What is the next step for disc golf coverage?

[oldmandiscer]

The other thing I didn't even mention is the website traffic itself. Which they can then add in ads as well. They could get 500K website visitors a week which then adds into selling way more merch, etc.

 

[oldmandiscer]

They also have like 6 or 8 full time employees. They're making a lot, but they also spend a lot.

They certainly do. I guess I sort of brought up this topic because Brodie mentioned it last year, that the players are sort of getting shafted.

 

[biscoe]

They certainly do. I guess I sort of brought up this topic because Brodie mentioned it last year, that the players are sort of getting shafted.

The players most certainly are not getting shafted, the TD's on the other hand have been taking it in full. Hopefully this will mitigate a bit but likely not very quickly if you don't have the initials DGPT in your event description.

 

[DiscFifty]

The players most certainly are not getting shafted, the TD's on the other hand have been taking it in full. Hopefully this will mitigate a bit but likely not very quickly if you don't have the initials DGPT in your event description.

The more I research TDs, player packs, merch, etc, with an incredibly hungry market for tournaments, there is plenty of money available for savvy TDs to make..if they put in the time to make it. Much respect for the labor of love TDs, but there is zero reason for any TD to not profit from running a tournament now days. And yes..I think the PDGA should do something to help TDs make money from running even a low cost C Tier event.

Your thoughts?

With so many media teams now days all producing similar quality, media teams have to bid to cover the larger events.

All the media companies sell ads, get sponsors, etc, for their disc golf content. The youtube ad revenue on top is typically very little (per video) unless you get over 500k or so and with 800k-1mil typically netting around $1000.00 depending on the youtube rate.

The current "fans paying for coverage" stage of our sport will continue until there is enough fans watching to warrant much higher priced ads, sponsorships, etc. Until that happens the people paying for content are basically helping fund the exposure and development of the DGPT & DGN (both owned by Todd Rainwater I'm assuming).

I respect the fact that the DGPT/DGN continues to promote good will by working with the current disc golf media teams to cover their events, but surely the DGN will go 100% in house at some point in the future. I would guess they absolutely have to have all that in place before they can "sell the product" to a larger media conglomerate.

 

[Lazerface]

It's crazy how low the YT revenue is based on these comments. It must be a tiny % of total revenue for Jomez, etc.

 

[txmxer]

There is a new "creators" website that is owned by content creators that is trying to do something like this. They still do their YT channel, but provide exclusives to their patreons via the creator website.

So, to follow OMD's idea, one would offer a subscription to see coverage next day and then some time a few weeks later it might show up on YT.

I would not be surprised to see something like this in the future.

 

[DiscFifty]

They still do their YT channel, but provide exclusives to their patreons via the creator website.

You can do all that right now with YouTube and Patreon. That's exactly what alot of content creators do. "Exclusive" or "Early" content for patreons.

 

[ru4por]

The more I research TDs, player packs, merch, etc, with an incredibly hungry market for tournaments, there is plenty of money available for savvy TDs to make..if they put in the time to make it. Much respect for the labor of love TDs, but there is zero reason for any TD to not profit from running a tournament now days. And yes..I think the PDGA should do something to help TDs make money from running even a low cost C Tier event.

Maybe you could share some of your research and insight on new avenues of revenue available for TDs.

 

[Ryan P.]

From someone in the IT world, the simplicity and cost that YT offers is unparalleled. They scale up and scale down, and there's no up front cost for the business (JomezPro in this case). They take only money off the top of earnings, so there's no risk. Yes, they do reduce earnings, but they also do free advertising. Remember when 2019 Worlds appeared on the front page of YouTube and gathered over a million views in just a couple days? that doesn't happen if there's a separate DG video website.

If they did separate, they'd need to hire someone to set it up (most likely a few people). Those people would be mainly contractors, meaning more $$$. There's also a commitment cost to those people, because if a contractor is told "we can pay you for a month, and if it's working, we'll pay you to finish the job," they're probably not taking it.

With that said, I know little about the inner workings of DG videos; i'm speaking purely from an IT perspective.

 

[DiscFifty]

Maybe you could share some of your research and insight on new avenues of revenue available for TDs.

New? I didn't say new....but here's a few things I've learned over the years:

1) Start marketing your event months ahead of the event. This is vital.
2) Reach out to local business to sponsor a hole. You have 18 holes to monetize.
3) Reach out to local business to sponsor your Facebook event page. They supply images you could post as ads with links to their business as photos, in posts, etc.
4) Charge vendors to set up tables and sell product during the event.
6) Reach out to a local disc golf store and pick up some product to sell and split the profits. Bring the rest back after the event.
7) Create an event "program" filled with sponsor ads, club info, etc.
8) Get a photographer to take photos of each player on hole #1 driving. Charge players for the photos (if they want them) split revenue with photographer.
9) Optional winner take all merch ctp. $5.00 to enter. Winner gets total entry as merch voucher for local store. Split the merch profit with the store owner.
10) Forced profits via player packs. Not a fan... but it works. Larger packs = more profit.

I could go on...but the TDs making money, treat it like a real business. When you have a good reputation and put on a good event, people will tend to play in your events over and over. A local 1 round flex start event last month had over 265 players. But those TDs have a solid reputation and always put on a good event.

 

[Cgkdisc]

New? I didn't say new....but here's a few things I've learned over the years:

1) Start marketing your event months ahead of the event. This is vital.
2) Reach out to local business to sponsor a hole. You have 18 holes to monetize.
3) Reach out to local business to sponsor your Facebook event page. They supply images you could post as ads with links to their business as photos, in posts, etc.
4) Charge vendors to set up tables and sell product during the event.
6) Reach out to a local disc golf store and pick up some product to sell and split the profits. Bring the rest back after the event.
7) Create an event "program" filled with sponsor ads, club info, etc.
8) Get a photographer to take photos of each player on hole #1 driving. Charge players for the photos (if they want them) split revenue with photographer.
9) Optional winner take all merch ctp. $5.00 to enter. Winner gets total entry as merch voucher for local store. Split the merch profit with the store owner.
10) Forced profits via player packs. Not a fan... but it works. Larger packs = more profit.

I could go on...but the TDs making money, treat it like a real business. When you have a good reputation and put on a good event, people will tend to play in your events over and over. A local 1 round flex start event last month had over 265 players. But those TDs have a solid reputation and always put on a good event.

At a modest $20/hr and having done all of these things from C-tiers to World events, the hours required versus the money raised in any of these items does not payoff for you but does generate added money for the players, especially if doing it for pro divisions.

I also understand various reasons why TDs are donating and continue to donate their valuable time. My own motivation which some other TDs might acknowledge was because I wanted to showcase the courses I had designed, or in my early years (90s), because I had experience in other sports to know how to do it "disc golf style." However, I suspect as veteran and new TDs see an increasing number of elite pros making big money, video teams making lesser money and the PDGA continuing their steady income stream from events, that TDs will either need to get a better piece of the pie to host pro divisions and events or they will quietly (some noisily) bow out of running them. Of course, to provide that better piece of the pie for pro TDs, the other stakeholders will either need to take less OR the holy grail is that large increases in spectator income will provide it.

 

[DiscFifty]

At a modest $20/hr and having done all of these things from C-tiers to World events, the hours required versus the money raised in any of these items does not payoff for you...

Isn't it fair to say your perceived hourly rate could go way up depending on your time management skills in the digital era? Depending on the event the only time you may need to do anything in person could be the day(s) of the event itself. And once you do a few events, surely you're stream lining the process.

Curious your thoughts on the PDGA kicking back maybe 5.00 to the TD out of each player registration?

 

[Ahildy13]

From someone in the IT world, the simplicity and cost that YT offers is unparalleled. They scale up and scale down, and there's no up front cost for the business (JomezPro in this case). They take only money off the top of earnings, so there's no risk. Yes, they do reduce earnings, but they also do free advertising. Remember when 2019 Worlds appeared on the front page of YouTube and gathered over a million views in just a couple days? that doesn't happen if there's a separate DG video website.

If they did separate, they'd need to hire someone to set it up (most likely a few people). Those people would be mainly contractors, meaning more $$$. There's also a commitment cost to those people, because if a contractor is told "we can pay you for a month, and if it's working, we'll pay you to finish the job," they're probably not taking it.

With that said, I know little about the inner workings of DG videos; i'm speaking purely from an IT perspective.

THANK YOU.
People seem to think the internet is free.

 

[txmxer]

You can do all that right now with YouTube and Patreon. That's exactly what alot of content creators do. "Exclusive" or "Early" content for patreons.

Similar to that, only the creators are doing their own site cutting out patreon and youtube.

 

[Cgkdisc]

Isn't it fair to say your perceived hourly rate could go way up depending on your time management skills in the digital era? Depending on the event the only time you may need to do anything in person could be the day(s) of the event itself. And once you do a few events, surely you're stream lining the process.

Curious your thoughts on the PDGA kicking back maybe 5.00 to the TD out of each player registration?

I'm on record, at least 10 years ago now, proposing to the PDGA competition group that the TDs should get the same player fee as the PDGA, i.e., $2 in C-tiers, $3 in B-tiers, $4 in A-tiers, and $5 for Majors. Note that McCoy and I were successful getting the $1 weekly per player league fee split between PDGA and LD with $0.50 to each when we got the PDGA league program underway.

TDs should probably get half of the $10 non-member C & B tier fee since they got those players to enter their event even though paying $10 extra that doesn't go to their purse. Perhaps that $5/$5 nonmember fee split idea could be a bonus for a TD which they only receive if they successfully fulfill their TD duties for that event or perhaps get a credit toward future sanctioning fees?

 

[txmxer]

THANK YOU.
People seem to think the internet is free.

you guys are right--it is definitely not free.

But, I think the point would be that if you have enough content, the opportunity might exist to do things a bit different.

 

[Ahildy13]

you guys are right--it is definitely not free.

But, I think the point would be that if you have enough content, the opportunity might exist to do things a bit different.

With significant investment, sure.
But when the platform is already there at scale, the work required doesn't provide a large enough return to be worth it.

 

[DanJon]

Clearly the top media groups aren't bringing in as much YT revenue as people may think when they have to rely so heavily on Patreon.

 

[txmxer]

With significant investment, sure.
But when the platform is already there at scale, the work required doesn't provide a large enough return to be worth it.

I don't know what the numbers are, I just know that there are those that are trying to make it work.

But it's a great point in regards to the infrastructure that YT provides.

 

[dreadlock86]

THANK YOU.
People seem to think the internet is free.

seriously

1. small disc golf business
2. internet magic
3. profit$$