Is this guy a falling-putter?

[Fender088]

These threads hurt my head and make me want to go throw.

 

[Technohic]

Yeah even the PDGA itself voted no.

... as predicted only 25% of people on here actually know or care about the rules. Sounds about like the same ratio of novice players at a tournament that know the rules.

Follow the arrow pointing to the other post where the PDGA responded.

At any rate, this has nothing to do with "knowing" the rules. Its more about interpratation; and similar to how the judicial system interprets laws, it appears to me that this would be a quick trial.

 

[teebob]

that isnt the standard (the theme song for this thread). the standard is to "demonstrate full control of balance" (read: left/right, forward/backward halt of momentum) before advancing past the lie.

It seems like you want people to pull out an overhead projector and give a presentation.

You are making a big deal out of trivial wording. If it is that important to you take it up with the rules commitee.

 

[Three Putt]

not where i play. not at the usdgc either, where the enforcement was explained before the event so that everyone knew what the standard of "demonstrating complete balance" looked like. how do you account for that?:\

Local play can evolve in a lot of ways. Where I learned to play we considered the putt good if you did not demonstrate balance but did manage to tap your toe down before your momentum took you past the marker. I basically learned to putt illegally and taping my toe like I was a receiver trying to get both feet down. If I went back to White Birch I'm sure I could still do that and get away with it, but if I go to a sanctioned event I'll get called for a falling putt. Just 'cause that's how we call it at the 'Birch don't make it so.

As for the USDGC, you have to remember that they got A WAVIER of the official rules to enforce the both feet down rule, because both feet down is not a rule. By the simple fact that they needed a wavier to be able to do that, it proves that both feet down IS NOT the rule. I don't disagree that both feet down (probably written as two supporting points since you can be down on a knee and such) would be a better, clearer rule. It's just not the rule we have.

 

[Apothecary]

ill talk to the td on the subject before every event i play so we are all on the same page.

they need to adopt a clear, universal standard for demonstrating complete balance.

 

[bazillion]

How about after you putt, you lift one leg up and "mark" your lie???

 

[Apothecary]

As for the USDGC, you have to remember that they got A WAVIER of the official rules to enforce the both feet down rule, because both feet down is not a rule.

please cite your source.

By the simple fact that they needed a wavier to be able to do that, it proves that both feet down IS NOT the rule.

Victor, there's no rule change. Feldberg was just illustrating how the rule should be followed.

As Feldberg points out, "jump putts" have never been allowed but "putt jumps" have been, meaning that the player must release the disc before jumping or stepping forward for lies beyond 10m. Inside 10m you have to place your non-plant foot on the ground with proper balance before moving forward after releasing the putt if it wasn't already on the ground (like a straddle putt). Where and when your disc has landed during a putt has no bearing on making legal movements, unlike some who think you can't move forward until the disc stops moving.

chuck kennedy would disagree.:\

 

[teebob]

Plain and simple if the pdga rules book was in laymen terms these debates would not happen. Its like they had some lawyer make and word the rules.

 

[Three Putt]

Victor, there's no rule change. Feldberg was just illustrating how the rule should be followed.

As Feldberg points out, "jump putts" have never been allowed but "putt jumps" have been, meaning that the player must release the disc before jumping or stepping forward for lies beyond 10m. Inside 10m you have to place your non-plant foot on the ground with proper balance before moving forward after releasing the putt if it wasn't already on the ground (like a straddle putt). Where and when your disc has landed during a putt has no bearing on making legal movements, unlike some who think you can't move forward until the disc stops moving.

This quote was from back in February when there was a lot of talk about a "stricter interpretation" of the rule. From what I have seen, the "stricter interpretation" never happened.

 

[Apothecary]

jerry davis held a clinic before our monthly last saturday explaining that it would be required to plant your back foot before proceeding. the stricter (proper) interpretation of the rule is already in play.

the word is out. better clean up your slop putting style.

 

[bthoma1]

Scary how many people think that its yes and fail to read the direct response from the PDGA sideing with the nos.

yeah read what he said at the end. not word for word but he says to make it safe or easier so you don't get in trouble, just set your other foot down behind your lie

 

[TheStray]

At any rate, this has nothing to do with "knowing" the rules. Its more about interpratation; and similar to how the judicial system interprets laws, it appears to me that this would be a quick trial.

B. Stepping past the marker disc is permitted after the disc is released, except when putting within 10 meters.

Not sure how this can be interpreted any other way? You can step to the side you can step to the back and you can do a flying crane kick but if your first step is past the marker within 10 feet of the basket then you've violated the rule. Regardless of whether you pause for 30 seconds on one foot. If the PDGA can't interpret their own rules then they need to change the rule.

Personally I would never call anyone on that unless I honestly thought that they were beating me because they were doing that.

 

[Thumber]

B. Stepping past the marker disc is permitted after the disc is released, except when putting within 10 meters.

Not sure how this can be interpreted any other way? You can step to the side you can step to the back and you can do a flying crane kick but if your first step is past the marker within 10 feet of the basket then you've violated the rule. Regardless of whether you pause for 30 seconds on one foot. If the PDGA can't interpret their own rules then they need to change the rule.

Personally I would never call anyone on that unless I honestly thought that they were beating me because they were doing that.

this is incorrect on so many fronts.

10 meters, not 10 feet.

you just have to be balanced. If you are, you can step past the marker.

The easiest way to avoid this ridiculous argument is to step back after the putt so you don't get in a situation, but you are not required to...you just have to demonstrate balance

You just demonstrated you don't know the rules either.

You may want to go back up and edit where you berate people for not knowing the rules.

 

[osiain]

 

[Technohic]

yeah read what he said at the end. not word for word but he says to make it safe or easier so you don't get in trouble, just set your other foot down behind your lie

Something tells me this guy has seen this sort of debate before. "I woulndt call it a falling putt, but put your foot down so we dont see several pages of everyone claiming to be unequivocally right either way"

 

[Apothecary]

if you dont plant your off-foot, expect to get called (under 803.04 c)

 

[SpyderPride]

Regardless of whether you pause for 30 seconds on one foot.

By this reasoning, within the 10m circle you can never go get your disc out of the basket... since you eventually have to step forward to walk toward the basket and pick it up.

A falling putt is when the body remains in a forward motion after the disc is released from the hand, such that the forward momentum carries one of the thrower's feet closer to the basket than their marker. "Demonstrating balance" in this case means to stop the forward motion after the disc is released. After that, as long as your arms aren't flailing around to keep your balance, you may step toward the basket.

 

[TheStray]

this is incorrect on so many fronts.

10 meters, not 10 feet.

you just have to be balanced. If you are, you can step past the marker.

The easiest way to avoid this ridiculous argument is to step back after the putt so you don't get in a situation, but you are not required to...you just have to demonstrate balance

You just demonstrated you don't know the rules either.

You may want to go back up and edit where you berate people for not knowing the rules.

Yeah you got me. I accidentally used feet instead of meters but the argument still stands. If you plant your off foot anywhere past the marker you violate the rule in section B. Could you please interpret this any other way for me. Where can you step with your off foot that you would not break this rule?

I think the statement I made earlier was fairly accurate as well, as you have demonstrated. About 75% of the people on this forum are full of sh1t.

 

[TheStray]

By this reasoning, within the 10m circle you can never go get your disc out of the basket... since you eventually have to step forward to walk toward the basket and pick it up.

A falling putt is when the body remains in a forward motion after the disc is released from the hand, such that the forward momentum carries one of the thrower's feet closer to the basket than their marker. "Demonstrating balance" in this case means to stop the forward motion after the disc is released. After that, as long as your arms aren't flailing around to keep your balance, you may step toward the basket.

Actually, as I stated before you can retrieve your disc after both feet have been firmly planted behind your marker after throwing. It doesn't even matter what is said in any part of the rule outside of section B.

 

[Technohic]

Yeah you got me. I accidentally used feet instead of meters but the argument still stands. If you plant your off foot anywhere past the marker you violate the rule in section B. Could you please interpret this any other way for me. Where can you step with your off foot that you would not break this rule?

I think the statement I made earlier was fairly accurate as well, as you have demonstrated. About 75% of the people on this forum are full of sh1t.

Thats not the only thing he is referring to. You leave it at just the "Step beyond the marker" part and avoid all together the part that is in debate, where the rule talks about demonstrating balance which has been posted at least 10 times in this thread.

B. Stepping past the marker disc is permitted after the disc is released, except when
putting within 10 meters.

C. Any throw from within 10 meters or less, as measured from the rear of the marker disc
to the base of the hole, is considered a putt. A follow-through after a putt that causes the
thrower to make any supporting point contact closer to the hole than the rear edge of the
marker disc constitutes a falling putt and is considered a stance violation . The player must demonstrate full
control of balance before advancing toward the hole.

Clearly you are ignoring C particularly the part where "The Player must demonstrate full control of balance before advancing toward the target."

Ling to the rule: http://www.pdga.com/rules/80304-stance-subsequent-to-teeing-off

and it says nothing about which direction the first step must be made which you implied