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PDGA Board of Director Elections

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It wasn't anything actionable, like death threats or calls for violence, so it's just low-key Facebook idiocy.

What happened was that I'd posted a call to action to my fans to be sure not to vote for those two, and I explained why. One of the candidates and his fans came and posted comments like "har har thanks for the publicity" (paraphrased, but it was not any more literate than that) and "I'm voting for (buddy) for sure!" and so on. Then they all liked and loved each others' comments.

Then I went through and clicked the links to each of their personal profiles so that I could harvest their usernames from the URL, plugged those names into the "ban user from page" function on Facebook, banned them all, and deleted all of their comments. These particular people won't be back, and there is no trace of their little raid on my page. It's like it never happened.

I don't engage trolls on my athlete page. I ban them. It's my page, not theirs.

How is it exceptable for a candidate to any position, to engage a voter, on any level except a positive one, to present their position? JFC, I abhor living in a society where such ignorance and hate are tolerated. What happened to the hippies?
 
How is it exceptable for a candidate to any position, to engage a voter, on any level except a positive one, to present their position? JFC, I abhor living in a society where such ignorance and hate are tolerated. What happened to the hippies?

They became Boomers.

(I know. "Not all Boomers." Calm down. I'm Gen X. Nobody cares what we do anyway, so don't start now. ;) )
 
I think it should be decided by each candidate blindly tossing a Destroyer as hard as they can into a field of 10 foot tall rough that has a combination of poison ivy, stinging nettle, cacti, and wild parsnip and whoever finds their disc first wins.
 
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Time for it to stop being mandated. Time for the PDGA to no longer force TD's to meet a payout model that might not work for the objectives of the tournament.

If TD's want to bribe players with player packs for the love of God go ahead but the PDGA shouldn't force it anymore. It's part of the US centric model I have never understood

I like a player pack to add value to a tournament that draws players because of the TD/Location or ideal. The second players started debating which tournament to go to so they can get a better return on their "investment" was the second they should have stopped being mandated.

Go to the tournament for the tournament, go to a yard sale to turn a quick buck.
Yeah, disc golf in general and the PDGA specifically has a "one size fits all" mentality. This came up here with the last bunch of changes they did. I can see how in a place where disc golf is booming, requiring people to be a PDGA member to play in a B Tier is a great call. If your B tiers are closing in 10 minutes after you open registration and spots are taken by non-members with members on the waiting list, that's a problem.

The fix they required for that applies to places that don't have the problem, though. In our case we have a local base of largely non-members. We held a B tier this year; it didn't come anywhere close to selling out and it was mostly attended by people from out of town. That requirement is a fix to something that wasn't broken here and is not helping us promote the sport here. There was a lot of ways they could have built in flexibility in the solution they had, but they didn't do that. It's black/white our-way-or-the-highway. That's locked into the PDGA culture; it goes back at least to Brian Hoeniger and the late 90's.

The PDGA needs to be more flexible with TD's and let the TD's decide what will work in the scenario they have.
 
The PDGA needs to be more flexible with TD's and let the TD's decide what will work in the scenario they have.

I get the feeling there's a lot of untapped creative ideas for running, rewarding, programming tournaments that could really get loose if the PDGA lightened up. Would be thrilling to see some awesome new strategies (and probably some boneheaded ones!) get some play and see what rises to the surface. Diversity and competition breeds development!
 
Yeah, disc golf in general and the PDGA specifically has a "one size fits all" mentality.

[...]

That's locked into the PDGA culture; it goes back at least to Brian Hoeniger and the late 90's.

The PDGA needs to be more flexible with TD's and let the TD's decide what will work in the scenario they have.

Somehow I'm not surprised that these institutional preferences are so firmly entrenched.

Think about it: the only people voting for leadership positions are PDGA members who have implicitly bought into the existing framework of competition. That's not an election structure that incentives new ideas.

How do you end that feedback loop of the same old, same old? Allow non-members to vote. This will naturally allow fresh perspectives to improve the organization.
 
Somehow I'm not surprised that these institutional preferences are so firmly entrenched.

Think about it: the only people voting for leadership positions are PDGA members who have implicitly bought into the existing framework of competition. That's not an election structure that incentives new ideas.

How do you end that feedback loop of the same old, same old? Allow non-members to vote. This will naturally allow fresh perspectives to improve the organization.
I don't have any idea how you would control that. How do you "register" so that the PDGA knows it's not a bot vote. It seems like it would be a huge hassle. If you were a dues paying member, how much time and how many resources would you want the org to dedicate to allowing people who have not payed dues to have the same voice in elections as you do?

If people care enough about the PDGA to want to have a voice in changing the PDGA, ya gotta join. Bottom line.
 
I don't have any idea how you would control that. How do you "register" so that the PDGA knows it's not a bot vote. It seems like it would be a huge hassle. If you were a dues paying member, how much time and how many resources would you want the org to dedicate to allowing people who have not payed dues to have the same voice in elections as you do?

If people care enough about the PDGA to want to have a voice in changing the PDGA, ya gotta join. Bottom line.

The bolded is botphobic. I'll be reporting this hate speech.
 
Maybe not, but if we also cut down the entry fee so it didn't have to cover all that merch, it might be just as attractive -- if not to all the same people, then perhaps to others.

I would gladly pay less to just get an entry to the tournament and not all the other crap. There are lots of one round C-Tiers around me at 35 and 40 dollars that literally turn around and give you $20 back in "merch credit" to spend at the local/club shop. Why can't I just pay 15 or 20 and play a rated round? I don't need another t-shirt or disc
 
It's appalling that this is even a subject.. Men can not become women.. that's a biological fact. They can however feel like they should have been born a women but that doesn't change their biological makeup. The PDGA should have never allowed them to compete in the FPO/FA divisions which have been protected for biological women and girls for years. Trans need to fight for their own divisions the same way women have or play in the MPO/MA divisions which is deemed mixed by the PDGA's own guidelines. But since this hasn't happened and the board wants to continue to pursue it's woke agenda, ( even with major womens sports outlets now banning trans from female competition), we must vote new people on the board to protest women sand our upcoming girls fair competition. Two of our men in dg are running and stand for this very position. Robbie Harris and Michael Munn. A vote for these men will put womens sports back on track for fair competition between biological women and girls.

The bolded part above is simply untrue. This is supported by legitimate medical sources, including the Mayo Clinic.

https://www.webmd.com/sex/news/20150422/transgender-homomes-surgery
https://www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-lifestyle/adult-health/in-depth/transgender-facts/art-20266812
 
Interesting.

Report of Fertility in a Woman with a Predominantly 46,XY Karyotype in a Family with Multiple Disorders of Sexual Development

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2190741/

Extracted from the paper:

Herein we report the extraordinary case of a fertile woman with normal ovaries and a predominantly 46,XY ovarian karyotype, who gave birth to a 46,XY female with complete gonadal dysgenesis.
 
Im just going say again that no one is becoming anything. Males who are trans women were always trans women. This is the difference between sex, secondary sexual characteristics and gender. Gender is the internal, biological, development that gives rise to your sense of self identity.

I'll ask you, if you suddenly woke up in a body that was different than the one you know, if you have always known you were a man and woke in a female body, how would you cope with that? Day after day, having your body defy your sense of self?

Language is being used ambiguously to refer to different concepts which is confusing. You at least need to acknowledge the different concepts in irder to have a coherent conversation.
 
I deliberately keep it as simple as I can for this audience. I have an entirely different vocabulary that I use when talking about gender and sex with other transgender people. It also doesn't help that every time the discussion starts to really get going around here, some new novice leaps into the conversation asking* toddler-tier questions and sucking all of the oxygen out of the room by demanding the answers to last night's homework.

(* Whether in good faith or not. . .)
 
I deliberately keep it as simple as I can for this audience. I have an entirely different vocabulary that I use when talking about gender and sex with other transgender people. It also doesn't help that every time the discussion starts to really get going around here, some new novice leaps into the conversation asking* toddler-tier questions and sucking all of the oxygen out of the room by demanding the answers to last night's homework.

(* Whether in good faith or not. . .)

I understand your exhaustion. You can never get away from it, like Groundhog Day, but you have to put up with the daily repeat of Bill Murray's character each day.

I'm privileged in that I am granted the comfort of my cis, het white guy self just by existing. So I try to understand, and I try to pick up some of the load. Because ultimately the acceptance will depend on those whose minds can be changed learning what they need to change them. Whatever that is.

And hopefully that means fewer exhausting encounters for you.
 
It's appalling that this is even a subject.. Men can not become women.. that's a biological fact. They can however feel like they should have been born a women but that doesn't change their biological makeup. The PDGA should have never allowed them to compete in the FPO/FA divisions which have been protected for biological women and girls for years. Trans need to fight for their own divisions the same way women have or play in the MPO/MA divisions which is deemed mixed by the PDGA's own guidelines. But since this hasn't happened and the board wants to continue to pursue it's woke agenda, ( even with major womens sports outlets now banning trans from female competition), we must vote new people on the board to protest women sand our upcoming girls fair competition. Two of our men in dg are running and stand for this very position. Robbie Harris and Michael Munn. A vote for these men will put womens sports back on track for fair competition between biological women and girls.



When you use the term "woke" in this context, most people immediately stop taking anything you say seriously.
 
The debate isn't if someone can be misgendered. That is not the debate we are having. You can discuss and side with the idea that women who are transgender have an unfair physical advantage against cis gendered women without misgendering women who are transgender. There are people arguing that in this thread who are not banned.

Of course you know this. You typed "BoD rules that trans women cannot compete in FPO", so you know HOW to make the argument without misgendering.

So...what's your point?
So you acknowledge that there is a debate about "transgendered" individuals having an unfair physical advantage against women? Where do you think this physical advantage comes from? The logical origin of this debate is obviously whether or not you can actually transition gender in the first place.

And to your second part, obviously I can make a third party reference to "trans women." But I can't have this debate with someone who identifies as "trans" directly without misgendering them or I completely capitulate my position. Due to moderation policy my options are effectively "Debate and eventually get banned for defending my position" or "don't debate."
Hey, so what's up with your signature?

Are you ready to learn about that subject?
What do signatures have to do with the subject of BoD elections? Maybe the mods should ask you to stay on-topic lest they prove me correct on their moderation bias.
Easy peazy, simply write "trans woman". Everyone then knows exactly what you are talking about. If you really must, you could also write "person who identifies as a trans woman".

And of course, the existence of both intersex and trans persons is incontrovertible. The various permutations of individuals who possess sex chromosomes that are not simply XX or XY shows that a solely binary distribution of sex does not actually exist. We know conclusively about androgen insensitivity syndrome wherein an individual with XY sex chromosomes may develop the secondary sexual characteristics of a female, and also strongly identify as a woman. Other genetic, epigenetic, and developmental factors can all result in a strong sense of gender dysphoria, that the body you have developed does not much your internal sense of your gender.

People who strongly identify with a sex other than the one assigned to them at birth absolutely exist. That one wishes to ignore the fact that they do exist doesn't make them go away. That we do not know the root cause for all of this does not make it untrue.
This isn't incontrovertible at all. If it was, your last sentence disproves yourself. Intersex people exist, yes, much like the way people with polydactyly exist. Actual intersex people are so few that statistically they are insignificant as far as any major policy-making (non-medical) should be concerned. The scientific basis for "trans people" is far from settled science and much of what is being touted as "science" is scandalously unacademic "research" that is bankrolled by pharmaceutical companies and others with nefarious agendas.

However, whether "trans people" are scientifically proven or not, how a person "feels" inside is irrelevant to their biological reality. It is physically impossible to transition from one sex to the other, regardless of medication or surgeries performed. This is an immutable condition, thus as far as sports are concerned there should be no debate that any person that is biologically male should be allowed to compete in a female-only division. It would not be a female-only division otherwise, no matter the competitiveness of the male identifying as female in question.


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Btw, I'm typing on my phone so please excuse any typos.
 
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