Paige Pierce #29190

[dehaas]

As far as the course closures, for all we know it might have been attempted but was not allowed. We're talking public parks here, and without an actual event occurring that day they might have been told no. Or perhaps more likely, the only way to have the courses closed for practice days was to pay and rent the space, like what they would've done for the actual tournament dates.

3 different parks paying 2-3 extra days of practice round rental to be able to close the courses could potentially add a lot of extra cost to the event. Debating on the use of 3 different courses is a completely other discussion.

Logistics like that which can vary among local municipalities is one of the huge driving forces behind moving premier events to private courses. Way easier to provide a consistent tournament experience for your players when you can control way more variables.

 

[Hampstead]

I back Paige 100% on her complaints. They are all 100% valid. The rest of you should quit trying to justify the terrible decisions that were made in planning these events. Bless the TD's hearts, they work hard, but they obviously just don't get it. We need pro-level events for the touring pros and TD's that understand the difference between a major and a B class event. Just reading this board I see all these guys integral to the sport that just don't seem to get it. Biggest problem in the sport in my opinion.

You volunteering to run an event?

 

[_MTL_]

I back Paige 100% on her complaints. They are all 100% valid. The rest of you should quit trying to justify the terrible decisions that were made in planning these events. Bless the TD's hearts, they work hard, but they obviously just don't get it. We need pro-level events for the touring pros and TD's that understand the difference between a major and a B class event. Just reading this board I see all these guys integral to the sport that just don't seem to get it. Biggest problem in the sport in my opinion.

So the event was announced three years ago (remember, it was supposed to be in 2020), none of the courses were temporary, she choose to spend months in Hawaii and chose to play an event the weekend before but you support 100% that she didn't have time to practice?

I'm just flabbergasted.

If you think that an event that had people sweeping EVERY tee after players played a hole and an event that had a $43,921 payout for less than 100 pro competitors is B tier quality, you either have never been to a B tier, have unrealistic expectations, are a troll, are a super fan boy of Paige or simply incapable of understanding basic logic. Probably all of the above.

And if you are including me in the "people integral to the sport" (maybe you are, maybe you aren't), I want to remind you at some point I was not. I was just a kid who enjoyed playing disc golf. I worked very hard and for years to get to the point where people see me as that. I don't want to say it was easy, but it's possible for you to be come integral to the sport. Just takes some effort and desire.

 

[ballgolfconvert]

You volunteering to run an event?

If someone asked me to run a major in my area, I would consider it, but would probably decline, as I have a ton on my plate.

 

[BuiltTooLong]

You volunteering to run an event?

If someone asked me to run a major in my area, I would consider it, but would probably decline, as I have a ton on my plate.

It was a rhetorical question. We ALL know that you WON'T.

Yea... you must have a ton on your plate since you can only spend a few hours a day trolling online.

 

[ballgolfconvert]

So the event was announced three years ago (remember, it was supposed to be in 2020), none of the courses were temporary, she choose to spend months in Hawaii and chose to play an event the weekend before but you support 100% that she didn't have time to practice?

I'm just flabbergasted.

If you think that an event that had people sweeping EVERY tee after players played a hole and an event that had a $43,921 payout for less than 100 pro competitors is B tier quality, you either have never been to a B tier, have unrealistic expectations, are a troll, are a super fan boy of Paige or simply incapable of understanding basic logic. Probably all of the above.

And if you are including me in the "people integral to the sport" (maybe you are, maybe you aren't), I want to remind you at some point I was not. I was just a kid who enjoyed playing disc golf. I worked very hard and for years to get to the point where people see me as that. I don't want to say it was easy, but it's possible for you to be come integral to the sport. Just takes some effort and desire.

A major playing 3 different courses is the B Tier part of it. I find that fact alone indefensible. So instead of the TD providing a reasonable practicing scenario, you want to blame it on her taking a vacation. In other words, skip your vacation so you can overcome the poor judgement of having a major played on 3 courses. Why can't folks admit that the planning of this tourney just wasn't on par? It's almost like disc golf guys don't want to learn from their mistakes because then they would have to admit making a mistake.

 

[_MTL_]

A major playing 3 different courses is the B Tier part of it. I find that fact alone indefensible. So instead of the TD providing a reasonable practicing scenario, you want to blame it on her taking a vacation. In other words, skip your vacation so you can overcome the poor judgement of having a major played on 3 courses. Why can't folks admit that the planning of this tourney just wasn't on par? It's almost like disc golf guys don't want to learn from their mistakes because then they would have to admit making a mistake.

I literally, in this thread, said that 3 rounds and 3 courses for a major is unacceptable. I'm not sure what you don't get.

 

[Dcinmd]

A major playing 3 different courses is the B Tier part of it. I find that fact alone indefensible. So instead of the TD providing a reasonable practicing scenario, you want to blame it on her taking a vacation. In other words, skip your vacation so you can overcome the poor judgement of having a major played on 3 courses. Why can't folks admit that the planning of this tourney just wasn't on par? It's almost like disc golf guys don't want to learn from their mistakes because then they would have to admit making a mistake.

I guess that one event I played 6 course in 4 days was a B-tier?

SO clueless.

 

[ru4por]

You volunteering to run an event?

LOL.....a rhetorical question?

The only volunteering this troll is capable of is the job of spewing contrary gibberish for the sole purpose of attention. He discusses no issues, replies with no intelligent disc golf knowledge nor proposes solutions to any problems. Spends hours daily, combing through these threads, in hope of finding a handful of posters with an intelligent opinion. If several of those agree, he simply posts up a opposing post, with little to no substance....BAM, new friends.

Of course, PP is not keen on the current rules....so, they are both anarchists. :doh:

 

[ballgolfconvert]

It was a rhetorical question. We ALL know that you WON'T.

Yea... you must have a ton on your plate since you can only spend a few hours a day trolling online.

I actually would. Hit me up in a month or two. Which major do you want me to run?

You are actually the one trolling, answering my reply to another poster, assuming what he meant in his post was just more trolling.

 

[ballgolfconvert]

It was a rhetorical question. We ALL know that you WON'T.

Yea... you must have a ton on your plate since you can only spend a few hours a day trolling online.

LOL.....a rhetorical question?

The only volunteering this troll is capable of is the job of spewing contrary gibberish for the sole purpose of attention. He discusses no issues, replies with no intelligent disc golf knowledge nor proposes solutions to any problems. Spends hours daily, combing through these threads, in hope of finding a handful of posters with an intelligent opinion. If several of those agree, he simply posts up a opposing post, with little to no substance....BAM, new friends.

Of course, PP is not keen on the current rules....so, they are both anarchists. :doh:

Friends/ LoL. I have zero friends on this website because i will say what needs to be said and none of you want to hear it because you are all stuck in a past era. .

 

[Cgkdisc]

Friends/ LoL. I have zero friends on this website because i will say what needs to be said and none of you want to hear it because you are all stuck in a past era. .

Disc golf hasn't gotten to and may never get to your era for several reasons. If you listen to those who understand the different parameters between DG and BG, maybe your future contributions would make more sense.

 

[ballgolfconvert]

I literally, in this thread, said that 3 rounds and 3 courses for a major is unacceptable. I'm not sure what you don't get.

Good to hear. Where does the blame fall for that poor decision? All i see is support for it. while pointing out players could have sacrificed their own personal time to make up for the faults in the planning of the tourney. You made the same point. It was a B tier decision and someone should admit it and make sure it doesn't happen again instead of attacking Paige for her comments. I guess that is just how disc golfers run. Screw accountability.

 

[ballgolfconvert]

Disc golf hasn't gotten to and may never get to your era for several reasons. If you listen to those who understand the different parameters between DG and BG, maybe your future contributions would make more sense.

It is not about differences in ball golf vs disc golf, but you guys want to make it that way.

It is all about calling out and getting rid of the aspects of the sport which aren't on par with the more mainstream sports.

 

[Three Putt]

I literally, in this thread, said that 3 rounds and 3 courses for a major is unacceptable. I'm not sure what you don't get.

Good to hear. Where does the blame fall for that poor decision? All i see is support for it. while pointing out players could have sacrificed their own personal time to make up for the faults in the planning of the tourney. You made the same point. It was a B tier decision and someone should admit it and make sure it doesn't happen again instead of attacking Paige for her comments. I guess that is just how disc golfers run. Screw accountability.

Here is the thing, though. These events get bid on in advance, and this is a bid for a 2020 date that was cancelled. So the group that got the idea together and pitched this bid did that several years ago.

Several years ago DGPT wasn't a thing. DGPT started in 2018 I believe. So when the idea was getting put together to bid on this event, the DGPT standard did not exist. We still had the seven-round World's up through 2015. Playing only one round a day for World's was controversial in 2016. There has been a lot of changes in a short period of time in how these events are structured.

So you take a bid where they got the memo on one round a day and had yet to get the memo on you can use two courses max that was put together when the "rules" were changing quickly, then push it back a year so it looks 12 months more out of touch with this DGPT standard they didn't know they had to try to meet when they decided to put together a bid.

It seems like something where you can move forward with an updated standard and cut the organizers from this year some slack for not meeting a standard they didn't know they had to meet; no head on a pike necessary.

 

[_MTL_]

Here is the thing, though. These events get bid on in advance, and this is a bid for a 2020 date that was cancelled. So the group that got the idea together and pitched this bid did that several years ago.

Several years ago DGPT wasn't a thing. DGPT started in 2018 I believe. So when the idea was getting put together to bid on this event, the DGPT standard did not exist. We still had the seven-round World's up through 2015. Playing only one round a day for World's was controversial in 2016. There has been a lot of changes in a short period of time in how these events are structured.

So you take a bid where they got the memo on one round a day and had yet to get the memo on you can use two courses max that was put together when the "rules" were changing quickly, then push it back a year so it looks 12 months more out of touch with this DGPT standard they didn't know they had to try to meet when they decided to put together a bid.

It seems like something where you can move forward with an updated standard and cut the organizers from this year some slack for not meeting a standard they didn't know they had to meet; no head on a pike necessary.

Case in point, the champions cup. One course. And that is how it's going to be moving forward as show in the bid package.

IMHO (and stressing opinion), the following are the next logical steps:

There is a big issue in disc golf with the Female master divisions. Essentially, there are two female master national champions (tim selinske and us womens). At some point, this can't continue.

So what's the solution? Do we follow the male model of USDGC, USADGC and Tim Selinske (which provides one opportunity for division to win a national title) and eliminate master divisions from women's nationals (where women's nationals would only be FPO and FA1) OR do eliminate womens' divisions from Selinske?

I don't think there is an easy answer. If you polled 100 women over 40, I think half would rather have an event with only older players (they can travel with husband, significant other, friends from local clubs, etc) and the other half would prefer an event with only women. Saying that, we have to answer this question.

Within that answer, you also probably land on a solution for the very real issues at US womens in the pro division.

Your point above about timing is so spot on it's crazy. This event was bid on 3 years ago and my goodness so much has changed since then. Even next year's event will be a 3 year out bid due to the pushbacks of 2020 majors.

 

[Cgkdisc]

It is not about differences in ball golf vs disc golf, but you guys want to make it that way.

It is all about calling out and getting rid of the aspects of the sport which aren't on par with the more mainstream sports.

That is the mistake you're making in your analysis and commentary. Success will come from using the resources and potential available in innovative ways observing the technical and societal vectors already in play, not trying to follow some path fashioned during different times. Trying to duplicate old successful models is going down a path that those sports have steadily been abandoning where they can with new approaches, competition formats and scoring tweaks.

Remember that those sports are doing things to retain or increase their already successful entertainment value. Disc golf as it's played still has insufficient sustainable viewer entertainment value (but with vast participation potential) and should be testing new formats to potentially increase viewership an order of magnitude.

 

[dmoore1998]

Good to hear. Where does the blame fall for that poor decision? All i see is support for it. while pointing out players could have sacrificed their own personal time to make up for the faults in the planning of the tourney. You made the same point. It was a B tier decision and someone should admit it and make sure it doesn't happen again instead of attacking Paige for her comments. I guess that is just how disc golfers run. Screw accountability.

What counts as "personal time" for a professional athlete...particularly in an individual sport? All of their practice, anytime, anywhere, could be said to be "sacrificing their own personal time".

I think some of the disdain is the language as if it would be impossible to practice or something. The real answer is probably "I cared more about doing X than practicing for and participating in Y". That's the difference between personal accountability and blaming others for your own decisions.

 

[ru4por]

oldmanballcon has CLEARLY demonstrated here, that he knows nothing about tournament disc golf. He has continually proven he has no interest in learning or understanding much about disc golf.


"faults in the planning of the tourney"

oldmanballcon.....why don't you help us all out and list out the things that are hallmarks of planning a good tourney. You can stop when you hit 300.

poseur---a guy standing on the sidelines of life, shouting at the wind, how others' should be doing thing differently to make his life better.

 

[ru4por]

In an attempt to pull this thread back away from trolling, I think that PP brings the pain of growth to light. I am not going to blame her for wanting her career and livelihood to go a smooth as possible. I do think many of the things she finds problematic, are because the sport is simply not in the position to provide some of them.