Start hip rotation by your left knee or arm?

[Malawi]

Mhm so i finally understood what it means to start with the hips to get your upperbody lag behind to create that tension.

But how do you actully start the hip rotation?

By your heal on the plant foot when it goes down hip moves?

By your left knee pushing inwards and down or
by your left arm pushing down and forward a bit?

If doing both, when trying at home it feels that my knee moves when i push my left arm to my body and down, what should i focus on?

 

[Bush122]

IMO it's the first, your heel pushing into the ground. The off arm can help drive the weight shift somewhat though.

It is almost definitely not the back knee driving inwards - see this video for a good explanation

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Os3IcGVpoPA

 

[sidewinder22]

It gets kind of weird talking about initiating the motion. It's like walking, there is no real first move and if you really try to turn your hips you get something funky like Mike demonstrates turning the hips while walking.

 

[navel]

Like SW said there is no real starting point of it all. At least not as a big vector.
All well executed dynamic motions are sort of fluid.

• Jumping up on a big box. What is the starting motion?
• Getting out of a chair. What is the starting motion?
• Throwing a ball. What is the starting motion?
• Hammering a nail. What is the starting motion?

Try to find the starting motion in this golf swing. Is there any to speak of? Maybe it's just a wave of small motions and pressure shift creating bigger motions and mass transfer?

Do as Ben Hogan says and focus on two things only:
"There are two crises during the natural golf swing; when the clubhead moves away from the ball at the the start of the backswing, and when it is time to start the downswing."

Which means you should focus on swinging the disc away from target and then swinging it towards target as one fluid motion. Pressure moves mass. Let that be your mantra. Everything will follow naturally. It's like hammering that nail or jumping up on the box. Swing away and swing through. The mass will follow.

A fluid motion. Pressure shifts mass - shifting pressure - shifting mass...

 

[Malawi]

Thanks everyone for your replys!
Ye i noticed today that it would be to hard to focus on starting the rotation, when my heel hits the ground everything follows. But i really tried today to become a whip with slingshot arm and it kinda worked with some help pushing with left arm and the throw felt effortless but i Lost like 100 feet then if i use my arm muscles aswell when the disc is in the right pec and it feels heavier.

Should your arm just follow loose all the way to releasing the disc? Also i focused on dubble tapping swing in left arm right before my reachback is at the max to lunch it like a slingshot. Is it Worth focusing on, i watched a clip when they talked about lots of pros doing that.

 

[sidewinder22]

Is your arm loose/passive or active to pound a hammer into a nail or throwing a baseball?
https://www.dgcoursereview.com/forums/showthread.php?t=132910
https://www.dgcoursereview.com/forums/showthread.php?t=124523

 

[RowingBoats]

Thanks everyone for your replys!
Ye i noticed today that it would be to hard to focus on starting the rotation, when my heel hits the ground everything follows. But i really tried today to become a whip with slingshot arm and it kinda worked with some help pushing with left arm and the throw felt effortless but i Lost like 100 feet then if i use my arm muscles aswell when the disc is in the right pec and it feels heavier.

Should your arm just follow loose all the way to releasing the disc? Also i focused on dubble tapping swing in left arm right before my reachback is at the max to lunch it like a slingshot. Is it Worth focusing on, i watched a clip when they talked about lots of pros doing that.

I feel like this is an impossible question to answer really. Personally, I feel like emphasizing the idea of a pure, passive whip is something that will help you develop the correct paradigm. Doing the opposite, pure arm activation as the core goal, will get you absolutely nowhere.

Once you start doing...the thing...you will probably know how to go down the rabbit holes in this forum. The concept of a pure passive arm helped me first do the thing, and before that, I was way, way off base.

 

[Waddball]

Is your arm loose/passive or active to pound a hammer into a nail or throwing a baseball?

One thing disc golf has taught me is that I've been strong-arming baseball throws my whole life.

 

[azplaya25]

One thing disc golf has taught me is that I've been strong-arming baseball throws my whole life.

I've discovered the same with throwing a baseball, throwing a football…even shooting a free throw. Shooting a basketball is so much easier when you power it with mostly legs, and I had never done that before disc golf

 

[RFrance]

New post by Sling Shot Disc Golf.

 

[SocraDeez]

New post by Sling Shot Disc Golf.

He's got some good points about stacking weight/ maintaining balanced pressure for as long as possible with the stride leg going into the plant/ brace. But when he demonstrates the stand-still-back-knee-drop move, he's pretty much squishing the bug and not really shifting from behind into the brace.

Yes, the back hip-knee-foot unit does move like that but only after the weight/ pressure shift to the front side, and when the back hip-knee-foot unit starts swinging & releasing into rotation (or, is no longer pushing into the ground & able to maintain the torque w/ ground pressure).

So, just wanted to note that you have to do this motion first before the backside can perform that powerful drop/ off-side leg swing that he demonstrates.

Here's some related baseball technique videos that have been linked here previously that discuss this:

 

[azplaya25]

He's got some good points about stacking weight/ maintaining balanced pressure for as long as possible with the stride leg going into the plant/ brace. But when he demonstrates the stand-still-back-knee-drop move, he's pretty much squishing the bug and not really shifting from behind into the brace.

Yes, the back hip-knee-foot unit does move like that but only after the weight/ pressure shift to the front side, and when the back hip-knee-foot unit starts swinging & releasing into rotation (or, is no longer pushing into the ground & able to maintain the torque w/ ground pressure).

So, just wanted to note that you have to do this motion first before the backside can perform that powerful drop/ off-side leg swing that he demonstrates.

Here's some related baseball technique videos that have been linked here previously that discuss this:

 

[RFrance]

... But when he demonstrates the stand-still-back-knee-drop move, he's pretty much squishing the bug and not really shifting from behind into the brace.

...

The squishing the bug is pretty cringe worthy. SW22 points that out to him in the video comments, too.

 

[BillFleming]

When I started on throwing backhand from a standstill, I just could not get anything to work. I tried turning my hips first. My shoulders first. My torso. My back leg. Nothing got it working. Then I got the idea...what if I start by coming out of the X step? That way my body isn't standing still with me figuring out what part to move first....my body is moving and will continue moving. What I found is that I could even just lift my front leg and place it down again, which gave me enough body movement to flow through the throw.

It's the same with the walk/run up....your body is moving...let it move. I think of two things and it has improved my backhand....as I start, I (1) look where I want my last step to land at and (2) think of letting the disc go straight back as I move forward. (If I don't do #2, I tend to round the disc going back and then bad things happen).

 

[drk_evns]

The hip motion doesn't happen at the start of the throw... it's well into the whole picture. The momentum you bring into the shot, the x-step, balance... all of it needs to be happening correctly before you can initiate the hip motion to generate power... and it's less of an "initiating" than it is a harnessing of forces coming into the position.

"The weight shift comes from behind you" is a wonderful way to make this point.

 

[Malawi]

He's got some good points about stacking weight/ maintaining balanced pressure for as long as possible with the stride leg going into the plant/ brace. But when he demonstrates the stand-still-back-knee-drop move, he's pretty much squishing the bug and not really shifting from behind into the brace.

Yes, the back hip-knee-foot unit does move like that but only after the weight/ pressure shift to the front side, and when the back hip-knee-foot unit starts swinging & releasing into rotation (or, is no longer pushing into the ground & able to maintain the torque w/ ground pressure).

So, just wanted to note that you have to do this motion first before the backside can perform that powerful drop/ off-side leg swing that he demonstrates.

I watched that vid and really tried to feel the weight shift but i kinda dont. But went out searching more info about hiprotation and bracing and found an old thread on reddit that was about push against your plant foot with your left foot with left heel up to not loose out the power you build from runup. Guess that is while i take the last step its more of a push from left leg then a reaching step with right? Or is it after the plant foot is down u push? Both totally make sence in my head. Im sure i havent been doing any of that before..
this is the thread : https://www.reddit.com/r/discgolf/comments/3e2n1l/disc_golf_technique_push_with_your_foot_for_d/

 

[sidewinder22]

I watched that vid and really tried to feel the weight shift but i kinda dont. But went out searching more info about hiprotation and bracing and found an old thread on reddit that was about push against your plant foot with your left foot with left heel up to not loose out the power you build from runup. Guess that is while i take the last step its more of a push from left leg then a reaching step with right? Or is it after the plant foot is down u push? Both totally make sence in my head. Im sure i havent been doing any of that before..
this is the thread : https://www.reddit.com/r/discgolf/comments/3e2n1l/disc_golf_technique_push_with_your_foot_for_d/

Emerson is the smallest guy with the biggest stomp and pound for pound one of the longest throwers.

 

[Malawi]

Emerson is the smallest guy with the biggest stomp and pound for pound one of the longest throwers.

Ok thanks for the vids, think i have the idé on how to brace but i didnt understand from watching the vids if your left leg push the weight into the plant foot, if you should or could dom it in your last step or/and to help with weight transfer after the heel is down.

For me its easier to think of it like that to understand the feeling of things with a simple thing to do and later correct stuff properly. Like for example focus push left knee down and in to start hip rotation otherwise il end up pulling with my arm. So same thing for weight shift can my left leg push to help with balance and force into plant?

 

[sidewinder22]

Ok thanks for the vids, think i have the idé on how to brace but i didnt understand from watching the vids if your left leg push the weight into the plant foot, if you should or could dom it in your last step or/and to help with weight transfer after the heel is down.

For me its easier to think of it like that to understand the feeling of things with a simple thing to do and later correct stuff properly. Like for example focus push left knee down and in to start hip rotation otherwise il end up pulling with my arm. So same thing for weight shift can my left leg push to help with balance and force into plant?

Pushing after heel down is too late. You want everything going into the heel plant.

I do not understand pushing the left knee down and in.

 

[Lastchancer88]

Ok thanks for the vids, think i have the idé on how to brace but i didnt understand from watching the vids if your left leg push the weight into the plant foot, if you should or could dom it in your last step or/and to help with weight transfer after the heel is down.

For me its easier to think of it like that to understand the feeling of things with a simple thing to do and later correct stuff properly. Like for example focus push left knee down and in to start hip rotation otherwise il end up pulling with my arm. So same thing for weight shift can my left leg push to help with balance and force into plant?

I've recently been working on exactly this myself!
Try this: Do your normal x-step, but instead of thinking about the left leg at all, focus on getting enough momentum from your right legs first step to carry you over your left leg and into your right leg planting on the ground. Your left leg should always be at least slightly bent. The rhythm isn't r,l,r for the steps, but more like r, lr. If that makes any sense.

I am a late pusher/horse stance thrower. I sat down with a non disc golfer last night and had them explain to me what was different between me and a pro in left legs specifically. They said, "your leg isn't bent and you're not on your toes." After doing some more slow moves through the throw we worked out that if my left leg remains bent (remaining balanced) and I stay on my toes, the leg will naturally turn inward as the hips turn to the target after the right foot crushes the can. It forces that sudden dynamic shift into the brace that SW is talking about.

I think the left leg should add to the throw, there's obviously the Paige gif of her doing the sideways lunges but for me when I use the left leg I end up in a bunch of bad places. Looking forward to more insight on this idea though because it is very new to me.