PDGA NT: 2019 Dynamic Discs Glass Blown Open 24-Apr to 27-Apr-2019

[DiscFifty]

btw..quick question for those who know the rules. Eagle was upset and bent up a disc, can he still legally throw it? I would think that would be under the rule of not modifying the flight characteristics of a disc.

 

[dontBLAMEtheDISC]

Correct.





https://www.dgcoursereview.com/mobile/course.php?id=5156

It's been updated since then

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Flick Maniac]

Paige on FB:

[GBO is always the busiest week of the year. My daily schedule was to wake up at about 7am play my round, eat lunch, go back out for the men's round to take pics with Alyssa (found on AVdiscgolf.com), and then hop straight over to Jomez commentary which meant I wasn't even eating dinner until about 10pm each day. Of course all of this activity meant I needed to be proactive and take care of my body before I got sore. I want to thank Seth for being so knowledgeable and flexible to help me warm up and cool down each day. This was a key element in my success this week and my body feels great! Next I want to give a huge shout out to my caddy Bruce who I have known for years and was very insightful in helping with distances and disc selection, it definitely helps to have someone there with you who knows your game. Speaking of which, my next thank you is to my girl Missy. When I got to the tee pad on the final day and saw you right there I couldn't have been more thankful. Since we play all of our practice rounds together and we have similar games it was super helpful to be able to pick your brain when I was unsure. You were right there helping me the entire round, especially around hole 15. You told me to run that 50 footer in the headwind with your arms crossed in front of your chest and a confident head nod. I did miss it, but I saved the par and we walked together to the tee of the infamous island hole 16 where you stared at me and with authority said, "this is the moment, you have to go for it." I was pumped. With no thoughts in my head, just a visualization of my Marshal losing speed and stalling out onto the grass I executed a very demanding shot in a very high pressure situation. There was still a very difficult putt ahead though. Catrina threw and did not land safe so she would proceed to the drop zone where she would at best case be taking a bogey. I knew this putt would be a huge moment but I didn't know how good it would feel to watch my Deputy fight through the 25 mph head wind and come to rest in the bottom of the basket. I was overcome with emotion. I can not describe the mass of feelings I had flooding through every inch of my body. If you have seen the Jomez round coverage though, I'm sure you could tell by my audible roar.

Earlier in the week there was an OB call that was not made correctly in fear of awkwardness or tension during the rest of the round. These things happen every tournament round and it is unfortunately something we as competitors have to learn to put those feelings aside and vocalize what we believe we saw. I hear things post round all the time about foot faults, falling putts, etc. but, that player didn't say anything because "it didn't matter" well I am here to tell you that it DOES matter. It matters for the integrity of our sport. It matters to all of the other 37 competitors. And it should matter to that player, I mean who wants to get a benefit like that? With all of this being said, when I watched Catrina throw her mini in anger on that island green I immediately called a courtesy warning and then she decided to call me on a warning for over celebrating. Did I deserve this? Maybe so. However, handling this as she did, AFTER I warned her, is not okay. This is exactly the reason a majority of the FPO field is holding back on making rules calls. We need to collectively bring awareness to this issue and grow together in order to grow the sport as a whole. Yes the media teams and the viewers want drama, but not like this. They want the drama that we provided in our play coming down the stretch. That wide over the water D2 shot you threw on 18 was very gutsy and perfectly executed. Then to follow it up with a 20 footer into a headwind on an elevated basket, wow. Very clutch finish Catrina, I respect your game more than you know.

Now let's play some golf and make sure we are making the calls that need to be made and give the people a show again in San Francisco.

Thank you all for the support! Those moments and feelings on hole 16 are exactly why I play disc golf. Those moments couldn't have been any more exhilarating for me. I feel really good going into the bulk of the summer tour and I am looking forward to the stretch ahead!

Checked the footage both on Jomez and Smashboxx. Not going to paraphrase it here since its readily available and pretty evident from the footage. I lost pretty much all the remaining respect I had for Cat, eroded already to nearly nonexistence by her recurring aggressive and opportunist rules related behavior I have seen on tape or read from accountable sources. Completely unprofessionional behavior.

Calling out a warning for "hitting the basket" in direct response to receiving a courtesy warning herself, what a lack of character. Calls need to be made promptly and not as revenge. *

Basically, moot point? Since they have no real weight being only warnings, and any subsequent violations resulting in a penalty would need to be seconded? Not the point.

If the PDGA was on top or things they would routinely comment on and set straight any controversial rules calls that occur on this level at least. More and more coverage will mean more and more episodes like this.

*If you are a Cat fan/Paige hater you could say that Paige doesnt strictly make her warning promptly either, but that seems to be more due to the OB/IB coversation taking over right after the fact. She does say "Cat you cant throw your mini" at the moment though. Perhaps she could have waited after Cat putted out to return to the issue, but none of that is equal to the revenge warning she gets.

 

[Jolt]

I got the impression that it was Jessica that called the warning on Cat. . .so it was Paige..wow, drama

I think the footfault situation was more interesting. . the slowmoo was stoped before Cat turned her plantfoot over her mini

 

[Jolt]

How long after you see a fault being made can you call a warning? i tought you HAD to do it immediately

I wounder what PP means by this

"Earlier in the week there was an OB call that was not made correctly in fear of awkwardness or tension during the rest of the round"

 

[Resting27]

Where in round 2? Anyone got the link of the missed OB call or was the convo edited out?

 

[eman6854]

How long after you see a fault being made can you call a warning? i tought you HAD to do it immediately

I wounder what PP means by this

"Earlier in the week there was an OB call that was not made correctly in fear of awkwardness or tension during the rest of the round"

I think disc golf in general is very laid back with calling rules violations against each other, but in my experience women have a tougher time doing it in general. My wife is pretty high up/respected at her company and will come home and vent her problems. When I ask her if she said something at work, the answer is usually no. If you want the rules of disc golf followed to a T I think there will have to be officials on the course.

 

[robdeforge]

I think disc golf in general is very laid back with calling rules violations against each other, but in my experience women have a tougher time doing it in general. My wife is pretty high up/respected at her company and will come home and vent her problems. When I ask her if she said something at work, the answer is usually no. If you want the rules of disc golf followed to a T I think there will have to be officials on the course.

I would agree with this if players in the MPO field called things on each other. But we all know that that is very rarely the case

I think there is a different type of tension after a contentious rules call in an FPO vs MPO card, but honestly the women seem to make more calls than the men.

 

[SD86]

I got the impression that it was Jessica that called the warning on Cat. . .so it was Paige..wow, drama

I think the footfault situation was more interesting. . the slowmoo was stoped before Cat turned her plantfoot over her mini

Yes, I thought it was Jessica Weese that called the courtesy warning for throwing the mini, also. Maybe both PP and JW called it? On the live coverage, it looked like JW wanted to call Cat's disc OB, saying it was completely surrounded by water.

And I think ALL of this (and a lot more things) shows why DG needs to consider having 'refs' or something on each hole or with each group or something. Having players make the calls and decide things as a group DOES create problems, as PP mentioned in her comments that someone posted above.

 

[JC17393]

Where in round 2? Anyone got the link of the missed OB call or was the convo edited out?

It was on hole 11 of round 2. Starts here with the tee shot, and the discussion comes about 4 minutes later when they arrive at the disc in question. Cat's description of her throw and where it hit and went OB was not close to reality. The result was she "won" the discussion, got an extremely generous mark (we're talking a difference of close to 100 feet probably), and then made the putt to save her par.

I have to say, what Cat did isn't something that is exclusive to her or even something that only "cheaters" do. I think it's a common misconception of a lot of players in terms of what the shape of their throws look like. They think that their shot carried straight then basically made a 90 degree turn to land where they did (which is exactly what Cat argues) when discs absolutely don't do that. Even sharply fading discs are doing so on a much more gentle arc and are generally still moving forward as they do so, despite what it may look like from the tee.

I had a player in my group this weekend try to make the same sort of case on an OB throw. The hole had OB down the entire left side and his disc faded out into the OB late in its flight. Where he wanted to take his mark was more or less even with the disc's position, which no one else agreed with. He wasn't as vociferous as Cat and ultimately took the lie that the rest of us felt was proper. The difference between what he wanted and what we gave him wasn't as large as with Cat (maybe 15-20 feet), so it probably wouldn't have changed his score anyway. The key thing is that there was no way he was trying to game us or cheat in any way, he just didn't see it properly. Honestly I think he struggles with depth perception in general because he seemed to think my drive on the hole flew over the basket when in fact it was a good 30 feet short of pin high and finished well right, leaving me with an outside the circle putt.

The issue with Cat and her group was more that they didn't seem to want to argue. She dominated the conversation and they acquiesced, whether it was in deference to the mood of the group or that they are just passive in general I don't know. But the case against Cat's mark is more one of physics than anything else. Where her disc landed and where she marked suggest a shot shape that is pretty much impossible.

 

[Streets]

 

[robdeforge]

the most egregious foot fault I think I saw all tournament

 

[Streets]

i am trying to watch the DD rd 4 video with Chris Clemmons and Eric Oakley commentating so i can get to see Nate Sexton . great footage BUT these guys are pimpin' John E like he was a cross between Santa Claus and their favorite Uncle. it's got to be a team effort to put him back on everyone's good side for the brands sake.

Homers gonna' homer.

 

[SD86]

The issue with Cat and her group was more that they didn't seem to want to argue. She dominated the conversation and they acquiesced, whether it was in deference to the mood of the group or that they are just passive in general I don't know. But the case against Cat's mark is more one of physics than anything else. Where her disc landed and where she marked suggest a shot shape that is pretty much impossible.

Good points, you make. (Some Jedi Master Yoda grammar, there.) Also, the other players might not have argued because they didn't really see it all that well, either. IMHO if they'd been more sure, they'd have spoken up.

Yes, those cat fight videos on Youtube definitely resemble the 16th hole debacle...

 

[SD86]

BUT these guys are pimpin' John E like he was a cross between Santa Claus and their favorite Uncle. it's got to be a team effort to put him back on everyone's good side for the brands sake.

Not the first time they've stooped to that... the spoof video they made of Wysocki foot faulting on the tee after the huge controversy last year was not their finest hour, either. But hey! disc golf is love, disc golf is life, right? :|

 

[Horsman]

So what it sounds like is that politics is leaking into disc golf more now. In politics all you need to be is the most upset, loudest and most offended person to get your way. Sounds a lot like Cat.

 

[Jolt]

I have watched most of the filmed rounds the last few years. . and the number of footfalls called is extreamly few

So rare that i dont think players pays that much attention to it. . .and i think the FPO is worse, you see several clear footfoults every round but i NEVER gets called

I personally think that run-up should only be allowed of the tee. . fairway shots should be stand still

 

[SD86]

So what it sounds like is that politics is leaking into disc golf more now. In politics all you need to be is the most upset, loudest and most offended person to get your way. Sounds a lot like Cat.

Respectfully disagree. Not going to get into the politics of politics here, but it's not the same to me. First, as someone said above, on the OB call Cat might've been sincere in her belief of what happened. The foot fault is a bigger issue, but she can't self-call, and if no one else called it, it is what it is.

To that: Nikko made the loudest noise and was most upset when he did call Wysocki's foot fault last year, then Wysocki did not self-confirm, and McCray (standing right there) refused to confirm. And that whole incident was FAR worse than the FPO stuff this year. So the loudest noisemaker did NOT win the argument (politics notwithstanding), and that egregious cheating last year is ALL the more reason they need to consider outside 'refs' of some kind so that it's not left to the players alone to make the calls.

I have watched most of the filmed rounds the last few years. . and the number of footfalls called is extreamly few

So rare that i dont think players pays that much attention to it. . .and i think the FPO is worse, you see several clear footfoults every round but i NEVER gets called

I personally think that run-up should only be allowed of the tee. . fairway shots should be stand still

And they even changed the rules recently, which IMHO make foot faults even harder to call. This issue (players not calling things on each other) is coming up more and more, and once again shows why something needs to be done to address the overall problem.

As to run-ups in the fairway vs. standstill... that'd be a huge debate if they tried to do it...

 

[Flick Maniac]

(Some Jedi Master Yoda grammar, there.)

Agreed. 10 points for vocabulary as well, "vociferous" was my new word of the day. Vocal + ferocious.

 

[JC17393]

Respectfully disagree. Not going to get into the politics of politics here, but it's not the same to me. First, as someone said above, on the OB call Cat might've been sincere in her belief of what happened. The foot fault is a bigger issue, but she can't self-call, and if no one else called it, it is what it is.

Minor correction, but yes she can call herself for a foot fault. The thing is, she'd have to be aware that she'd done it in order to call it. Unless she missed so egregiously that she had no doubt, it's unlikely that she'd be sure enough to call it. It was hard to tell even on the slo-mo replay that she faulted since her foot and leg obscure the mini from the camera's view. If we can't be sure, I'm not sure that she could be since she's obviously concentrating on other things like watching the throw.

To me, the issue in this particular case isn't necessarily that players were unwilling to make the call, but that I don't think any of them were in a position to make the call in the first place. I don't know if that's because the camera got priority position or if they just were elsewhere regardless, but a lot of calls like this get missed because players are out of position. And they're out of position because they don't take the responsibility of calling the rules seriously.