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Central Coast Disc Golf's Paul McBeth Video "Ask Me Anything"
- Thread starter Aim For The Chains
- Start date
BirdieMachine
Michael Moore Fan Club President
Smaller baskets no doubt, 25 footers shouldn't basically be gimmes for top level.
10' is miss-able in ball golf. The holes are typically about 1000'. 1% distance is a miss-able putt. DG ... 300' holes, and 30' is miss-able (I guess) ... 10x as much distance taken up putting.
However ... our holes are elevated. In ball golf, a miss on a 10' putt could mean you're infinitesimally close to the pin (and often does). A miss from 30' in dg usually means a 15' comebacker. The infinite loop of 15 footers is not inviting :/
However ... our holes are elevated. In ball golf, a miss on a 10' putt could mean you're infinitesimally close to the pin (and often does). A miss from 30' in dg usually means a 15' comebacker. The infinite loop of 15 footers is not inviting :/
BirdieMachine
Michael Moore Fan Club President
10' are only 40% on the PGA Tour if I recall correctly. Basically you need to one putt in disc golf, putting is far far far easier.
Streets
* Ace Member *
- Joined
- Oct 29, 2012
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- 10,596
His reaction to the long putt in the playoff with Ricky: "It was just a 35 footer." Lol
bballr4567
Eagle Member
That was actually pretty good.
Super distracted with the ultimate game in the background though. Haha
Super distracted with the ultimate game in the background though. Haha
clard
Double Eagle Member
I love that they mentioned the Sidewinder22 forehand challenge. Made me lol. Which of you submitted that?
grotto
Double Eagle Member
- Joined
- Jun 6, 2014
- Messages
- 1,336
Being bored, I waded through the Stokely thread to see what all the fuss was about. After Paul's interview, I was pleasantly encouraged that our sport/hobby has a sane voice. A much better diversion from the ridicules drama on the forums lately.
BlazedOrangeHat
Par Member
1% of 300' is 3' not 30'.
thatdirtykid
Older than my birth year suggests.
- Joined
- Dec 23, 2005
- Messages
- 7,129
Which he knew, and is why he said 10x more distance is used putting.
Putting will remain different and is hard to compare hitting an elevated target and one in the ground. A perfect chip shot in golf the ball would be coming to a stop as it hits the cup, falling in. A perfect chip shot (lets say a 80' putt) either goes in (with risk of going by 10-20' on a forgiving green) or it lands under the basket for a drop in, but never had the chance of going in.
These two are not very comparable (although I agree that with the way courses are designed, putting is easier than it needs to be)
Putting will remain different and is hard to compare hitting an elevated target and one in the ground. A perfect chip shot in golf the ball would be coming to a stop as it hits the cup, falling in. A perfect chip shot (lets say a 80' putt) either goes in (with risk of going by 10-20' on a forgiving green) or it lands under the basket for a drop in, but never had the chance of going in.
These two are not very comparable (although I agree that with the way courses are designed, putting is easier than it needs to be)
Ender175
Eagle Member
Umm...I think that's why he said 10x the range of makeable putts in disc golf
nolangherity
Banned
haha and sidewinders sitting there just trying to convince himself that hes cool for being mentioned.
Jacob
Birdie Member
For this reason I think it's better to compare the putting part of the game to basketball. The average player is capable of making it from within 25ft sometimes. An advanced player can make these more often. The best in the world can make them pretty much all the time. When I look at it that way, I'm ok with the top 4 or 5 guys making anything inside the circle look easy.
Also, a ball golf putt longer than 3ft is a gimme for no man. Pros will line them up and go through their whole routine for anything over a few inches
onemilemore
* Ace Member *
Reminds me a lot of Travis Barker in tone, mannerisms, etc. Just needs some tats.
i dont think the putting needs to be harder, i think the courses need to be harder for these top tier events.
the problem with that like so many other problems our sport has with going big is that there isnt an economic incentive to build something like that. if somebody could spend a million dollars buying the land and then building a true championship level course where top guys struggle to land inside 40' for that birdie look on a lot of holes; and then be able to make money of that investment we wouldn't need smaller baskets.
i think changing the basket size could have an overall negative effect on disc golf as a whole. do you just make them smaller for the big events? if so then the fans (or the fans they wish to attract) are going to watch pros playing a different game then they're playing. name another major sport where amateur players play a different game than the pros. amateur golfers aren't playing on bigger holes (yeah they were but that **** failed big time).
when kids fall in love with a sport they go out and emulate the pros they see and the kids are going to see different equipment then what they see locally. that takes away from the mystique of it in a way. so what are we going to make all baskets smaller? that makes the game much harder for newer/casual players and possibly deter some people from playing because of how hard it is. for a lot of people the joy of disc golf is the relaxing casual nature of it; i think small baskets might take some of that away.
also... can you imagine your local pitch and putt that's already crowded with casual players after they put in skinnier baskets. round times will increase exponentially along with younger/casual fans frustration.
to me you don't change the equipment of the sport unless it's gradual and as a whole; and making baskets much smaller for the pro game isn't the way to go about it because the amount you'd have to decrease them to have a serious effect on scores would hurt the casual game.
don't change the equipment, make the course harder.
the problem with that like so many other problems our sport has with going big is that there isnt an economic incentive to build something like that. if somebody could spend a million dollars buying the land and then building a true championship level course where top guys struggle to land inside 40' for that birdie look on a lot of holes; and then be able to make money of that investment we wouldn't need smaller baskets.
i think changing the basket size could have an overall negative effect on disc golf as a whole. do you just make them smaller for the big events? if so then the fans (or the fans they wish to attract) are going to watch pros playing a different game then they're playing. name another major sport where amateur players play a different game than the pros. amateur golfers aren't playing on bigger holes (yeah they were but that **** failed big time).
when kids fall in love with a sport they go out and emulate the pros they see and the kids are going to see different equipment then what they see locally. that takes away from the mystique of it in a way. so what are we going to make all baskets smaller? that makes the game much harder for newer/casual players and possibly deter some people from playing because of how hard it is. for a lot of people the joy of disc golf is the relaxing casual nature of it; i think small baskets might take some of that away.
also... can you imagine your local pitch and putt that's already crowded with casual players after they put in skinnier baskets. round times will increase exponentially along with younger/casual fans frustration.
to me you don't change the equipment of the sport unless it's gradual and as a whole; and making baskets much smaller for the pro game isn't the way to go about it because the amount you'd have to decrease them to have a serious effect on scores would hurt the casual game.
don't change the equipment, make the course harder.
Nice interview - but please choose another location with better light and less wind next time 
I do have to disagree with Paul though. I do not want to see more open courses with smaller baskets. I don't want to compare it to ball golf so let's not even go there. Sure it might make it a bit more interesting for the pros. But that could be done with elevated baskets, obstacles or out of bounds on the big events as well (imagine a basket you can only reach from one side...).
The worst thing for a casual player (like me) is open fairways where you need a big arm. If putting then will become even more frustrating the game is not too much fun anymore. What makes discgolf interesting are the fairways that have trees etc, where you need to shape lines. That is also the difficult part of discgolf as we stated in a lot of other discussions. Getting to the basket needs to be the challenge. Hitting trees is more fun than throwing 8 times in the open until you reach the basket. It is also way more intersting to see the pros hit a tree and get out of trouble in amazing ways than parking 600ft holes on open fairways.
On a side note: What are the "made putt" percentages of top pros inside the circle right now?
I do have to disagree with Paul though. I do not want to see more open courses with smaller baskets. I don't want to compare it to ball golf so let's not even go there. Sure it might make it a bit more interesting for the pros. But that could be done with elevated baskets, obstacles or out of bounds on the big events as well (imagine a basket you can only reach from one side...).
The worst thing for a casual player (like me) is open fairways where you need a big arm. If putting then will become even more frustrating the game is not too much fun anymore. What makes discgolf interesting are the fairways that have trees etc, where you need to shape lines. That is also the difficult part of discgolf as we stated in a lot of other discussions. Getting to the basket needs to be the challenge. Hitting trees is more fun than throwing 8 times in the open until you reach the basket. It is also way more intersting to see the pros hit a tree and get out of trouble in amazing ways than parking 600ft holes on open fairways.
On a side note: What are the "made putt" percentages of top pros inside the circle right now?
nolangherity
Banned
well first off, i believe paul was saying he'd like to see the smaller targets at NTs, which would involve nothing more than hauling 18 baskets around in a trailer.
i dont believe he feels that every course should have the 'pro' baskets, just that they should be used for certain events, which wouldnt affect most people, especially not the chuckers at your local course.
also the 'kids seeing different equipment' reasoning is bogus. kids play soccer on a smaller field and the baskets (bball) are set lower. not to mention teeball or softball. i also dont think that kids are the answer to 'growing the sport.' people seem to have it backwards.. baseball and basketball arent popular because they were force fed to children in between their studies, they were featured in schools BECAUSE they were popular.
BirdieMachine
Michael Moore Fan Club President
My main sport was ball golf for 25 years so that's where I'm coming from when saying putting is too easy in disc golf. I think what we saw in Australia was what I really enjoyed watching. More Par 4's in that 600-700 range, now add some slightly skinner baskets to challenge the putting and you have a top tier course.
Don't get me wrong I enjoy par 3's as much as anyone, but I think more length is needed to challenge these players. Land in a certain part of the fairway to set up your approach shots.
I hope this trend continues into longer and tougher courses, we have plenty of short courses for the avg chucker already.
But I'm also not a fan of the ropes, to me if you need ropes to make a challenge then the course was designed poorly. I do think if putting was harder that could negate the ropes also.
Don't get me wrong I enjoy par 3's as much as anyone, but I think more length is needed to challenge these players. Land in a certain part of the fairway to set up your approach shots.
I hope this trend continues into longer and tougher courses, we have plenty of short courses for the avg chucker already.
But I'm also not a fan of the ropes, to me if you need ropes to make a challenge then the course was designed poorly. I do think if putting was harder that could negate the ropes also.
It was great to see Super. Brings me right back to La Mirada.
i addressed that, i said if you're going to change the equipment for major tournaments and not the rest of the sport you're creating a divide between the pro level and the amateur level that shouldnt exist and doesnt exist in any other sport.
i didnt say he did believe that, and again if you read my statement and my above statement you'll catch on.
this is all just wrong. kids stop playing on the little soccer goals at U6, are you really trying to use that as your example to prove that kids wanting to play the same game as pros is bogus? yes you're so right those four year olds out there clearly aren't looking up to pros and dont care what goal they're using.
at that age they move up to a goal that's slightly smaller than a professional goal size which they move up to usually around high school age. that has nothing to do with making it easier or harder and everything to do with matching the size of the kids. baseball is the same way; the kids aren't using giant wide bats to hit the ball with.
in disc golf size of the kids has nothing to do with it and it has everything to do with skill level; and if you cared to not nitpick out of my argument you'll see i also included casual and amateur level players who could be way higher in skill.
do lower level tennis players use a lower net? do second tier tour golfers use giant holes? do amateur bowlers have wider balls? you might want to rethink all of that before you go throwing words like bogus.
it's kind of pointless to point out how wrong you were about basketball growing. if you knew anything about the history of basketball you'd realize how dumb you just sounded. Naismith... YMCA kids... they took it worldwide as an activity for KIDS. there wasn't a serious basketball league until 50 years later and even then it wasn't overly popular.
wait what am i doing let me just point out how many corporations target kids to get them hooked on things so they grow up on them and then continue to use those products as adults... yeah you're so much more right than the tobacco industry, the soft drink industries, fast food industries, packaged food industries...
