Watch out Highbridge Hills

[harr0140]

I think that Blueberry will be taken down by votes under 5. the flippies take this very very seriously. I think it has something to do with the fact that the gentleman that has created Flip city has done so not for profit but for love of disc golf or course design itself and us. this is the type of thing that creates a very dedicated following that are emotionally connected to its spot at number 1. now that it has fallen out of number 1, they want to change the criteria to be in the top 10. This is like a child losing at a game and wanting to change the rules because they are losing the game at that moment. I remember when it fell out of #1 before, after they got it back in 1st they were saying Flip is back where it belongs". Belongs there? I hope the entire top 10 will be replaced one day by better and more cutting edge design. I want course design to improve and not to stay stagnant. I hope that 1 day courses will exist that put Flip and Idlewild to shame

I have to say I totally agree otherwise the sport is standing still . . . like I said before only a course that is designed for the future of the game can stand the test of time . . . that will take maintenance into the picture . . . that will take changing technology and the ever increasing distance of discs . . . it will also take into account discs that might turn harder in the future or other technologies that might help you get more snap (special gloves or something else) . . . shoes that plant better but still allow a smooth pivot . . . all sorts of things that will make advancements in the current game will need to be accounted for in the future design of courses . . . and only the best will stay at the top for a long period of time.

So in essence what I am saying is it is kindof like music you cannot say that elvis had better music than say U2 because they are not comparable. You can however compare how long each was at the top for their timeperiod and compare the two.

Seeing flip city at the top is one thing but how long has it been there. Keep in mind this is only on this site too, but now that highbridge is there . . . how long will it stay. Will courses come and get in between highbridge and flip city and move one of them lower? Probably it is only a matter of time!

 

[AdamE]

I don't know if the course will stay #1 but I think it hold in the top 10. I heard nothing but excellent things about the courses in Highbridge when our local pros came back from the Pro Worlds in 2007.

 

[NDABRUSH]

Did you miss my posts where I said there is little similarity between the two course's reviewers. Both courses had reviews from very distinct IPs. There is no such thing as a "flippie", at least not in the sense that there is some Illuminati like group out there manipulating the reviews for different courses. If they are doing it then kudos to them because they're going through a hell of a lot of trouble to make it look like nothing is going on.

the review that I am talking about twentiesMrclean24's review of idlewild. the five before it brought idlewild closer to Flips rating, I believe 1 away. Then Twenties review came up. He joined your site that day and gave idlewild a 4. Of course he didn't list flip as played or where he lived, that's the dishonesty part of it. Not because he didn't list the state that he lived but because of the timing and lack of course description. it's like he read other reviews and put down some statements and gave it a 4. If you play and review any course there are usually things in the review that could only be mentioned after actually being there. I could read flips reviews and make up my own review based on them just so I can up the score. But after we pointed out their old method of 2 or 3 short 5 disc reviews appearing every time idlewild would get a 5, they stopped. Then this review came up right after someone gave idlewild in the same time frame as old method. Another thing that was the same was that they just joined your site that day just like the the short 5 disc reviews. maybe it is a coincidence.

 

[NDABRUSH]

I don't know if the course will stay #1 but I think it hold in the top 10. I heard nothing but excellent things about the courses in Highbridge when our local pros came back from the Pro Worlds in 2007.

Highbridge looks like a great disc golf destination. Is it 5 or 6 courses? Either ways it is probably got something for everyone as far as course design and terrain goes.

 

[jhgonzo]

Highbridge looks like a great disc golf destination. Is it 5 or 6 courses? Either ways it is probably got something for everyone as far as course design and terrain goes.

Currently Highbridge is:

1. Blueberry Hill (18)
2. Gold (18)
3. Granite Ridge (18)
4. The Bear (7 completed, will be 18; currently a hybrid where you play the 7 and finish with the last 11 of Woodland)
5. Woodland Greens (18)
6. Chestnut Grove (24-hour 9-hole)

And soon (next year, I hear?), Whitetail Pines (I think that's what the owner said it would be called), another 18.

His goal is to have ten 18-hole courses at some point in the future, and trust me, he's got the land!

 

[Greg Layton]

His goal is to have ten 18-hole courses at some point in the future, and trust me, he's got the land!

Having multiple courses for different skill levels at one site seems to be a growing trend. Lemon Lake, a complex southeast of Chicago, is another example of this. This seems to be a pretty good model to follow if you want to host Worlds as Lemon Lake will have it in 2010.

 

[DiscChucker]

When it comes right down to it, I could care less whether or not the courses in the top ten list are in my backyard or across the country. Obviously I want to live near an exceptional course and fortunately I do (Renny and Brackett's Bluff). But I'm certainly not losing sleep over the fact that they're not on the list. Depending on your perspective, not having your home course can be a welcome thing. But in all fairness to everyone in the greater DG community, I believe it's paramount that reviewers be honest and unbiased when outlining their critique.

I appreciate the fact that timg goes to the lengths he does to verify the legitimacy of the reviews that are submitted. I do however understand the frustration that some people feel when it comes to some of these weak, "drive by" reviews that are posted for not only the top ten courses but for a vast majority of the more popular courses. However, it does appear that the most popular courses are sprinkled with more of these small "boost" reviews (in some cases "downer" reviews). Perhaps it's just coincidence, perhaps not.

Honestly I don't really see a way around these worthless reviews. I guess if I were planning a DG road trip and it came down to deciding between two top ten courses, this is the process I would use. I would first purge out all of the fluffer/downer reviews so that only the reviews with substance were left. This would leave only the reviews where it's obvious the writer expended some amount of effort to relay his/her experience on the course. Next, I would place the reviews from trusted reviewers at the top of the list followed by the remaining reviews which would be placed in order from most to least in regards to the number of thumbs up versus thumbs down. I think this would weed out the home course fanboy problem and would be the only way to truly compare two or more courses fairly. It's unfortunate that has to be done but some people out there can't seem to fathom the thought that there are other people in this world beyond themselves. An honest review benefits everyone.

as far as illegitamate reviews, I don't think we should count reviews from people who played a course last year and are just now reveiwing it. I saw one where the guy said "I played this course back in 1998" but was reviewing it 11 years later. (not one of the top 10 courses)

Exactly! If I wrote a review today of Circle C when I last played it in 2000, it wouldn't at all be true to it's current redesign (although I'll admit I was a big fan of Circle C before and I can't wait to play it now). Unfortunately, common sense isn't something that can be screened or tested when people sign up with DGCR. You would think it would be obvious to people that courses change over time, whether it be for the better or worse and that old experiences are likely no longer applicable.

In closing, I think the Top 10, although flawed is in general a good barometer for gauging course trends for this sport.

 

[skinner21]

don't rock the establishment! aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!

 

[tomjulio]

My guess...NDA is a "birther" too. Ain't no changing the boy's beliefs with things like "facts" or the "truth".

Here's the deal with Flip. It has been there for 30 years, it will be there for another 30. It caters to the true spirit of disc golf. By this I mean more than just immaculate manicuring, more than incredible design and landscape...but in personality....in the people who play it weekly, which ironically I am the only one I know of that has reviewed it (and I live 300 miles away from it in a different state!). The locals could give two sh#ts about a website ranking, and most have never heard of this site....and that's how Michigan DG rolls.

...oh wait...crap...there are black helicopters overhead...

 

[tomjulio]

...as for Highbridge (in the state I am from) they are far from an obscure course. They have hosted Worlds for christ's sake. They are a world class destination without a doubt! Problem is they are truly in the middle of nowhere Wisconsin (5 hours from Milwaukee). This also allows it the same luxury that Flip has by filtering out the douche bag vandals and drawing in the diehard disc golfers. They should be in the Top Ten WITHOUT A DOUBT. I have heard this not only from the weekend warriors but also from the many pros I play with.

 

[tomjulio]

I hope that 1 day courses will exist that put Flip and Idlewild to shame

What an asinine statement. I hope 1 day there will be a TON more courses and NONE get put to shame, but instead inspire each to build on spirit and fun. Why bring any negativity to this sport or a specific course?

 

[humchris85]

I'm going to have to go with #4, who realy gives a rats @$$.

 

[danhyzer]

Even a longer drive from Greenville, S. C.

 

[therealbigtrav]

I think the reason that most of the people who reviewed blueberry hill a 5 (as well as for most of the best courses) don't necessarily want it to be #1. I think they just want people to be excited to come try an amazing course. It's probably not fair that I've reviewed it without playing all of the top ten first. When I reviewed Blueberry, I didn't review it to try and get it to take over the top spot. I've been a member at Token Creek and Standing Rocks, both of which are very well reviewed on here, and Highbridge is on a completely different level. I'm going back in two weeks, and it's all I can think about. Who cares who's number 1? Just do yourself a favor and try to make it to Highbridge, WI to play some disc golf.

 

[jhgonzo]

I think the reason that most of the people who reviewed blueberry hill a 5 (as well as for most of the best courses) don't necessarily want it to be #1. I think they just want people to be excited to come try an amazing course. It's probably not fair that I've reviewed it without playing all of the top ten first. When I reviewed Blueberry, I didn't review it to try and get it to take over the top spot. I've been a member at Token Creek and Standing Rocks, both of which are very well reviewed on here, and Highbridge is on a completely different level. I'm going back in two weeks, and it's all I can think about. Who cares who's number 1? Just do yourself a favor and try to make it to Highbridge, WI to play some disc golf.

I didn't give it a 5 to bump it up, either. Heck, I didn't even know the Top 10 (or being #1 overall) was such a touchy topic for some reviewers and DGCR members! I gave it a 5 because out of all the courses I've played, it was above and beyond nearly every single one in terms of design. The fact that it's so secluded only adds to it...you make a real journey to get up there, and like other people have noted, even when Highbridge is busy (you might see 10 or 12 cars in the lot), it's rare to actually cross paths with ANYONE. So serene. You literally feel like you're in a different world, a world that YOU would create if you were the disc-golfing god of mythology!

 

[Skankin77]

Being I live in Wisconsin, I hope I get a chance to play there before we move to Greenville, South Carolina. We've played many Wi. courses, but it's a long drive there from Madison

I hope to play it some day, too.

Yeah yeah Wisconsin..baller.

 

[fallsrunner10]

i'm not quite sure what the big fuss about a course being rated number 1 is. i think it's great advertisement for the course; a course is number one so people will want to go play it. let it be number one for a while and sooner or later a different course will take it over.

 

[harr0140]

I do have to add that comparing any of the top 10 is nearly impossible. It is so hard to determine why one is better than the other and it is al opinion but who is to say that the people playing one course arent a bunch of drunks or something . . . I said it for effect . . . why do these 50 people think flip is

.05 better than the next??? Is it really fair to compare without comparing only like reviewers???? I think not.

 

[Usher]

.05 better than the next??? Is it really fair to compare without comparing only like reviewers???? I think not.

Couldn't agree more!

 

[TalbotTrojan]

So with everyone giving it a 5 it must be a good course so lets all go play it and see how it compares. I think its rating will fall a bit but then again I have only played one top 10 course at this point and I gave it a 4.5. By the way, what is the deal tonight with people from Oregon? Two of them are rating courses 5 that others have only rated 3.