Intentionally Limiting Supply, or just poor quality control?

[Frank Delicious]

Or a nuke, force, wasp, or XS?

All those discs have the same amount of variation an Innova disc does.

 

[EL-KABONG]

Everyone's a conspiracy theory addict now.

You guys really think any disc manufacturer wants inconsistent flight?

I think discs probably push the envelope for the physical properties of the materials involved. And there's no evil plan to make batches of 'flippy' Firebirds.

As far as stringent quality control goes, your typical knee joint doesn't have a thin convex dome supported by a wide stiff rim, microns notwithstanding. Comparing lemonade to hand grenades might be fun but it's not gonna support your theories.

 

[ejvogie]

...sex toys...government probe.

Pun intended? :hfive:

 

[EL-KABONG]

Knee joints might make good approach shots though...hmmm.

 

[kyflash]

Or a nuke, force, wasp, or XS?

All those discs have the same amount of variation an Innova disc does.

I have had to replace several Discraft discs. They were all consistent. They were the same flight as the ones that were replaced when they were new.
The Wasp I throw now is the same as the one that was bought and used last year.

Discraft does a better job than Innova in producing consistent discs from run to run.

 

[garublador]

Discraft does a better job than Innova in producing consistent discs from run to run.

Or do they just make fewer runs?

 

[Frank Delicious]

I have had to replace several Discraft discs. They were all consistent. They were the same flight as the ones that were replaced when they were new.
The Wasp I throw now is the same as the one that was bought and used last year.

Discraft does a better job than Innova in producing consistent discs from run to run.

I've have had to replace several Innova disc. They were all consistent. They were the same flight as the ones that were replaced when they were new.

The Roc I throw now is the same as the one that was bought and used last year.

Innova does a better job than Innova in producing consistent discs from run to run.

 

[Frank Delicious]

Seriously I have never owned two flashes or crushes that have thrown the same.

 

[billnchristy]

MVP shows that it is entirely possible to get consistent plastic, but they have an family deal going on there. Other companies really seem to mostly use random scrap plastic. If they really did get their plastic custom made for them the resulting discs would be more consistent. Hopefully disc golf will someday reach a level where disc sales are so high that this is indeed an option.

Though Innova has shown that they can make pretty consistently high quality stuff when they do CFR discs. They probably try to reserve the good stuff for those, as well as bring in a "master molder" to do the job properly, and overall pay more attention to the process. And this shows in the price.

Umm you give Innova 6 bucks for CFR discs so with the exception of DX at 4.40 they are the cheapest disc that Innova will stamp for you. This theory is not good. They eat the cost so you can raise funds, hence the name Candy Fund Raiser.

 

[Frank Delicious]

Seeing that post BNC quoted reminds me when I was giving Ions a good testing I owned 4 and new, two of them were nice and stable, one was dead straight and one was a flip dog.

 

[SirRaph]

The knee joint comparison was only because I'm in that field of work. Plastic injection, whether discs, tupperware, or whatever, is more or less the most idiot-proof way to make anything.

Same mold + same blend of plastic + same cooling and stamping process = same disc. What other variables are there? Again, being in the manufacturing industry, consistency/quality isn't about owning the best injection machines, or owning a CMM, etc. It's about the process.

On the cost side, in response to the tupperware being expensive, it's 97% marketing and overhead costs. The off-brand stuff is going to be just as consistent.

I talked to a player who has been getting some competitive quotes from local job shops to cut him enough molds to release 7 different discs. The highest quote he got was for 5k. Giving those molds to an injection shop, he was getting quotes for pennies per disc. Making frisbees is damn cheap.

Here's another example of the type of issues I'm talking about. Have you seen the videos of stacks and stacks of discs sitting next to a guy with a razor? He's cutting the flashing off of each and every one. How much does that cost? Let's say he works a 40 hr week, spending 1/3 of his time doing only that, for one year at $6 per hour. That's a very conservative estimate, and that's costing $4,000 per year in labor cost only! There's the cost for next year's new molds right there! A higher quality mold/process would fix that by itself.

And as was mentioned above, there are a number of disc makers that don't have any of the same issues. Have you ever found a Lat64 disc with a sharp flashing? Have you ever thrown a Vibram that taco'd when it hit a tree? Yet their costs are going to be similar or greater to Innova or Gateway's.

 

[Frank Delicious]

Have you ever found a Lat64 disc with a sharp flashing? .

Yes and you should read the DGR thread on Lat 64 where a whole bunch of rivers came out way more stable and a whole bunch of cores developed domes.

 

[skinner21]

DGR? Is that some sort of sick joke? You're gone too far, Frank.

 

[cali]

It's just a sly business method. When something is hot, you market it a certain way. Look at Discraft, they have played this Nuke game very well from a financial standpoint. Very marketable disc, once the hype dies, release new plastic/glow/re-tooled mold.

 

[skinner21]

you're misunderstanding what they mean by inconsistencies. Innova can run the same mold, same plastic, same everything and still have discs turn out differently. Everything you mentioned is definitely intentional, it's good marketing. Inconsistencies for an 11x FB to a 12x is just the result of poor manufacturing standards.

 

[Frank Delicious]

DGR? Is that some sort of sick joke? You're gone too far, Frank.

oh man I'm sorry. Please don't report me.

 

[discspeed]

I have had to replace several Discraft discs. They were all consistent. They were the same flight as the ones that were replaced when they were new.
The Wasp I throw now is the same as the one that was bought and used last year.

Discraft does a better job than Innova in producing consistent discs from run to run.

Your sample size is FAR too weak to draw any conclusions from. Discraft is every bit as inconsistent as Innova when considering how much fewer discs they run.

 

[Technohic]

Yes and you should read the DGR thread on Lat 64 where a whole bunch of rivers came out way more stable and a whole bunch of cores developed domes.

Orly?

I need to check that out. my new River should be arriving today and I hope its not a suprise.

 

[sidewinding]

Sure all the tupperwear lids fit but throw 20 of the same size and see if they all have the same flight characteristics. Then try to make some of different weights that still fit the same size bowl and see if they fly the same as the heavy ones of the same size. Then try to make the same size in a grippier plastic that still fit the same size bowl and see if they fly the same as the not so grippy ones of the same size. Then try to make some in a plastic that is resistant to rock cuts that still fit the same size bowl and see if they fly the same as the not so resistant to rock cut lids of the same size.

 

[Technohic]

Orly?

I need to check that out. my new River should be arriving today and I hope its not a suprise.

Read it and I might actually like a little suprise in a flatter River. Might be willing to call a DG store and see if they could pick me out a semi-domey Core eventually as well.