Schusterick Driving Clinic

[ihatepickles]

Wow, I'm really digging this clinic. Easily the best 25 minutes I've spent on Youtube since I started playing disc golf.

I threw into my net for a half hour and I really feel the difference in the hit coming off my backhand. I can't wait to field work this stuff. Thoughts?

 

[CreemCheese]

That helped me understand quite a few things that I haven't been quite getting. Thank you for the find.

 

[Bikinimower]

I went to a Will Schusterick Driving clinic once and it was amazing.

I have been to a couple others but the Schusterick one was by far the best. He is a likable guy, an excellent teacher that explains things in a way that is easy for you to grasp, and with a little work my drives improved significantly. Can't recommend him enough.

If you get a chance to go to one, make it happen. You won't regret it

 

[ihatepickles]

So, a few things I really clicked with from this clinic.

1. My grip. Leaving my first finger relaxed and not curled under the rim during my power grip. This part, in my opinion, was a big part of the shot. Not clutching the first finger allows my wrist to stay relaxed. This seemed like an unlikely improvement but I tried it. I need to refine this, but the relaxing on my first finger allowed me to immediately relax my wrist as well.

2. Lining up my shoulders to the shot. As I plant, my shoulders need to be on the line I intend my disc to release on. Hyzer, flat, doesn't matter... my shoulders need to be on the line of release. Will starts talking about this around 7:10.

3. Head down. Around 8:55 this is detailed. I've always tried and bring my disc through the core and not across my pectorals, but frankly I've failed. I don't have that good feel for how to do that each time. Keeping my head down really accentuates the feeling of the sweet spot through my core.

4. At 12:46, "If you could go back and start out... an understable disc is the best way to learn how to play. Because, it puts you in a position to learn the most consistent shot... which is the hyzer shot." Heh. I particularly think this is a cool part of the clinic. He gets on a tangent for a bit, but this comes back when he talks about playing a round with a beat up mid and putter at 20:07. Getting the really understable disc to ride a hyzer line (and not turn over) as a sign of good form. I need to put in some field work here, the throwing net isn't great for getting a feel for this.

5. Around 16:37, is anyone curious about why the nose angle matters? It's a good visualization. Ever wonder why that really understable Star Tern isn't turning over for you?

6. I have issues when I attempt to throw for height. Will talks about this throw at 20:12. I'm 99% sure my issues when throwing the higher shot are exactly the issue described in this segment. I'm air bouncing the high shot instead of pulling the disc on the straightest line I can. I've been working on this into a net, I need to get into the field as I'm having trouble seeing the nose angle and early fade into the net.

 

[zgmc]

Thanks for posting. Good video.

 

[HyzerUniBomber]

Oh boy, I think we're going to have a major difference of opinions on the pulling through lower because Will fails to mention the fact that he's tilting his spine forward when he's pulling like that. Sw22, Searching for Silky and many others have pointed out that the vast majority of top pros create a 90 degree angle between the upper arm and spine. Tilting forward makes it look like a lower pull through, but it's still there. The way Will explained it, it seems like he's saying pull low and use the arm and back muscles.

Plus he's saying that pulling through with all the muscles is how to accelerate the disc. Why do that when there's such an easier way to get momentum?

Strong arming is already a scourge. My longest shots feel loose and effortless.

I think many of us have seen where the power of late acceleration just smokes pulling from way back in the reachback.

I think Will is amazing and I bet he's taught more people than I've played against - and I he or anyone could say, "stfu until you think you can hold a candle to Will's skill" and that's fine.

But I spent a year straight trying to muscle my way to distance that I can get effortlessly now.

 

[46YearOldSlinger]

Interesting to see your feedback here HUB as I've been trying to reconcile this video with the ones on your Beato drill thread and there are definitely some differences. One thing I've found interesting about the leaning over that Will suggests and pulling the disc through lower is that you gain a few inches of clearance from your body allowing the elbow angle to be more acute (as your core is now further away due to the lean) and theoretically this would enhance the leverage? Does this make sense? Thoughts?

 

[zgmc]

He is not saying to strong arm the disc, or muscle your way to distance. He is talking about getting into an athletic position, where you can use your biggest muscle groups in the throw. He knows about being smooth, and not trying to strong arm the disc. There is only so much you can talk about in 25 mins. I bet you could send him an email and ask his opinion.

 

[HyzerUniBomber]

This whole video is good, but jump in to about 1:40 for a good explanation of the 90 degree angles.

I'm not trying to be difficult, I think Will's videos have done as much for me as anything I've learned from. I watch him throw frame by frame and I modeled my standstill throw after his.

I just think that the way it came out in that video, it sounded like he's promoting using muscle - and there's simply no reason to do that. Your biggest muscle group is your legs. Using your legs to shift weight and shutting and opening the levers of of your arm means that you aren't doing much more than trying to hold onto the disc.

Plus: "Head Down"... I heard SW groan from 800 miles away when I heard him say that:

Will's head is not down, it's just aligned properly with his spine which is leaned forward (and why he's creating a 90 degree angle for the "low pull"). If you say to somebody, keep your head down VS. stay over the disc and keep your head aligned straight up - when they bend over, it'll feel like they're looking down, but they won't tuck their chin, potentially causing neck problems.

For the vast majority of us form fanatics, we can take the semantics and wash our hands knowing what Will's saying. I know he's not advocating for strong arming, as do most of us... but we spend everyday hammering on our form and talking about it.

The casual watcher, I don't know if they're going to take some of this stuff the right way or not.

 

[Timeetyo]

Good vid and some good commentary here.

Did anyone else NOT notice the net at first. When he let that first disc go seemingly over the go carters I was like WTF?!?!? OH...NET. Duh.

 

[Halcón]

Yea, the net was like some sort of trick at first.

About the form: Am I wrong in assuming that, in general, Will seems to do a great job teaching here? The form guys can argue the details, but it seems like much of what he's saying would be very helpful to most beginners.

 

[Krinkncrank]

Given that Will Schusterick is an ectomorph, it would be a bit ironic for him to truly be advocating a muscle power approach. He's one of the guys of whom I've always thought, "if a due that slim can throw over 600', then there must be some sort of technique I'm missing out on"

Whereas if I look at Avery Jenkins throwing the same distance, I would conclude that muscle power is doing a lot for him and i need more of that.

It's interesting that Will Shusterick also advocates a long reach back, while HUB, Bradley Walker and SW22 talk about the reach back being unimportant. So, it seems that given that all throw far, everybody is right :\

^This is why it can be so confusing trying to sort out technical aspects of form. You read one guy with his totally logical explanation, then another comes out with a video promoting a different approach, equally logical.

If Shusterick, Feldberg, and McBeth each did a clinic on distance throwing technique, we would be seeing three different approaches, all successful.

Will is a good instructor and a great player - but what to take forward from that video into one's own form is a question to which I don't have an answer.

 

[zgmc]

At least sidewinder can't claim to have taught will how to throw.:\

You guys can get all caught up in the terminology if you want. Next time im out in the field I will be implementing what Will is talking about here.

 

[ColonelDracula]

And then if the throw culminates upon a heel pivot
it's even more complicated.

 

[Krinkncrank]

Now, thinking about what Will was saying, are not these two guys both pulling through (across) their core, leaning forward somewhat with their torso, chin down even?

 

[Romans 5-8]

a lot of people...........a lot of people. That is so annoying.

 

[HeavyCritters]

You had me at "ectomorph".

 

[RFrance]

Last year when I started and discovered that YouTube had a ton of videos on how to throw a disc I tried to piece it all together. The "lawn mower pull" from the Discraft tutorials, the towel snap drill, and on and on. All good and they all helped me to some extent. But they all seemed to work only if you strong armed it. Not a good approach if you want to have consistent distance, accuracy or longevity in the game.

Then about three months ago I started reading through the posts on DGCR instead of just finding courses. That's when I came across HUBs posts on re-working his form and all of the tremendous help he has had from the people who really understand the physics behind the throw. I'm working hard on that now and I am just starting to realize how the leverage can make it seem effortless.

Without a doubt, Will is a good teacher and he knows what he is doing. But my take on this video is that it depends upon the skill level of the students. If they are beginners, I can see them going down the wrong path that I did and will probably work on the core and the triceps before they even understand that the key is the right pec drill and the leverage.

There was one thing that I really took away from the video that I'm anxious to work on tomorrow. And that is the thumb placement on the disc. Moving the thumb over to the inside of the rim just a eighth or quarter of an inch really seems to help "put the hooks" in the disc and might just work better for the release than just trying to time the squeeze harder.

 

[BirdieMachine]

What you feel and what is real are often different, vastly different. I bet Will feels pulling throw his lat and tricep (considering how small they are) but reality most of the power comes from the legs and core with weight shift. I do agree with some of his conclusions though and was interested in his grip explanation, I can see some more power that way with extra thumb leverage, I will try that next time on the field.

 

[zgmc]

When you do sidewinders doorframe drill, you get into pretty much the same position that Will is talking about.