Why don't Tournament Directors get paid?

[kerplunk]

It seems like most of the events around here (Austin, TX) are for-profit, and I am pretty sure the Spike Hyzer events in NC are too. Chuckster runs a great event so I don't see anyone being upset with him making $$, I don't have enough experience in events here in the ATX yet to comment on the quality.

 

[turbosteve]

The Olympics have never given any kind of response to DG (certainly not detailed enough to address our targets) because they've never formally been asked. But on that subject, disc golf is a long way away because the first thing needed is for the IOC to recognize the governing body of the sport. They've recognized WFDF, but is that enough to get disc golf in the door? I don't believe it is. Until the PDGA falls in line with WFDF in terms of implementing an anti-doping policy, particularly one that is in line with WADA standards, the IOC is not going to give disc golf the time of day. And that's just the tip of the iceberg in terms of getting disc golf into the Olympics. Our equipment and our scoring is the least of their concerns.

Since this isn't really the thread for this discussion, I'll just stop there.

The PDGA needs to rejoin the WFDF. They need to fix the policies that got them kicked out and work with the other disc sports, particularly ultimate, in introducing disc sports to foreign countries in order to get considered for inclusion in the Olympics.

 

[mashnut]

Olympics already said NO cause putting is too easy in DG (I am sure if you scour this forum you will find the discussion about that...its like from 2+ yrs ago fyi). Hence the need for equipment standards change (mentioned earlier). Targets as they are now are designed for Super-class discs, they need to be redesigned for current popular molds.
This fixes more than just making putting more challenging, it also makes the way the pDGA factors Par more legit. There is NO reason that after a 3 round tournament a Pro should have a negative 30 something score, if that happened in Ball golf it would be all that is talked about for a week. i have shown numerous people, who don't play, tournament scores and they scoff at the overall score and think the sport is more of a joke then what they did beforehand.
You guys are going to have to face a simple fact, as it is this sport does not have TV appeal. And although the pDGA has been told what to do to change that, they have made no moves to make it happen. Instead they go after getting on a fringe network that 90% or more of America will never see (i think i am being VERY friendly with the 90%).

Maybe the PDGA isn't convinced that making a bunch of changes for "TV appeal" isn't worth it if we haven't proved that people will ever actually watch the sport. There's no evidence that players will choose to watch over going out and playing for free at their local course, and there's certainly no evidence that people outside the sport are at all interested in watching.

 

[turbosteve]

Maybe the PDGA isn't convinced that making a bunch of changes for "TV appeal" isn't worth it if we haven't proved that people will ever actually watch the sport. There's no evidence that players will choose to watch over going out and playing for free at their local course, and there's certainly no evidence that people outside the sport are at all interested in watching.

Personally I feel that disc golf will never be on tv much in the US but it might be broadcast in other countries on tv on a regular basis. The upcoming European Open live broadcast in Finland is going to be crucial in determining if disc golf has a future as a spectator sport overseas.

 

[texhop58]

I believe they should. I recently td my first two events. I did both of mine to raise money for a course. And it was an incredible amount of work. And I had two great helpers who did most of it. But still is mentally taxing. Worrying about overspending/buying, turnouts, complaints. Why would anyone do this for free. I will continue to run events like birdie bashes and ace races but full PDGA events would just give me an incredible ulcer. I've been lucky and out of 122 players in my two events only had about 3 complaints. But it's still a lot to have to worry about.

 

[Smigles]

Those arguing against it are just greedy bleeps

yeah rigth, those agains it are the greedy ones, not those that want the money... :wall:

I dont think it is a good idea. I want a TD to do it for the love of the sport, for the fun, for his passion, and not for the money they get.

 

[DavidSauls]

I wonder if there'll be a day where people expect players to play for the love of the sport, for the fun, for his passion, and not for the money they get?

 

[CaptainAnhyzer]

I get paid as a TD.................. with smiles and appreciation for running a great tournament.
That's all I've ever asked for. Happy players that talk positive about my events and want to come back again next year.

Oh and the occational adult beverage gifts too. :thmbup:

 

[AdamE]

I believe they should. I recently td my first two events. I did both of mine to raise money for a course. And it was an incredible amount of work. And I had two great helpers who did most of it. But still is mentally taxing. Worrying about overspending/buying, turnouts, complaints. Why would anyone do this for free. I will continue to run events like birdie bashes and ace races but full PDGA events would just give me an incredible ulcer. I've been lucky and out of 122 players in my two events only had about 3 complaints. But it's still a lot to have to worry about.

You nailed there. Tournaments are a lot of work but they're even more mentally taxing. I spend so much time thinking about things it really does wear me out just because it's so much to keep track of and juggle all at the same time.

 

[Aim For The Chains]

They get tips :|

 

[texhop58]

You nailed there. Tournaments are a lot of work but they're even more mentally taxing. I spend so much time thinking about things it really does wear me out just because it's so much to keep track of and juggle all at the same time.

I had a small issue where a guy was able to register or the birdie bash after we capped. Only reason I knew about it, was because his brother got an email and he didn't. He then contacted me and sent his receipt. I didn't sleep te night before, because I was so worried about having more people show up that day saying the same happened to them. Come to find out he and one other guy both registered at the same time. The difference is he had to make a Paypal name and the other guy snuck in before him. Yet it still let him sign up even though we maxed out. But yea. Didn't sleep more then 2 hours because of nerves. Also didn't get the disc until the day before which was stressful in itself.

 

[mashnut]

yeah rigth, those agains it are the greedy ones, not those that want the money... :wall:

I dont think it is a good idea. I want a TD to do it for the love of the sport, for the fun, for his passion, and not for the money they get.

Why? What's wrong with somebody making some money for spending tons of their own time putting on an event for you? Their time and effort is worth absolutely nothing to you?

And yes, the people who expect that kind of selflessness from a TD while collecting plastic for being in the top half of an am division are the greedy ones.

 

[Script]

I'd like to pitch in...

With the amount of work that I put into the 21 Hole Salute, if I were to take a payment, the tournament would be broke. I want my annual tournament to be the best out there. I want it to rival every A-tier and NT out there and if I took some money to pay myself, the tournament would be broke based on the amount of time that has gone into it.

I run it because as a player I was craving a well run, unique, fun tournament that was a blast to be a part of. I didn't sign up to run it to make money. It's actually the opposite. I want to make money for the players, volunteers and spectators to enjoy themselves. Maybe it'll wear me out 10 years down the road, but it would wear me out regardless of me taking out some money.

 

[JC17393]

I can say in all honesty that if running events wasn't part of my day job and I didn't, in a round-about way, get paid for running said events, I'd have stopped doing it a while ago. The people who run events while working full time and entirely non-disc-golf-related jobs and have families are, and I mean this with all kinds of love, a bit nuts. I don't know how you do it, or more accurately, I don't know how you keep doing it year after year.

Don't get me wrong, I enjoy a lot of what is involved with running tournaments. I love hosting players and seeing them enjoying themselves. But sometimes I think about all the things I do in preparing for a tournament that I have the luxury of doing while I'm at work (and my boss encourages me to do so), and realize that a lot of TDs do that work in their free time...before/after work, late night, weekends, etc. I can get fed up with some of the BS that comes with running tournaments as it is. If I were dedicating more of my free time, time I could be spending with family, friends, or any number of other things, to running events and catching the same level of BS...like I said, I'd have stopped doing it a long time ago. I love the game, but I'm no masochist.

So in short, yes, TDs absolutely deserve to be compensated in some way. It's great and noble that we have so many selfless TDs who want no compensation for their efforts. It is terrible that there is a common notion that it should be expected that TDs selflessly sacrifice for events to the point that any minute level of compensation is viewed as an underhanded or devious thing. The point of the whole thing is to reward the good TDs so they'll keep running events. I've lost count of the number of good TDs and events that have fallen by the wayside in my time in the game because of burnout and/or a lack of appreciation for the efforts.

 

[_MTL_]

Simply put, if you think tournaments are sketchy with money and have bad events now, just wait until tournament directors can take funds from their event and give to themselves!

This is a HORRIBLE idea and I will NEVER support it.

Paying people for a volunteer job brings out the money heathens that have no business running an event.

 

[Dave242]

This is a HORRIBLE idea and I will NEVER support it.

You sound a lot here like you did a few years ago about swearing up and down that moving from Pro back down to Am is something you would never do (and that people who had a reason to want to do that were idiots).

 

[dusty5150]

I have mixed thoughts on this. I don't like the idea of a TD just taking an amount out of their event that they alone run. What I do like is the idea where a group (club/church/retailer/business) 'hires' an experienced TD to plan/execute an event for them. Kind of like how course designers get hired.

 

[smyith]

Simply put, if you think tournaments are sketchy with money and have bad events now, just wait until tournament directors can take funds from their event and give to themselves!

obviously if something like this was implemented there would have to be a pay structure worked out. its not like they would just say do whatever you want. you could basically do it just like how the pDGA fees are done, a couple bucks per competitor.

Paying people for a volunteer job brings out the money heathens that have no business running an event.

why do you assume this? we aren't talking about big money here, we are essentially talking about compensation. and what if those money heathens are actually able to put together fantastic tournaments? there are probably alot of people out there who want to run a tournament but instead don't give up their free time because of the headache. you don't have to be negative about everything.

 

[grodney]

This is a HORRIBLE idea and I will NEVER support it.

Paying people for a volunteer job brings out the money heathens that have no business running an event.

This is really short-sighted of you, Robert.

The tournament scene, and the game as a whole, would be SO much better off if tournaments were run by commercial enterprises.

 

[pablo.diablo]

They do get paid, in a sense, if they are their own payout vendor and have custom discs ran for their events out of pocket. They buy the discs at whatever $8-12 per and do the payouts at retail levels $16-18.

Then whatever additional merch they sell at the event supplements the payout "income". Like any Dynamic Discs tourney...they are not always making a killing, but they ain't doing it for free.