How to Properly throw with the "Double Move"

[itlnstln]

Try this: if you throw a baseball, football, rock, whatever; you'll notice that you brace on your front leg and your back leg is off the ground. Your off-arm doesn't really do anything except helps you balance. The front hip triggers the upper body. This, obviously, translates well to a forehand, but the backhand mechanics are quite the same

(Also see Sidwinder's one-leg drill)

 

[disc-golf-neil]

@Kennets @itlnstln good points.

But I'm only trying to make sure I understand the double move and not all the other stuff slingshot says or his persona.

The idea has clearly spread a lot and other people have talked about it the value of it, so that's what I'm focused on. After discarded the junk, is there something valuable that is now, for all intents and purposes, what "double move" has come to symbolize?

That's why I think it seems like the main focus point people ran with is the timing of bringing the off arm in just before the reach back finishes. A lot of people's off arms lag behind (including mine sometimes) when thinking about bringing it on at the same time as you brace and pull through, so perhaps this is why it's gotten popular because it can help prevent that timing and then you end up positioned better to anchor and counterbalance since the off arm isn't lagging behind.

For example, Danny here seems to agree with some main takeaway and points out how pros are doing it. Idk what people here think of Danny though.

 

[Kennets]

The double move isn't equal off arm mechanics and since slingshot started the term, I haven't once heard it being used as a term regarding the off arm and the mechanics behind it, by any dude that had the slightest idea about disc golf.

(Not sure how or why I'm writing in cursive lol).

this might be a bold statement, but in general : a great brace along with timing ans posture, your off arm should anchor itself passively due to, yeah the brace. Especially if you get a great shift from behind. It got no where else to go, than tight to your body. Do you have to think about the off arm before to get it in position? I think so, but again, thats more of a mechanical issue than "firing" it.

that's just how I feel when I get a good send on a disc and I rewatch my throw..

 

[itlnstln]

I would also say that's an old video, and I'm not sure Danny would agree with that now. Some of this is a very recent example of how our understanding of form evolves. For example, no one (except Scott Stokley, maybe) teaches "pull the lawn mower" anymore. There was a period of time when off-arm mechanics were "hot," but mostly misunderstood, and we've largely moved on.

That there's a YouTube video on something doesn't make that person an authority. Lots of BS out there. Just saw that there's some video out there now where someone is advocating to not push down with the thumb

 

[disc-golf-neil]

The double move isn't equal off arm mechanics and since slingshot started the term, I haven't once heard it being used as a term regarding the off arm and the mechanics behind it, by any dude that had the slightest idea about disc golf.

(Not sure how or why I'm writing in cursive lol).

this might be a bold statement, but in general : a great brace along with timing ans posture, your off arm should anchor itself passively due to, yeah the brace. Especially if you get a great shift from behind. It got no where else to go, than tight to your body. Do you have to think about the off arm before to get it in position? I think so, but again, thats more of a mechanical issue than "firing" it.

that's just how I feel when I get a good send on a disc and I rewatch my throw..

Yeah, with an athletic background my off-arm naturally come in and anchored pretty decently / passively without much thought about it during my first week of playing, but it was just never optimally tight because I think of the timing. By the time it was getting close to my body it was needing to start the counter balance / anchor naturally so it didn't have time to come in that final amount.

To get it tighter to the body I've had to actually think about it and try to start bringing it in a little bit before the brace is landing.

 

[Kennets]

And that's definitely a solution (imo). Some players does actually start to bring it in a tad before (Paul mcbeth), but it's only due to having a right posture/sequence and not to get a "kickstart" to the throw.

Momentum is build up through the swing and accelerates through it. That's not possible if you try TOO hard to power through with a "stretch reflex" boost. You're gonna end up fucking up everything and you might throw "harder", but then your mechanics are wrong from the beginning anyway and you'll hit a hard cap at some point. (Ask me how I know)

Hammer drills worked like a charm for me, before I had to quit working intensively on form

 

[HyzerRoc]

That.

To the question of discgolfneil what the double move is and if it is the right thing to do.

The way slingshot demonstrates it is that he brings his off-arm in to initiate the throw. He squeezes his shoulders together when he brings the off arm in and ends up in a hunched position.

I think the general principle of equal and opposite applies here as well. When one shoulder goes into protraction (to make your lever bigger) your other shoulder should go into retraction to balance it out. It is like walking or running - when running you want to balance your left leg striking forward out with your right arm going forward and so on.

When slingshot squeezes his shoulders together he is not relaxed but has a lot of tension in his back and shoulders. With tension you cannot move as freely as when you are relaxed.

The last claim that the off arm initiates the throw is also bogus. The weight carrying forward (as he shows in the McBeth clip) that then gets braced against his plant foot whips the body around after McBeth has brought his body in the doorframe position.

 

[Sheep]

But I'm only trying to make sure I understand the double move and not all the other stuff slingshot says or his persona.

But you're not.

You're arguing nonsense every reply.

It has been explained multiple times here.

If you want better answers, you need to ask better questions. Currently you're just making wild statements throwing shit at the wall trying to figure it out and its not productive.

 

[Sheep]

(as he shows in the McBeth clip)

I can never stop laughing so hard that he understands mcbeth has great form, but what he teaches and does is nothing like Paul.

 

[disc-golf-neil]

But you're not.

You're arguing nonsense every reply.

It has been explained multiple times here.

If you want better answers, you need to ask better questions. Currently you're just making wild statements throwing shit at the wall trying to figure it out and its not productive.

Everything is really clear and simple when you've been around here and know all the tribal knowledge and how the thinking has evolved over time and can weave it together yourself into a progressive and cohesive picture. But when you are newer, you are wading into a massive body of information and outdated info or misinformation (less on here) and it's not easy to see a clear path, it's a bunch of threads with good info scattered around.

Since the thinking has and is still evolving, I'm not just going to accept everything that's currently said without thought or question. I am actively testing everything out to try to understand the feeling of it, but I also want to understand it conceptually.

 

[Sheep]

Everything is really clear and simple when you've been around here and know all the tribal knowledge and how the thinking has evolved over time and can weave it together yourself into a progressive and cohesive picture. But when you are newer, you are wading into a massive body of information and outdated info or misinformation (less on here) and it's not easy to see a clear path, it's a bunch of threads with good info scattered around.

Since the thinking has and is still evolving, I'm not just going to accept everything that's currently said without thought or question. I am actively testing everything out to try to understand the feeling of it, but I also want to understand it conceptually.

Again.
Spend more time asking better questions vs making blatant statements.

You're not getting your answers because you're not asking good questions. It's been explained quite well in here by multiples of us. So, if you are missing a piece of the puzzle, you need to answer the right questions.

And you're right, it's hard to get through all the information, there is tons of it in here. And its a lot to go through sometimes, but when you don't understand, you have to take the time to explain where you're at and what you're lacking in knowing.
Instead of asking good questions for something like this, youre making wild statements that are causing most of us to reply with grief instead of help at this point.

 

[disc-golf-neil]

Again.
Spend more time asking better questions vs making blatant statements.

You're not getting your answers because you're not asking good questions. It's been explained quite well in here by multiples of us. So, if you are missing a piece of the puzzle, you need to answer the right questions.

And you're right, it's hard to get through all the information, there is tons of it in here. And its a lot to go through sometimes, but when you don't understand, you have to take the time to explain where you're at and what you're lacking in knowing.
Instead of asking good questions for something like this, youre making wild statements that are causing most of us to reply with grief instead of help at this point.

Don't forget to reply with accusations as well, such as "slingshot plant" when I barely watch the dude

 

[Sheep]

Don't forget to reply with accusations as well, such as "slingshot plant" when I barely watch the dude

Thank you for confirming that you're not actually trying to learn anything, but just cause problems.

 

[disc-golf-neil]

Thank you for confirming that you're not actually trying to learn anything, but just cause problems.

Anything can be confirmation of what you want it to be if you try.

Speaking of causing problems, I'd think that hurling out accusations without evidence could potentially cause problems.

 

[Sheep]

Anything can be confirmation of what you want it to be if you try.

Speaking of causing problems, I'd think that hurling out accusations without evidence could potentially cause problems.

/me makes wank motion

 

[disc-golf-neil]

/me makes wank motion

Sir, This is a Forum, please don't wank on it.

 

[Casey 1988]

I guess you haven't been around long enough to follow his content.

It's not just "the double move", it's his concept of being a slick car salesman, that (mostly) gives Ill advices and have next to no clue about biomechanics (I'm biased here.. can't stand the dude)

He's been putting emphasis on that it's the off arm (and back leg) that drives the swing and not a solid brace. That you need to ACTIVELY fire the off arm and turn the rear leg in to get a rotational throw, when in fact, the two things are biproducts of a great brace AND the right posture, timing and sequence etc.. oh and a lateral shift.

With mcbeth in the slowmo, you can see that he shifts from behind and do not fire the off arm to start the throw.

I might be wrong and eat my words, bit whilst the offhand definitely helps to accelerate the throw in some manner, I am a firm believer you and many others thinks of it in a wrong way with the "stretch reflex" in the upper back and how it's a BIG boost to distance..

In my opinion it isn't and it's more a byproduct of correct sequencing, timing, posture along with the right swing thought.

You Need a brace but not in way Avery Jenkins or Dave F would tell you to have a sideways leg when planting as in 95% of players you put so much strain on knee joint and muscles around knee. I have tried and my hip hurts playing like this as can for most people have some issue more so in knee and muscles around it. Most pro players used a forefoot spin in said move before planting but some who have a heavy boxy build or are big lifter muscles heavy need to use heel or whole foot in spin before bracing on throw as body weight is an issue.

Mainly some semi–Professional Pro players like Anthony Bondanza (look up his main channel on YouTube) though some full time touring pros are using a mistake in throw where disc is released a bit early or way late, mainly with molds of the Viking/Valkyrie type and more understable drivers including Fairway because player is used to compensating for Destroyer or even more overstable discs when starting out becuse a buddy gives them a old worn in Destroyer or Wraith like disc.

 

[Casey 1988]

That there's a YouTube video on something doesn't make that person an authority. Lots of BS out there. Just saw that there's some video out there now where someone is advocating to not push down with the thumb

Yes, Not using your thumb at all in flight because some people will never figure out how to not throw nose up, was a relatively new video around 8 days old from YouTube channel, The Tee Less Traveled. I never watched as I know is bad advice for all who do not have hand palms size of 4 NHL Hocky pucks in a square like video image so they can use very inner part of palm as a good grip. I tried not using my thumb in throw when playing disc golf for helping my nose down issue, and disc ether slipped out or flew on a roller as I was hanging on too long. I realized I was using in 2004 old 1990's wrist info poorly written when I was having issue and was throwing from hip level like a cartoon guy when he dunks disc in water who drew for Gotta Go Gotta Throw for years. I still throw low but not as low as before where I used a long skip making my distance.