lostDoughnut Progression

[lostDoughnut]

i think im at the process of going back thru my form (3rd time) and revisiting a few points. with the weather/rain/snow i cant do the leg work inside as often/comfortably as i would like

this time watching the reciprocating dingle arm and this section stood out to myself (reciprocated dingle arm combined with the tilted spiral movement[ tilted spiral is in another video but the information within that video combined with reciprocating video has helped me learn how my arm moves when my chest is over my toes from the start of a standstill throw])
https://youtu.be/DLo97jXn5Wo?t=409
i feel i was trying to throw on this flat plane and i didnt even know it

i feel like the farther i throw, i learn to loosen up, then i throw farther, then i get more tense as im looking for more distance and then the problems start to crop up

i have these notes on my phone too but i like adding to this thread as well

 

[sidewinder22]

 

[DrBone]

That is such an insightful post. One thing I've been thinking about is how to get smaller chunks of feedback. For me the only feedback I get in a throw is how the disc flies - so if i got everything else correct but had a bad wrist angle or a slipped grip then I get overall negative feedback. There is no reinforcement of a proper weight shift and timing which may have happened prior to the incorrect portion of the throw.

I think this is what makes crush the can / kick the ball so useful. You know right away if you did it correctly. Other than that I find it pretty difficult to break down the throw into smaller pieces that can be drilled and then put back together. Video is really the only way to see what pieces were good and what pieces were bad but the feedback loop is very long. Something like what Dr. Kwon has where a swing can be immediately analyzed in depth would be so awesome: take a throw and within 1 second look to see if your spine angle was correct or not, take another swing and see the comparison. I feel like you could advance so quickly with something like that.

 

[lostDoughnut]

One thing I've been thinking about is how to get smaller chunks of feedback. For me the only feedback I get in a throw is how the disc flies - so if i got everything else correct but had a bad wrist angle or a slipped grip then I get overall negative feedback. There is no reinforcement of a proper weight shift and timing which may have happened prior to the incorrect portion of the throw.

I think this is what makes crush the can / kick the ball so useful. You know right away if you did it correctly. Other than that I find it pretty difficult to break down the throw into smaller pieces that can be drilled and then put back together. Video is really the only way to see what pieces were good and what pieces were bad but the feedback loop is very long. Something like what Dr. Kwon has where a swing can be immediately analyzed in depth would be so awesome: take a throw and within 1 second look to see if your spine angle was correct or not, take another swing and see the comparison. I feel like you could advance so quickly with something like that.

the hardest part for me is getting the foundation of the form down. the simple standstill no legs involved throwing the disc (closed shoulder drill). it makes sense at times when watching videos but in practice my muscles are like 'whats going on??'. over time with practice practice practice the muscle memory starts to work out and you have to think less about something and then move onto the next thing to work on.

i started out too with the only feedback was how the disc flew. and that was perfect as it was something to start with.

for me i am always searching for a feeling. when i started practicing it took me at least a couple months to learn how to get a certain feeling when doing a movement. i was starting to throw farther, but i still had bad form. every once in awhile i would throw and the disc would fly alot farther and the throw simply just felt good. videos help a ton but a good throw that feels good you cant capture. its simply something that must be experienced. i believe you will get it within time!!:thmbup:

 

[lostDoughnut]

i took it really back into basics. i feel i lack some body awareness with my drive leg so hoping this gets my leg familiar with being leveraged. i just rocked back and forth. i was only thinking of the tension in my leg. i didnt worry about rotating my upper body (really basic movement, lol)



from there i tried pre address + reciprocating dingle arm + just 1 leg double dragon kick



im mainly just thinking about keeping my arm loose and making sure the plant leg kicks back before the right arm swings back. its SUCH a hard thing to practice and be aware of.opcorn:

from the rocking back and forth i really felt more comfortable when i did my pre address. i picked up my left leg and moved it away from target and then i leveraged off of my right leg to get my cog to start moving [it would go towards back of tee]. after a few tries. it felt more natural than i can ever remember



what im really impressed with is how natural and easier its becoming for my upper body to relax and turn away from the basket. im getting my left shoulder closer towards the basket than my right shoulder during the backswing. im not able to get it every time but the consistency has gone up alot.

im working on my balance to be this flexible. :clap:

after all that i went back to practicing the reciprocating dingle arm. looking at the video now looks like im trying to keep my arm on a horizontal plane?? not sure what my thoughts were at the time

 

[sidewinder22]

The rocking one was a little rocky, seemed to get a little better as it went on.

The others looked much better especially the address one. Your lower body is still jumping ahead into the plant and your upper body/arms get stuck behind a little. Watch how I fall more into the plant without jumping off rear foot.

Your rear hip/spine is extending instead of hinging/sitting/coiling leveraging deeper into door frame drill. Note how much further my rear foot is able to move away from the door frame. You are stuck in the drill once the hip extends. If you can do swivel stairs then it's not a mobility issue, it's a movement pattern issue.

 

[lostDoughnut]

went out on sunday and the sole idea was reciprocating dingle arm. i was trying to stay as loose as possible. mayb even a bit too loose :\



sometimes i would release with too much hyzer angle. still looks like or i feel my hand gets too high (relative to ground) during the backswing

 

[lostDoughnut]

this was an interesting watch. im sure i have seen stuff about lats before, this time it stood out to me.

 

[lostDoughnut]

Your rear hip/spine is extending instead of hinging/sitting/coiling leveraging deeper into door frame drill. Note how much further my rear foot is able to move away from the door frame. You are stuck in the drill once the hip extends. If you can do swivel stairs then it's not a mobility issue, it's a movement pattern issue.

there is some confusion on my end. my upper body is tilted towards the target as a result of my single double dragon leg kick away from the basket. i thought my leg kicks out and away from the target which then makes my spine tilt towards the basket a little. then my cog falls towards the basket. im probably missing something :wall:

 

[sidewinder22]

Keep the rear foot toes on the ground sliding more behind/underneath you. Your rear foot goes up to counter balance tipping over. Get into a little wider diagonal athletic stance.

Probably need more intention to hit or slash thru earlier contact point.

 

[sidewinder22]

there is some confusion on my end. my upper body is tilted towards the target as a result of my single double dragon leg kick away from the basket. i thought my leg kicks out and away from the target which then makes my spine tilt towards the basket a little. then my cog falls towards the basket. im probably missing something :wall:

It needs to change tilt again/hinge in transitioning into the plant. Spine and front leg should always be in dynamic alignment as the leg swings/kicks back and forth pulling the spine, so it would always catch you. If you kicked in zero gravity the leg should still catch you upside down on the ceiling.

 

[lostDoughnut]

It needs to change tilt again/hinge in transitioning into the plant. Spine and front leg should always be in dynamic alignment as the leg swings/kicks back and forth pulling the spine, so it would always catch you. If you kicked in zero gravity the leg should still catch you upside down on the ceiling.

doh! dunno how i missed that part :doh:. thank you for the clarification! :thmbup:

 

[lostDoughnut]

the swivel stairs makes sense in what i need to try to do with my left knee (add knee flexion).

https://youtu.be/gJlX0ht0gyE?t=145

 

[lostDoughnut]

i remember this feeling before. i was just messing around in my apartment and there is such a more pronounced 'jolt' feeling in my body when my spine is aligned with my plant leg when my plant leg lands.

going through videos again and i remember the power of posture video. its so true having to revisit stuff multiple times.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q5xfv9jPqZs&t=387s

rain has kept me indoors , cant wait to try this outside

 

[lostDoughnut]

taking it back 1 more step. going back to standstills from a small 1 step.

trying to figure out the plant leg leverage and having my upper body move on a pendulum

 

[sidewinder22]

Your leg action/pelvic tilt is like the opposite. Your rear knee is collapsing and front knee extending with ankle dorsiflexed(flat footed), I'm extending rear knee and bending front knee(kicking in) as front ankle extends and foot leaves the ground like walking.

Stand feet somewhat close together, natural standing position, bend one knee and extend the opposite knee. Your pelvis and bending knee should turn/swing into the extending/posting knee.

 

[lostDoughnut]

i went out today before i read this thread. and the notes that i took were.

"feel like im getting stuck on my plant foot during the downswing"


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Izr_JOThcCw&t=8s

i feel like im swaying outside of my feet and its causing issues

 

[lostDoughnut]

posting this here for easier reference

 

[lostDoughnut]

oooooooooook, think im starting to get it

below would be working on figure 8. my pre address my hips are closed. front knee is bent rear knee is extended at the pre address start for both throws


below would be working on the door frame drill



i have to tell on myself again. the video below is unrelated to the above video. the first throw was ok, but the second and third i did something i didnt like (watch my left foot during the downswing) :doh::doh:

 

[sidewinder22]

my pre address my hips are closed. front knee is bent rear knee is extended at the pre address start for both throws

Opposite knees at address position. Stand up on front leg. Rear knee bent so rear foot can go on very tippy toes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y-KVWfUkQ3s#t=3m14s