2024 dynamic discs open

[Wayne Mags]

The similarity I am claiming is that if you want to voice that another player "cheated" or committed a penalty, you should say so then, not after a period of time.

Well, if memory serves me correct the other two guys said they were not sure but agreed that if he thought I incorrectly reported a score he should have said so then.

 

[Naenae]

I agree. Disappointing work on their part imo. Erika and Madison did the same thing on the post production- Erika called it "mean." How is anyone supposed to take this "sport" seriously?

I hope you've watched enough of their coverage to get their sarcasm and entertainment-focused commentary. I think what Erica was conveying at the time (over the entire back nine) was the excitement of seeing a newcomer challenging for the podium, and the tragedy that it came down to a matter of millimeters. They are pretty consistent in articulating some sort of dismay when a great shot fails by a thin margin, but they aren't anarchists at all when it comes to the rules.

 

[ru4por]

I am with Biscoe here. It has to be called. If King thought it was a foot fault, she should call it. Butthurt, offended, angry are not acceptable responses to rule calls. They are attempts to ensure fair play and honest competition. Embrace the rules and enforcement of them.

 

[biscoe]

I hope you've watched enough of their coverage to get their sarcasm and entertainment-focused commentary. I think what Erica was conveying at the time (over the entire back nine) was the excitement of seeing a newcomer challenging for the podium, and the tragedy that it came down to a matter of millimeters. They are pretty consistent in articulating some sort of dismay when a great shot fails by a thin margin, but they aren't anarchists at all when it comes to the rules.

I have watched plenty of their commentary and know Madison fairly well. IMO the comment in question was a clear statement that the rules often do not get followed and that the group was stepping outside the "usual" in doing so. There are a million different ways to articulate that it was unfortunate for Weatherman that the disc was OB- saying the call was "mean" is not one of those imo. YMMV.

 

[ru4por]

The similarity I am claiming is that if you want to voice that another player "cheated" or committed a penalty, you should say so then, not after a period of time.

Well, if memory serves me correct the other two guys said they were not sure but agreed that if he thought I incorrectly reported a score he should have said so then.

Rules and violations are NOT accusations of "cheating", nor penal in nature. This is the VERY problem with most golfers. Rules and calls are a cooperative effort to ensure all players have the benefit of honest competition. It should be the goal of ALL of us.

 

[geebob]

I have watched plenty of their commentary and know Madison fairly well. IMO the comment in question was a clear statement that the rules often do not get followed and that the group was stepping outside the "usual" in doing so. There are a million different ways to articulate that it was unfortunate for Weatherman that the disc was OB- saying the call was "mean" is not one of those imo. YMMV.

I think this is one of the few times that I've disagreed with you, although I do understand your point. Personally, I want my commentators to be willing to call out questionable decisions, point out inconsistencies, and offer honest opinions. From my view of the disc and the line (not sure if the Jomez footage differed from the DGN, I only watched the former), "mean" seemed like an honest description of the call.

That said, I do think the sport needs to improve on all things related to play of the game, from greater clarity and consistency in the rules, to more training and support for officials, and greater buy-in by players for their role in assuring fair competition.

 

[biscoe]

I think this is one of the few times that I've disagreed with you, although I do understand your point. Personally, I want my commentators to be willing to call out questionable decisions, point out inconsistencies, and offer honest opinions. From my view of the disc and the line (not sure if the Jomez footage differed from the DGN, I only watched the former), "mean" seemed like an honest description of the call.

That said, I do think the sport needs to improve on all things related to play of the game, from greater clarity and consistency in the rules, to more training and support for officials, and greater buy-in by players for their role in assuring fair competition.

It took Terry Miller (who was at the disc prior to the group even getting there) about 2 seconds to say that there was "no part of the disc touching inbounds". It is roughly 4:05 into the DGN coverage. IMO the camera angle (which would be the same for both Jomez and DGN) was poor.

 

[geebob]

It took Terry Miller (who was at the disc prior to the group even getting there) about 2 seconds to say that there was "no part of the disc touching inbounds". It is roughly 4:05 into the DGN coverage. IMO the camera angle (which would be the same for both Jomez and DGN) was poor.

I'm not sure how Terry could be sure of that without picking up the disc and looking at the line. It did not appear that any white appeared between the disc and in-bounds, so in my thinking it should have been in-bounds:

806.02 B A disc is out-of-bounds if its position is clearly and completely surrounded by an out-of-bounds area.

 

[biscoe]

...because the angle was better looking at it from above is my guess. The camera angle shows nothing either way due to the tuft of taller grass blocking the view. Paint on grass is a really dumb/lazy/whatever way to mark this stuff as well. String is way cheaper, doesn't run off into waterways, is still fast to install, and provides a much cleaner actual line. It does need to be removed after the fact I suppose.

 

[Wayne Mags]

Rules and violations are NOT accusations of "cheating", nor penal in nature. This is the VERY problem with most golfers. Rules and calls are a cooperative effort to ensure all players have the benefit of honest competition. It should be the goal of ALL of us.

What's your point? That HK was within her rights to call a penalty in the way she did? She was upset that she was probably going to lose, then frustration fueled her accusation that there was a foot fault.

The problem is that they have to police themselves. I know that there is no easy solution for that though.

 

[ru4por]

What's your point? That HK was within her rights to call a penalty in the way she did? She was upset that she was probably going to lose, then frustration fueled her accusation that there was a foot fault.

The problem is that they have to police themselves. I know that there is no easy solution for that though.

There is little to no hope of you understanding any intelligent point. The post was directed at other disc golfers.

 

[Wayne Mags]

Intelligent point? (eyeroll) Your post was a reply to my post. What else would I think other than it was directed at me.

 

[BrotherDave]

I'm not sure how Terry could be sure of that without picking up the disc and looking at the line. It did not appear that any white appeared between the disc and in-bounds, so in my thinking it should have been in-bounds:

806.02 B A disc is out-of-bounds if its position is clearly and completely surrounded by an out-of-bounds area.

View attachment 339502

View attachment 339503

You know, if you have to gather around and get down on your hands and knees to see if it's OB than can you really say that it's "clearly" OB? When something is clearly anything you usually don't have to scrutinize it.

 

[glassila]

It looks like there is white paint to the right of the disc edge and unpainted grass to the left of the disc edge.
Probably beating a dead horse at this point, but I'm not sure how she wasn't given the benefit of the doubt.

 

[elmexdela]

this thread reeks of old spice and listerine

 

[krupicka]

It looks like there is white paint to the right of the disc edge and unpainted grass to the left of the disc edge.
Probably beating a dead horse at this point, but I'm not sure how she wasn't given the benefit of the doubt.

QA-APP-4: My group thinks my disc is OB, but I think it's unclear. Doesn't benefit of the doubt go to the player? I'm safe, right?

Benefit of the doubt only comes into play as a tiebreaker when the group cannot make a decision, for example if two players see the disc as safe and two see it as OB. If a majority of your group thinks it's OB, then it's OB.

 

[BogeyNoMore]

Bottom line: very seldom is doubt beneficial.

 

[geebob]

Bottom line: very seldom is doubt beneficial.

Although the wording of 806.02 B ("A disc is out-of-bounds if its position is clearly and completely surrounded by an out-of-bounds area") also indicates that a disc must be "clearly" OB and not just likely OB. So in this case, if there is doubt about a disc being OB, it should be ruled in-bounds.

 

[biscoe]

this thread reeks of old spice and listerine

So does your Mom...




(jk)

 

[glassila]

QA-APP-4: My group thinks my disc is OB, but I think it's unclear. Doesn't benefit of the doubt go to the player? I'm safe, right?

Benefit of the doubt only comes into play as a tiebreaker when the group cannot make a decision, for example if two players see the disc as safe and two see it as OB. If a majority of your group thinks it's OB, then it's OB.

What I meant was, I don't know how 3 players were sure that Weatherman's disc was clearly out of bounds.
If even 1 of the players weren't sure then she should have given Weatherman the benefit of the doubt and called it in bounds.