[Innova] The Innova Disc Real Armspeed Real Performance Riddle

[optidiscic]

rank those discs by what speed they will fly straightest at with the order starting with the meatiest and descending to the pansiest.
Explain how understanding the speed required to fly str8 is a bad thing
in my mind knowing this allows me to know when a player should attempt to power up or down on a disc. Or it aids in disc selection in the store and on the course. Sure there are other variables but knowing a faster disc like a katana can be kept straight with less power than a much slower firebird is pretty important and interesting stuff to a newcomer. As the charts exist there is no way to convey this.

 

[Frank Delicious]

Joe's flight chart explains how a disc flies when throw at the ideal speed. Knowing how hard you have to throw a disc to get it to fly straight is of very limited use. Knowing how hard you have to throw a disc to get it to fly it's intended flight path (which JFC does) is much more useful and lets you know if you many things about your power and form.

 

[optidiscic]

Is that thin crust understable pizza or thick crust overstable pizza cause when I get mad I wanna know how much power is required to hit certain persons with a straight shot in the face.
Frank even though you can't come to the pizza party I will save you a piece

 

[Frank Delicious]

in my mind knowing this allows me to know when a player should attempt to power up or down on a disc. Or it aids in disc selection in the store and on the course. Sure there are other variables but knowing a faster disc like a katana can be kept straight with less power than a much slower firebird is pretty important and interesting stuff to a newcomer. As the charts exist there is no way to convey this.

I don't need to know what power it takes to get a disc to go straight to recommend a disc to a player. If I see a person throwing an Xcal 200', no matter what flight path it takes, I am gonna tell them they need to disc down. If I am at the store looking for new discs, I already know how far I can throw and can use the basic innova/dc flight ratings to know what discs I can throw and what they will do.

The way Innova and DC rank things is very simple and while not ideal explains what a disc will do pretty well if you take the time to think about it. DC's is super simple, the bigger the number, the more turn it is gonna have. Innova usually has a super useful chart hanging out at the rack so you can see all the flight paths/speeds and you can figure out what a disc will do from there using the same principle as the DC one. Bigger speed/fade number equals more left turn.

 

[garublador]

Explain how understanding the speed required to fly str8 is a bad thing

There is no "speed to fly straight" for most of those discs. Most of them require you to throw them at the ground to keep them from fading. Some of them have low upper speed bounds (they'll turn too easy) and will require you to throw them at the ground to keep from fading. You're asking for speed when really speed to get these to fly straight when really the line you need to throw is much more important.

in my mind knowing this allows me to know when a player should attempt to power up or down on a disc.

I'd argue that if powering up or down on a disc will make that big of a difference you've made a poor disc choice. Ideally the discs you choose will have a relatively wide range of speeds that they'll fly well on and you'll easily meet the lower bound.

Or it aids in disc selection in the store and on the course. Sure there are other variables but knowing a faster disc like a katana can be kept straight with less power than a much slower firebird is pretty important and interesting stuff to a newcomer. As the charts exist there is no way to convey this.

The charts already show this. Joe's is more clear with the power requirement rather than Innova's speed rating, but what you're asking for is already there.

I know what you're really getting at is trying to convince yourself and others that throwing faster, more understable discs is a better idea that actually learning to throw correctly and you can't be surprised when some of us don't bite. Going both up in speed and more understable to try to throw faster plastic isn't a good idea. If you're under powering an understable disc to get a straight flight then small changes in speed (e.g. a slightly better/worse throw, wind) will result in relatively large changes in stability. You're sacrificing a lot of control and predictability for a pretty small change in distance. In the time it takes to "dial in" a faster, understable disc you could have just learned to throw better and you'd end up with the same distance but much more control.

 

[EL-KABONG]

I apologize for any negativity I brought to the party. Try to understand that your defensive and stubborn hold on your well-intentioned but inherently flawed idea for a game/riddle/tool is frustrating me.

I will try to be less offensive and more constructive in my criticism.

 

[Pro Destroyer]

I don't get what benefit is derived from this exercise.

Optidisc may be in need of a new driver. This may be a way to help him decide which disc to buy.

 

[optidiscic]

I know what you're really getting at is trying to convince yourself and others that throwing faster, more understable discs is a better idea that actually learning to throw correctly and you can't be surprised when some of us don't bite. Going both up in speed and more understable to try to throw faster plastic isn't a good idea. If you're under powering an understable disc to get a straight flight then small changes in speed (e.g. a slightly better/worse throw, wind) will result in relatively large changes in stability. You're sacrificing a lot of control and predictability for a pretty small change in distance. In the time it takes to "dial in" a faster, understable disc you could have just learned to throw better and you'd end up with the same distance but much more control.

Really thats what I'm getting at....thats quite a leap

I throw slower drivers than most players I don't even have a speed 13 disc and refuse to throw one other than messing around.

I was actually getting at a fun exercise that might be a way for some to think a bit differently about the many discs out there. and might help some players out to be cerebral about the discs available
Why it has to be so useful, practical, and utilitarian boggles my mind.
Joes GGT is ok but it still can't form the list I was trying to challenge others to come up with.
Sorry to ruin your day

 

[Frank Delicious]

Why it has to be so useful, practical, and utilitarian boggles my mind.

Because doing a pointless thought exercise is not that fun

Joes GGT is ok but it still can't form the list I was trying to challenge others to come up with.

It doesn't need to form your list, it offers up much more useful information for evaluating discs.

(sarcastic answer: Oh noooo! JFC can't generate a useless list that doesn't help me in any way. What will I do now?)

 

[optidiscic]

I admit my semantics suck but I don't really feel like writing in legalese to avoid being attacked later by internet lawyers.
I don't think I am the stubborn one....I am not insisting on anything but to see what people think the order of these discs would be based on power or wind speed to fly straight as possible.
I didn't start the put down parade
I fell for the bait and got trolled....silly me
I was just curious as to what others thought the order might be
I don't need a new disc been trying to throw less molds in different weights and plastics

 

[Frank Delicious]

people disagreeing with you or asking you to clarify your point are not trolling you. I hope that realizing you're not getting trolled improves your day.

 

[optidiscic]

I still find it interesting that there are different lists generated and that just proves my point that many have a different understanding or belief system about the discs they play with....I was hoping to promote some discussion about why people felt differently but have found myself being attacked for being different.
Flings Pizza at Garublador

 

[optidiscic]

people disagreeing with you or asking you to clarify your point are not trolling you. I hope that realizing you're not getting trolled improves your day.

thats it though Frank I have no point I was just curious about how people might rank the discs and thought we might educate one another...did you look at some of the lists.....all quite different which I find interesting and thats where I was hoping the debate would center....not on me for crying out loud :wall:

 

[Frank Delicious]

I still find it interesting that there are different lists generated and that just proves my point that many have a different understanding or belief system about the discs they play with....I was hoping to promote some discussion about why people felt differently but have found myself being attacked for being different.
Flings Pizza at Garublador

thats it though Frank I have no point I was just curious about how people might rank the discs and thought we might educate one another...did you look at some of the lists.....all quite different which I find interesting and thats where I was hoping the debate would center....not on me for crying out loud :wall:

noice

 

[Frank Delicious]

Also no one attacked you for being different or whatever your martyr complex is telling you.

 

[optidiscic]

??????????????

 

[Frank Delicious]

Don't worry about it, you still need to figure out if you have a point or not.

 

[optidiscic]

I'm trying to figure out who has less of a life..me or you for continuing this debate that no one cares about

 

[Frank Delicious]

I'm at work figuring out very boring numbers that will never seen by anyone but myself so I have got lots of time to debate on here today.

So what was your point of this thread again?

 

[optidiscic]

I am at home and can't sleep after working 3rd shift last evening and am trying to avoid anything purposeful

my point was one of curiousity to see how others understood discs to perform.

I chose the str8 idea as it was a way to rank them...I could have chosen when a disc turns and burns or when a disc fades out but I chose str8. (I should of chosen straightish as a term to avoid garubladors wrath)
I could have asked at what speed do these discs fly straightest but I went with the ranking idea...I thought it would be fun
I was basically curious about how the list would be put together by others and those that replied gave differing lists and I was hoping to debate monster vs boss as toughest to throw str8 etc....instead we have what we have here......failure to communicate

Ironically now that we are being civil to one another I am off to the disc store to buy a new star roadrunner and new star firebird (might try champ) I never plan on throwing either of these discs straight as they are primarily utility discs for me...

Cheers