Something that really could hold disc golf back...

[Three Putt]

Do wheelchair bound people play ball golf?

I've seen it. It didn't seem like a very good idea, but I've seen it.

edit: Oh, you said ball golf. I've seen it a lot with ball golf. I worked at a course where the owner was really into accommodating people. We had some old regulars that used like a rascal-type thing to get around. They could stand up and strike a ball, but they couldn't walk a course anymore. We also had a regular Special Olympics group that came out and some of those guys used chairs. The owner loved seeing those guys out there. Since there were already cart paths, it wasn't a big deal at all.

 

[chalos13]

I think that having Disc Golf courses that are accessable to people with disabilities is great, and I can think of few that are nearly there. I'm thinking about creeks with narrow bridges, tunnel holes, other things that are prevalent on East Texas courses, and I don't think it would be possible to make them ADA compliant. I do agree this will halt new course growth, and in my experience at work, when something existing is renovated or upgraded, usually it then has to be brought up to ADA requirements, so a course getting new tee pads, new baskets etc might end up having to suddenly have these paths and ramps.

 

[optidiscic]

I bet those wheelchair guys are flickers and I bet soon all backhand holes will be outlawed

 

[Three Putt]

I do agree this will halt new course growth, and in my experience at work, when something existing is renovated or upgraded, usually it then has to be brought up to ADA requirements, so a course getting new tee pads, new baskets etc might end up having to suddenly have these paths and ramps.

This. It might make a course built in 2008 with natural tees not be able to install concrete tees without also establishing a compliant path, and given the slope of some holes and the grade you have to be at for a path to be compliant, that may actually be impossible to build.

 

[biscoe]

The most recent design project i worked on was in a park where management had recently had some ADA stuff basically shoved down their throats and they were very concerned with the dg course meeting standards. We arrived at the idea that we would make an accessible 3 hole loop rather than make the entirety of the course accessible which would've been darn near impossible.

 

[optidiscic]

The most recent design project i worked on was in a park where management had recently had some ADA stuff basically shoved down their throats and they were very concerned with the dg course meeting standards. We arrived at the idea that we would make an accessible 3 hole loop rather than make the entirety of the course accessible which would've been darn near impossible.

this is what I think will be the solution :thmbup:

you can always tell them to go play safari......money grabbing scourges

 

[hempies]

That is part of the problem with the way the ADA is written and how the DOJ and courts have had to issue guidelines and whatnot. It creates a system where no one is really accountable to common sense and lawyers make serious $ 'enforcing' the ever changing guidelines.

 

[Three Putt]

The most recent design project i worked on was in a park where management had recently had some ADA stuff basically shoved down their throats and they were very concerned with the dg course meeting standards. We arrived at the idea that we would make an accessible 3 hole loop rather than make the entirety of the course accessible which would've been darn near impossible.

That is what the course design page on the DGA site says to do to meet ADA.

I'm not sure that will fly. In the early stages of ADA we had an accessible entrance, but it wasn't the main entrance. We got sued; the dude said it was the same as making black people enter through the back door. We lost. The court said we had to make entering the building the same for everybody.

Recreational standards are different; it took them a long time to define those becasue it was such a boondoggle. It might be OK under those standards.

 

[cboucher]

Or how about making just the practice basket wheelchair accessible?

 

[Three Putt]

That is part of the problem with the way the ADA is written and how the DOJ and courts have had to issue guidelines and whatnot. It creates a system where no one is really accountable to common sense and lawyers make serious $ 'enforcing' the ever changing guidelines.

ADA was in effect for years before the recreational guidelines were defined. For several years we had to guess what was going to be OK. When they finally came out, we had to redo several play systems becasue we guessed wrong.

 

[tampora]

We arrived at the idea that we would make an accessible 3 hole loop...

Good compromise.

 

[Agricolae]

I'm not sure of all the things that led to the collapse of the Roman empire but I'd be willing to bet that this was one of them. We stand to lose more than DG courses if this sort of twisted legal logic continues.

 

[Hyzer Ale]

Someone posted this clause on Facebook so I'm sharing it here. This seems logical, problem is logic and government don't go hand in hand.

§ 35.151 New construction and alterations (2) Exception for structural impracticability.

(i) Full compliance with the requirements of this section is not required where a public entity can demonstrate that it is structurally impracticable to meet the requirements. Full compliance will be considered structurally impracticable only in those rare circumstances when the unique characteristics of terrain prevent the incorporation of accessibility features.

 

[Three Putt]

Up til now, that was the clause that I assumed was protecting us. The DOJ doesn't know what disc golf is, so it doesn't know that this should apply to us.

 

[RocksterB]

Disc Golf in Calaveras County

I'm Rocky Bridges from the article that started this conversation.
I'm really glad that this has spread to all parts of the county.
Something has to be done to change the distinction of disc golf.
It should be exempt from ADA like soccer, baseball, climbing walls
or hiking trails. I've contacted PDGA and forwarded the article
to them. I'm waiting for a reply and some action. We buy our
baskets from DGA and they have been informed also. This
action by DOJ needs to be overturned. Disc golf is not like
ball golf, don't lump us in with them. Thanks to all that have
responded to this blog. Spread the word and let's change
this ruling... All disc manufacturers need to know what's
happening.

 

[onemilemore]

I'm Rocky Bridges from the article that started this conversation.
I'm really glad that this has spread to all parts of the county.
Something has to be done to change the distinction of disc golf.
It should be exempt from ADA like soccer, baseball, climbing walls
or hiking trails. I've contacted PDGA and forwarded the article
to them. I'm waiting for a reply and some action. We buy our
baskets from DGA and they have been informed also. This
action by DOJ needs to be overturned. Disc golf is not like
ball golf, don't lump us in with them. Thanks to all that have
responded to this blog. Spread the word and let's change
this ruling... All disc manufacturers need to know what's
happening.

Glad to hear your forwarded it to the governing body. Innova would be good to let know as well, as they stand to lose money on discs AND baskets. Please keep us posted.

 

[DiscWazzu]

I would notify all the disc golf manufacturers in Cali about this. Ratchet up the pressure. This could seriously hurt their revenue stream.

 

[pmatt1969]

More crap that lacks common sense.

 

[RocksterB]

ADA and disc golf

Forward the article to whomever you think might need
to know. This has to be a national concerted effort to
change this ruling.:doh:

 

[davetherocketguy]

I work as a construction inspector in road work and I have to say that ADA specs are the bane of my existence. Many of these specs are written by overzealous government officials who have no clue just how difficult it is to build some of this crapola in the real world. It's pretty ridiculous to expect the ENTIRE world to conform to their inconsistent requirements.

For example, sidewalks are required to have no more than 2% cross slope and no more than 8% running slope with flat spots every 50' (I think.) So what if the road your sidewalk runs parallel to is steeper than 8%? Put in switch backs to maintain your >8% overall sidewalk slope? When that happens it is a royal PITA to get fed approval to go more than 8% because it is impossible to meet specifications. Ahh but the cross slope requirement gets tossed out the window when it comes to cross walks across the roadway that has more than 2% cross slope. :doh:

This ADA crapola is merely nothing more than government workers justifying some idiotic job. They change the specs every year so its like trying to hit a moving target.

Lawdy...if they make every disc golf course on public land be 100% ADA compatible you'll never see another new course in a park ever again. The only option will be placing courses on private land and the old courses in public parks will never EVER be able to have updates made to them without updates that include ADA garbage. Will they be able to require all new disc golf course installations meet ADA specs? Not likely but I certainly think they'll try.

Friggin federal idiots...

You know, I do feel bad for those that are wheelchair bound but those that administer the plans and specs are out of control.