but nowhere does Ricky acknowledge that the TD's decision was difficult or that he understood why they did it even if he didn't like it. He calls it "disheartening" and "a bummer" and "awful", then says they called it too early. But he doesn't "want to call anyone out or anything". Seems to me that's exactly what he was doing whether he wanted to or not.

Fair enough.

 

[lyleoross]

Paul? Yes. Val? No. Climo? No idea what that is in reference to so I leave it at I don't know.

Let's be clear here. Anyone's free to say whatever they want. But that doesn't mean I can't disagree with them or *gasp* think poorly of them for what they say and perhaps more importantly, how they say it.

I thought McBeth went off half-cocked with his silly "boycott" and I seem to recall being quite critical of him at the time. On the other hand, I thought Val was rather diplomatic and well-thought out in her statements, both written and in her interview on Smashboxx's podcast.

I didn't find anything Ricky's quoted as saying to be diplomatic at all. Maybe Steve left out something in crafting his story, but nowhere does Ricky acknowledge that the TD's decision was difficult or that he understood why they did it even if he didn't like it. He calls it "disheartening" and "a bummer" and "awful", then says they called it too early. But he doesn't "want to call anyone out or anything". Seems to me that's exactly what he was doing whether he wanted to or not.

Keep in mind, Val went directly at Innova. Innova has put plenty of money into the women's sport and it's development. Yep, I know three are many that argue they should take a financial loss to "grow" the women's game. I'd argue there lots of evidence they have. I'd have to say positioning at such things is a matter of who's shoes your in. BTW, I agree on Paul. I thought he went two steps to far. For me, having seen my fair share of donkeys, Ricky's commentary was pretty mild. Again more due to his desire to win than some attempt to slam someone for something they did. Paul went after the PDGA for their decision, and Val went after Innova for their, lack of support. The Ken story, as I heard it, was a sign went up between one year and the next. He was mad as a wet hen, almost like someone put up the sign to get in "his" way. Now I don't know what happened in reality. But to me, the story as I've presented it looks pretty damned petty. Ricky's commentary, it's not even the first time I've seen that from a player over a cancelled event. Does it make him look bad? Okay, it doesn't make him look good. But meh, pretty small potatoes.

 

[onemilemore]

Paul? Yes. Val? No. Climo? No idea what that is in reference to so I leave it at I don't know.

Let's be clear here. Anyone's free to say whatever they want. But that doesn't mean I can't disagree with them or *gasp* think poorly of them for what they say and perhaps more importantly, how they say it.

I thought McBeth went off half-cocked with his silly "boycott" and I seem to recall being quite critical of him at the time. On the other hand, I thought Val was rather diplomatic and well-thought out in her statements, both written and in her interview on Smashboxx's podcast.

I didn't find anything Ricky's quoted as saying to be diplomatic at all. Maybe Steve left out something in crafting his story, but nowhere does Ricky acknowledge that the TD's decision was difficult or that he understood why they did it even if he didn't like it. He calls it "disheartening" and "a bummer" and "awful", then says they called it too early. But he doesn't "want to call anyone out or anything". Seems to me that's exactly what he was doing whether he wanted to or not.

I don't recall Ricky saying anything else about the TD, but I'd have to go back and look at my transcript. Even if he did, his comments in the article - and elsewhere online since the article posted - have been consistent. He was pissed because in his mind they called it too early.

 

[JC17393]

I don't recall Ricky saying anything else about the TD, but I'd have to go back and look at my transcript. Even if he did, his comments in the article - and elsewhere online since the article posted - have been consistent. He was pissed because in his mind they called it too early.

I believe you. I only suggested the possibility of you leaving something out because, well, the possibility exists. You had 3-4 other people quoted saying the TD made the right call, so a fifth wouldn't be all that necessary to the story. Just trying to give Ricky some benefit of the doubt that he maybe was what I'd call "diplomatic" in his comments, but they were truncated in the article. That they weren't just removes the doubt.

 

[DanJon]

I think more pros should selfishly call out TD's, especially when they have to make tough decisions to keep the other competitors safe.

I'm sure the TD's won't mind.

 

[onemilemore]

I believe you. I only suggested the possibility of you leaving something out because, well, the possibility exists. You had 3-4 other people quoted saying the TD made the right call, so a fifth wouldn't be all that necessary to the story. Just trying to give Ricky some benefit of the doubt that he maybe was what I'd call "diplomatic" in his comments, but they were truncated in the article. That they weren't just removes the doubt.

All good. Always a lot that hits the proverbial cutting room floor, just the reality of interviewing. I think his "I don't want to call anyone out" was an attempt at diplomacy that just didn't come off too well.

Something I talked about on our podcast this week with Sexton, though, is recency bias. This has happened twice in the past six months, but when was the last time things were canceled before that? If we go another long stretch without cancellations, this will just be a blip.

 

[DiscFifty]

The absolut worst he is saying here is that he thinks it was an "awfull call". Now either the censoring at DCCR is very strict, or your definition of what constitutes an ********* is pretty broad.

I think what he said was fine...and no frickin big deal. Any competitor wants a chance at a win. However...replace "awful" with "questionable" and the world is a happier place. Right?

 

[JoakimBL]

I think what he said was fine...and no frickin big deal. Any competitor wants a chance at a win. However...replace "awful" with "questionable" and the world is a happier place. Right?

I agree that it would have been more diplomatic and everybody would like not call him out as bad. However, if he really thinks it was an awful call, then that is what I would like him to say and what I want to hear. As long as he just voices his opinion and not just ranting, I think it's fine. If he was pissed off about the decision, I think it's totally fine that he expresses that. A TD that makes this decision should be prepared for that and accept that not everyone thinks he made the right choice. Yes Ricky could have used more diplomatic language, but if it really botheres the TD, I think he should grow some thicker skin.

 

[djcadence]

I think you have an inaccurate view of where the sport of disc golf is right now. Disc golf simply isn't a "real sport" where you can expect the entire field to play as a full time job. There were 112 players in the field at Nick Hyde, and probably 20-30 of those guys are full time touring players. The majority of the field is definitely going to work during the week to pay the bills. Don't forget that anyone playing this tournament has already taken at least Friday off, and taking a second day off can be tough to justify, especially if you're competing for a few hundred dollars or entirely out of it.

And that's not even taking in account the volunteers and people behind the scenes needed to help make events like this happen. Most aren't able to take another day off from being paid, or lose a vacation day for nothing but love of the game. If Ricky wants to pony up the funds to make it worthwhile for everyone to stay another day then more power to him, however I doubt the $3000 purse for winning would come close to paying for that.

 

[DanJon]

I agree that it would have been more diplomatic and everybody would like not call him out as bad. However, if he really thinks it was an awful call, then that is what I would like him to say and what I want to hear. As long as he just voices his opinion and not just ranting, I think it's fine. If he was pissed off about the decision, I think it's totally fine that he expresses that. A TD that makes this decision should be prepared for that and accept that not everyone thinks he made the right choice. Yes Ricky could have used more diplomatic language, but if it really botheres the TD, I think he should grow some thicker skin.

Or maybe Ricky should grow some thicker skin.

TD's don't need to run tournaments.

Pros need TD's to run tournaments.

 

[lyleoross]

I agree that it would have been more diplomatic and everybody would like not call him out as bad. However, if he really thinks it was an awful call, then that is what I would like him to say and what I want to hear. As long as he just voices his opinion and not just ranting, I think it's fine. If he was pissed off about the decision, I think it's totally fine that he expresses that. A TD that makes this decision should be prepared for that and accept that not everyone thinks he made the right choice. Yes Ricky could have used more diplomatic language, but if it really botheres the TD, I think he should grow some thicker skin.

Or maybe Ricky should grow some thicker skin.

TD's don't need to run tournaments.

Pros need TD's to run tournaments.

And here I was thinking it was we fans who need to grow thicker skins.

 

[lyleoross]

Cows, cows have thick skins.