150 bag for an old fart

[Monocacy]

When new, Champ EL's are deceptively beefy, about as stable as Teebirds but when they are broken in really good they're like faster Leopards.

Thank for the scoop on ELs. Do they go directly from Teebird-like to Leopard-like, or do they spend a decent amount of time in the sweet spot between the two? When an EL starts beating in, does it first lose HSS, LSS, or both?

If you're looking for something for controlled turnovers out of the box I'd look elsewhere like a Leopard, XL, or light River.

Leopards are my go-to driver in the woods, but I do not trust a Leopard to come back once turned past a certain amount. I am looking for something that can be turned (from anhyzer or hyzer, either is fine), but with enough LSS to fade back reliably. 150 XL would be perfect if available in ESP or Z, but I worry that a Pro-D XL would lose its LSS and turn into a Leopard too quickly.

I hope that Lat64 makes a 150 River some day. Can you imagine the glide?

 

[BrotherDave]

Thank for the scoop on ELs. Do they go directly from Teebird-like to Leopard-like, or do they spend a decent amount of time in the sweet spot between the two? When an EL starts beating in, does it first lose HSS, LSS, or both?



Leopards are my go-to driver in the woods, but I do not trust a Leopard to come back once turned past a certain amount. I am looking for something that can be turned (from anhyzer or hyzer, either is fine), but with enough LSS to fade back reliably. 150 XL would be perfect if available in ESP or Z, but I worry that a Pro-D XL would lose its LSS and turn into a Leopard too quickly.

I hope that Lat64 makes a 150 River some day. Can you imagine the glide?

Oh I got you, in that case a Champ EL might be worth checking out. I've got two currently, a 170s EL that's taken forever to beat in to where a hard throw will stay turned over and a mid 160s that I just got that feels like that already. I imagine a 150 EL would be fairly similar to a beat Leopard right out of the box. At 150, the only disc I know of that I would trust to fade back after a lot of use would be an Eagle-X though. But I haven't noticed either of my ELs losing a significant amount of HSS, they just lose LSS and push forward more when fading as they work in.

 

[surgeflx87]

I have a couple gummy japan open champ rocs from 2006 that are in the 150s and they still have a suprising amount of stability for being so lite. They also glide for days. I would check them.out if you like rocs and dont mind paying a little more for them.

 

[captain jack]

Q:

I am looking for something that can be turned (from anhyzer or hyzer, either is fine), but with enough LSS to fade back reliably.

A:

At 150, the only disc I know of that I would trust to fade back after a lot of use would be an Eagle-X though.

:hfive:

Oh, and why does your age have anything to do with what weight discs you carry ?

 

[Monocacy]

Oh I got you, in that case a Champ EL might be worth checking out.

Thanks, BroD! I have some DX and Champ ELs on the way.

 

[Monocacy]

I have a couple gummy japan open champ rocs from 2006 that are in the 150s and they still have a suprising amount of stability for being so lite. They also glide for days. I would check them.out if you like rocs and dont mind paying a little more for them.

Good idea – 150s DX Rocs work fine for backhand, but my crappy forehand could benefit from a mid with a little extra stability.

 

[Monocacy]

Oh, and why does your age have anything to do with what weight discs you carry ?

Good question. Some very good local players around my age throw 150s, but most throw heavier discs. I switched to 150s because they put much less strain on my creaky joints. When I threw 160s, an aching shoulder would often wake me up at night. That got "old" very quickly.

Still, I had a lot of fun abusing various joints through water polo, swimming, hoops, volleyball, etc. If I had a do-over, I would probably choose to injure myself all over again.

 

[sloppydisc]

I have searched and have not found any 150 Rivers. Makes me very sad. 150's River would be very cool. I have a 162 and a 160 though that are not too bad.

 

[Monocacy]

Spring update: I settled on DX Teebirds as my stable fairway driver, and after experimenting with lighter midranges and putters decided to stick with mid-160s. Backhand is still stuck around 300' and forehand distance is about 10% shorter. I throw pretty much everything in the bag BH and FH, but I try to limit the number of FH drives to save wear and tear on my shoulder.

Eight molds, 11 or 12 discs unless I get a bigger bag (and a Gorilla Boy Silverback is very tempting . . .). Comments and suggestions welcomed as always.

STABLE CONTROL DRIVER:
150 DX Teebird x 2: One fresh, working on one seasoned. Comfortable and reliable.

MODERATELY OVERSTABLE DRIVER:
150 Champ Teebird: Headwinds and strong fades. I rarely throw this unless the wind is howling, so I may test a 150 S CD in this slot. If I can get a little more juice on my throws, I might also try the 150 S PD again.

UNDERSTABLE DRIVER:
150 Champ Leopard: Essential in the woods, and first choice for uphill and downhill drives, hyzer flips, and glidey hyzers.
150 Star Leopard: Testing

DISTANCE DRIVER:
150 Star Valkyrie: BH and FH distance
150 Champ Valkyrie: Testing. Ideally I would like to carry one fresh Valk and one that is easier to turn.

VERY OVERSTABLE DRIVER:
150 Champ Banshee: Overstable stuff, trick shots, headwinds. Also handy when I am having trouble flicking mids and putters.

MIDRANGES:
165-168 DX Roc: Playing around with different weights, but heavier seems to fly farther and handle my forehand OAT more gracefully.
162 DX Roc: Trying to beat up a lighter Roc for turnovers and throwing uphill
165 Z Comet: The other essential woods disc
164 X Comet: A little less LSS than the Z Comet, for zero-fade finishes and turnovers

PUTTERS:
166 S Wizard: Stable approaches and short drives
165 SS Magic: Putting putter and straight approaches

 

[gkeberhart]

how overstable were those 150 PDs you had, and were they anything like a firebird. I know they are traditionally a meathook in heavier weights

 

[Monocacy]

how overstable were those 150 PDs you had, and were they anything like a firebird. I know they are traditionally a meathook in heavier weights

150 S PDs are very straight, like a faster Teebird. I dropped them because I could not get them up to speed consistently, and because Teebirds stand up to strong headwinds better.

You may be thinking of the C PD. I have not thrown one, but C PDs are a popular choice for the Firebird slot in a bag. To complete the PD spectrum, the 150 P PDs breaks in fairly quickly to fly like a 150 Star Valkyrie, but with a little less predictability.

 

[gkeberhart]

good to know, thanks for the information

 

[BrotherDave]

Do they make 150 Pro Valks? B/c that would be your easier to turn Valk right there. It looks great though.

 

[Animage]

Innova says 160-175 on Pro's. Sorry Dave

 

[Monocacy]

Do they make 150 Pro Valks? B/c that would be your easier to turn Valk right there. It looks great though.

Thanks, Dave. 150 Pro Valks would be sweet, but few 150 discs are available in Pro. I'm not sure why.

The new bag worked well on two breezy rounds at Rockburn, a challenging course that requires a wide variety of lines. I did have trouble with two types of shots. Throwing FH into headwinds continues to give me trouble, especially if I needed to finish hard right. I tried flicking the 150 Champ Banshee, counting on its usual strong fade, but the wind pounced on my forehand OAT and kept the disc straight. I need to clean up my forehand, use more hyzer, or try another disc. Hmm, maybe my "heavy" (168) DX Roc will work

The other shot that I had trouble with was a low, straight BH distance drive with a strong fade. The DX Teebird is getting too straight, the Champ Teebird and Banshee are a bit short, and the Star Valk needs more height to fade very far. If I can't learn to do this shot with the Valk, I might add the 150 S PD for certain courses, or try a 150 S CD.

Otherwise, I was happy with the bag. I'm tweaking my putting form (again), so I may switch back to the grippy 168 SS Magics.

 

[Monocacy]

No tournaments until July, so I am testing some new discs. Forehand drives have been killing my shoulder so I need a fairway driver that I can control on a variety of turnover / anhyzer lines. Can't have a bag without Teebirds, so they will shift to the moderately overstable slot.

Seven molds, 10-12 discs. Suggestions welcomed as always.

STABLE CONTROL DRIVER:
M Polaris LS 150 or Diamond Light 154-7: I fondly hope that one of these will be the easy-throwing yet versatile fairway driver of my dreams.

UNDERSTABLE DRIVER:
Undetermined. Could be a seasoned M PLS or Diamond, or perhaps the Champ Valk. The 150 Champ Leopard held this slot for a long time, but I prefer a turnover driver with a little more LSS to cover up for my mistakes.

DISTANCE:
Valkyrie Star 153: Fairly stable at my distance
Valkyrie Champ 150: Easier to turn compared with the Star Valk

MODERATELY OVERSTABLE:
Teebird DX 150 (fresh): Stable workhorse.
Teebird DX 150 (beat): I need to stop losing these as soon as they are nicely seasoned.
Teebird Champ 150: Headwind driver

VERY OVERSTABLE:
Banshee Champ 153: Overstable stuff, and get-out-of-trouble shots. I have started working on a FH roller with occasional success.

MIDRANGES:
Pain Opto 165: Can the Pain kick Rocs out of the bag?
Comet Z 161-3 or ESP 167-70: I have been throwing these in the woods instead of Leopards. The ESP Comets are fairly new and pretty stable, but I look forward to seeing how they fly after breaking in a bit.

PUTTERS:
Ion S 168-9 x 2: One for putting, one for approaches. I prefer to carry one putter mold, so we will see if the Ion can kick the Wizard and Magic out of the bag.

 

[BrotherDave]

UNDERSTABLE DRIVER:
Undetermined. Could be a seasoned M PLS or Diamond, or perhaps the Champ Valk. The 150 Champ Leopard held this slot for a long time, but I prefer a turnover driver with a little more LSS to cover up for my mistakes.

Try an EL. They're like a less touchy, longer Leopard when beaten in.

And let me know what you think of your light Pain, I've been thinking about getting one to complement my heavier one. :thmbup:

 

[sloppydisc]

I usually throw a 166 Opto Pain and love that thing. It is great.

How about trying the new Lat Diamond for under stable duties? I don't have one yet, but they sound interesting for a light under stable driver.

 

[Monocacy]

Try an EL. They're like a less touchy, longer Leopard when beaten in.

BroD - I appreciate your perspective as always, so I grabbed my Eagle-Ls (DX and Champ) and went out for field practice. Perhaps I don't have the arm for them, or perhaps my chronic hyzer-itis doesn't suit the disc, but I could not get the darn things to turn unless I threw a flex shot. I want to like Eagle-Ls, but we just don't seem to mesh. If I'm going to throw a disc that doesn't turn, I might as well throw a good old DX Teebird. I have been throwing them forever, and they go much farther for me.

And let me know what you think of your light Pain, I've been thinking about getting one to complement my heavier one. :thmbup:

Pains should arrive on Monday, so I will post when I have had a chance to give them a workout.

Oh, and thank you for continually plugging the Ion. MVP finally made a batch of light ones, so I ordered a few. After one day of throwing Ions around the yard I can tell that they are something special.

I usually throw a 166 Opto Pain and love that thing. It is great.

Glad you like it - I can't wait to give it a try.

How about trying the new Lat Diamond for under stable duties? I don't have one yet, but they sound interesting for a light under stable driver.

Yes, the Diamond or PLS may serve stable-ish and understable roles, especially when one starts breaking in. With a variety of Teebirds in the bag, I am mainly looking for a complementary fairway driver that I can use for turnovers and S-curves.

 

[BrotherDave]

BroD - I appreciate your perspective as always, so I grabbed my Eagle-Ls (DX and Champ) and went out for field practice. Perhaps I don't have the arm for them, or perhaps my chronic hyzer-itis doesn't suit the disc, but I could not get the darn things to turn unless I threw a flex shot. I want to like Eagle-Ls, but we just don't seem to mesh. If I'm going to throw a disc that doesn't turn, I might as well throw a good old DX Teebird. I have been throwing them forever, and they go much farther for me.

It's not just you, Champ ELs especially have to be very seasoned before they become Leo like. The domey ones are less stable. If you've got the heart, try thrashing one with some thumbers before you completely give up on it.