- Joined
- Nov 2, 2008
- Messages
- 21,985
Everything is just a series of levers. The muscle provides a springy effect to the hinge effect when the sequence and timing is correct.
-
Discover new ways to elevate your game with the updated DGCourseReview app!
It's entirely free and enhanced with features shaped by user feedback to ensure your best experience on the course. (App Store or Google Play)
Why the Beato drill is so important.
- Thread starter HyzerUniBomber
- Start date
HyzerUniBomber
* Ace Member *
"Just lost the F%%%ing disc" Brilliant - just laughed very hard at that
Dude, you're going to start needing a bigger practice field very soon - those poor cars won't know what hit them!
I actually lost a disc that skipped off the sidewalk down there and landed in the back of a pickup truck! Between the pedestrians walking around, doing cross fit, sleeping under trees, eating lunch and of course the winter mega piles of goose cr@p - that park is not a good place for throwing.
But beggars can't be choosers... and school is back in session, so my little oasis of disc golf is off limits until 4pm.
Exactly. There's a sweet spot in that timing that really makes the leverage effortless.
Makes me think that it should not be called "throwing a disc" so much as "leveraging a disc". Leveraging can mean that you're taking advantage of less to get more, which is exactly what we're doing. We just so happen to be using a bunch of physical hinged levers and pivots to do so.
It's ok in some certain situations like downhill tees, long strides, and some anhyzers, your foot rolls to the inside so your ankle/heel still leads the toes.
I'll take it!
The x-step was actually going downhill, which made me fight off any extra momentum.I've been loving throwing those higher anhyzer shots with a champ beast, star archons and even teebirds. They turn so damn smooth and long.
More good stuff guys.
A couple of days ago I finally committed to playing a round from a standstill stance the whole time, and of course I was getting the same amount of distance with more accuracy by doing so.
The arm is a bunch of hinges which impart leverage on the disc and muscles do minimal work except provide elasticity to those hinges. I understand this but am having the hardest of times getting my body to agree. I can stand there and move my arm through a slow 90 degrees and snap my wrist while focusing on the disc rotating around the pinch point (wrist and point of contact hinges) and get at least 50% of the disc speed I do with a full throw. I can feel the "heavy disc" from the acceleration I'm imparting on the disc.
I'm struggling on adding in the other arm hinges (elbow and shoulder) and I think it could be from me strong arming still and not allowing my muscles to be relaxed rubber bands that allow the hinges to explode with leverage.
HUB, in your leverage video from yesterday I'm not exactly understanding what you do differently when you say "I'm going to add the weight of my arm and it's going to come into play out here". I feel like it could be part of what I'm not grasping with the rest of my arm.
Again thanks for all you guys continuing to discuss and throwing knowledge around.
A couple of days ago I finally committed to playing a round from a standstill stance the whole time, and of course I was getting the same amount of distance with more accuracy by doing so.
The arm is a bunch of hinges which impart leverage on the disc and muscles do minimal work except provide elasticity to those hinges. I understand this but am having the hardest of times getting my body to agree. I can stand there and move my arm through a slow 90 degrees and snap my wrist while focusing on the disc rotating around the pinch point (wrist and point of contact hinges) and get at least 50% of the disc speed I do with a full throw. I can feel the "heavy disc" from the acceleration I'm imparting on the disc.
I'm struggling on adding in the other arm hinges (elbow and shoulder) and I think it could be from me strong arming still and not allowing my muscles to be relaxed rubber bands that allow the hinges to explode with leverage.
HUB, in your leverage video from yesterday I'm not exactly understanding what you do differently when you say "I'm going to add the weight of my arm and it's going to come into play out here". I feel like it could be part of what I'm not grasping with the rest of my arm.
Again thanks for all you guys continuing to discuss and throwing knowledge around.
HyzerUniBomber
* Ace Member *
What I did differently was that I moved the elbow hinge further out in front so that the arm extended towards the target.
Try the same exercise (somewhere that an ejected disc won't murder somebody or break your wife's favorite Ming vase). It's easier to feel than explain, but weight of your upper arm doesn't get transferred into the disc if you open forearm lever early.
When you start opening from left pec, center or without the elbow extended forward - it's pretty easy to hold onto the disc.
Extended elbow, opening from the right pec - it's coming out for sure.
It's not a subtle difference when you feel it. Having the whole arm extended out front really magnifies the force.
I believe that's what Beto was saying about adding all the distance in his hit-back video.
46YearOldSlinger
Double Eagle Member
When you say start opening are you talking about opening the shoulders or opening the elbow hinge or both?
HyzerUniBomber
* Ace Member *
Elbow hinge.
It took a bunch of work for me to un-do being a left pec / center puller. During a few conversations here I was asking if anybody knew of any real benefit of opening the elbow hinge at the right pec vs. center.
It wasn't really fleshed out, other than to say that it's easier for most people to do from the center chest during a faster motion.
So I continued messing with the sensations I got from various slower-motion movements. At one point, in my office parking lot, I did exactly what I did in the video and slammed a disc against a Lexus. :wall:
That helped me see that by extending the elbow and getting to the right pec, when the arm extends (elbow hinge opens), you get more weight transferred down into that last knuckle pivot.
So much more that you simply will not be able to hold the disc.
And the physics reason behind it, appears to be that we're adding the moving weight of your upper arm (shoulder, bicep and tricep) into that kinetic chain. When you open the elbow hinge earlier, less of that moving mass gets added into the equation.
46YearOldSlinger
Double Eagle Member
Thanks, good stuff.
- Joined
- Aug 16, 2014
- Messages
- 1,680
I just got back from the field and I noticed two things. Standing still with the disc at the right pec, the only way to get the hinge to unhinge is with turning your torso (think of the ballerina lowering her hands). The only way to get any distance is to concentrate on turning faster. The other thing I noticed was that I had to increase my grip to get a straight throw, otherwise they all hyzered out.
I've only been playing a year and just starting to hit the 275 barrier. I can see that this will help my form immediately. From the videos it's easy to see that it's not strong arm but form that will help improve my play. Thanks HUB.
I've only been playing a year and just starting to hit the 275 barrier. I can see that this will help my form immediately. From the videos it's easy to see that it's not strong arm but form that will help improve my play. Thanks HUB.
good thread
To expand on that a little bit, if you hinge your elbow in the right position like you are talking about, your wrist flaps open and "pounds the hammer". You'll notice your thumb is pointing down the line at the basket.
If you hinge from the left pec, you'll notice that your wrist doesnt flap open the same and your thumb will be pointing in front of you instead of down the line.
I'm still working on this b/c I have an issue of opening my shoulders too early that I just can't kick. http://cl.ly/image/0B0r1Z1T260j screenshot, as close as I've gotten but the disc is already gone
instead of just leaving.any clue how to overcome this?
HyzerUniBomber
* Ace Member *
To expand on that a little bit, if you hinge your elbow in the right position like you are talking about, your wrist flaps open and "pounds the hammer". You'll notice your thumb is pointing down the line at the basket.
If you hinge from the left pec, you'll notice that your wrist doesnt flap open the same and your thumb will be pointing in front of you instead of down the line.
I'm still working on this b/c I have an issue of opening my shoulders too early that I just can't kick. http://cl.ly/image/0B0r1Z1T260j screenshot, as close as I've gotten but the disc is already gone
any clue how to overcome this?
Hey man, I don't think you're really over-opening your shoulders.
I think you're just not getting quite enough elbow extension. I've been talking with a guy over email in the same boat. It's REALLY hard to unlearn that motion. It really is. We've been talking back and forth and he's making slow progress and I actually sent him this earlier today:
It is easier to learn slowly, I've been trying to come up with a way to teach/explain it - but I keep coming up blank. The best I have is trying to extend your arm and wrist forward out in front of you.
HyzerUniBomber
* Ace Member *
Right pec and elbow extension are inexorably linked.
Impressive detective work to find that video! :clap:
I did a few throws well in that video. Ones where I didnt open my shoulders too early and that was one of them but I do see what you are saying about the elbow.
I have such a hard time going slow but I know I need to in order to get that feeling. You can def. see in your gif of me that the the disc is coming out early, well before i get the wrist flap/arm extension.
I think I know what i should be doing, it is just actually doing it that is the problem. What I would love to see is someone walking through the motions. Something so slow that the disc only goes 100ft if that.
I'll work on getting that elbow out more and see if that helps my shoulders opening early and the arm extension. I've always liked the punching/'back hand the midget' reference. Makes sense in my small mind
I did a few throws well in that video. Ones where I didnt open my shoulders too early and that was one of them but I do see what you are saying about the elbow.
I have such a hard time going slow but I know I need to in order to get that feeling. You can def. see in your gif of me that the the disc is coming out early, well before i get the wrist flap/arm extension.
I think I know what i should be doing, it is just actually doing it that is the problem. What I would love to see is someone walking through the motions. Something so slow that the disc only goes 100ft if that.
I'll work on getting that elbow out more and see if that helps my shoulders opening early and the arm extension. I've always liked the punching/'back hand the midget' reference. Makes sense in my small mind
HyzerUniBomber
* Ace Member *
not as impressive when you know I'm ExcuseMyTriceratops at r/dg... got some video from this lunch break coming shortly. I slowed it way down, hopefully it helps.
HyzerUniBomber
* Ace Member *
okay, so I did my best to try to explain the elbow driving into that happy place.
Got pulled over right after leaving this park for a rolling stop... was super nice to the cop and he let me go with a warning.
Got pulled over right after leaving this park for a rolling stop... was super nice to the cop and he let me go with a warning.
Keep the videos coming! Those are impressive throws Man!
HyzerUniBomber
* Ace Member *
Thanks guys, I put up a new blog post today where I highlight some of the emails back and forth I've had with a guy who is trying to fix this stuff:
http://heavydisc.blogspot.com/2014/09/elbow-extension.html
http://heavydisc.blogspot.com/2014/09/elbow-extension.html
threevok
Double Eagle Member
You should feel honored. You are the first person in Colorado to have been stopped for this.
Similar threads
