MVP Vector Midrange

[jubuttib]

I just got a flat (almost puddle top) green one in. I threw it 3 times and it's a lot straighter than I thought it would be.

That's normal for a flat one.

 

[HeartlessCynic]

Unfortunately, most didn't come out flat.

 

[discspeed]

So I've been throwing a 175 green vector and got in a 178 orange vector. Their domes and plh and everything look similar but the 175 is decently more overstable than the orange one. what up with that?

It is because the heavy one is more gyroscopic, which makes it want to hold the line of release. All of the cores weigh the same, and the weight of the disc is determined by the weight of the overmold(which vary by 6 grams or so). The heaviest discs have the greatest percentage of their weight distributed to the outside, and the lighter discs have a less gyroscopic weight distribution that allows the geometry of the disc to dominate the shape of the flight more.

 

[discspeed]

Unfortunately, most didn't come out flat.

Depends on your perspective. The flat ones don't glide as well, and they will overlap too much with MVP's neutral midrange, so I prefer the slightly domey stable ones. I also like the 178s because I can see the more gyroscopic weight distribution in effect, especially on medium speed shots.

 

[Apothecary]

Unfortunately, most didn't come out flat.

Depends on your perspective. The flat ones don't glide as well, and they will overlap too much with MVP's neutral midrange, so I prefer the slightly domey stable ones. I also like the 178s because I can see the more gyroscopic weight distribution in effect, especially on medium speed shots.

After a couple of dozen rounds without touching the Aftershock, and one really windy day where it flipped like an SOB, I have no real reason to keep carrying it around (you equate the aftershock to the vector...why do you keep pushing the vector so hard when you say again and again that the overstable mid slot is useless?). My short affair with the overstable mid is over once again. I return to my previous philosophy that they are useless.

 

[Frank Delicious]

Unfortunately, most didn't come out flat.

Depends on your perspective. The flat ones don't glide as well, and they will overlap too much with MVP's neutral midrange, so I prefer the slightly domey stable ones. I also like the 178s because I can see the more gyroscopic weight distribution in effect, especially on medium speed shots.

So I need lighter ones if I want the overstable mid? Well I got a 172 coming so I guess we will see.

 

[Apothecary]

you want the super early domey pop tops if you want overstable. weight has little to do with how the vector flies.

 

[Frank Delicious]

Have you thrown both a pain and a vector apoth?

 

[Apothecary]

i have. pains (gl) took the slot (though i like the opto equally...gl are just prettier and better to dye.)

the only people ive seen who really have use for the vector are the REALLY big guns. like 450'+ throwers. they bust out the vector when i use my teebird, usually from 320-375'. they can use the lack of turn and the skip at the end...but theres quite a lot of overlap between their vectors and their overstable fairways/pains.

 

[Frank Delicious]

How do they compare speedwise? I'm not too into the faster mids which is what booted the hornet from the spot because it is hard to switch from comets to a faster mid when I need to throw an overstable mid. The vector is def faster than I am used to as a mid but isn't really super fast or anything. What is making me question if it is the disc for me is if my orange one is representative of what the disc is gonna throw like, it's not gonna be stable enough for me really.

You know as I'm sitting here typing I'm really wishing sanny Q Sents were easy to acquire b/c it is really what I am looking for.

 

[Apothecary]

my heavy gl pains are REALLY close to a champ roc. maybe a touch more glide, but the exact same speed: nice and controllable slow. theyll either hold a flat line and have late fade or hold a faster hyzer line and not pop up to flat.

significantly slower than an esp and particularly a z hornet.

try one out. theyre my favorite new disc since the ion. all the slow, overstable action of a champ roc at a fraction of the price...and they look a lot better.

 

[discspeed]

Here's some good Vector discussion from my bag thread:

I

Now the meat of my post. There is no single kind of Vector. The domier kind i suppose is the intended shape and flight by the manufacturer competing against Sentinel and the like i suppose. I can't speak for the guys but that's my assumption. There is another kind of Vector in the almost flat topped ones that flies very differently in LSS and distance and similar in HSS. The low topped Vector is the shit. My best D from a domey is about 270' IIRC and i don't like the early fade that is fairly hard. Because it is just too little for short curves and the disc is so fast that the utility going around obstacles flight of the Gator/Zone type of slow very overstable flight achieves the utility functions better. That is not skipping too far on hard surfaces like pulled power drivers often do and making a hard early bend around obstacles. I have three such FH drives on my home course.

The flat Vector record for me is 332' IIRC. It flies way farther straight before starting to fade and when it does it is one tick less LSS than the domey kind. So most Vectors are between good uses (roles) IMO but the flat long straighter one is the longest mid i've thrown.

I agree with your assessment for the most part, although into a headwind I found the domey ones to turn more than the flatter ones. For the record I also have noticed 3 levels in dome height in Vectors...Totally flat, small gradual dome, and poppy top. The totally flat ones are the straightest, but they don't glide as well as the ones with dome. So for me those ones were kind of tricky because if you finesse them they dump as soon as they start to hyzer, but if you throw them hard they hold the line to the ground almost. The small gradual dome ones are my favorite. They are the most HSS of all the Vectors and they are between the other two in terms of LSS. As I mentioned above, the domey ones are about the same HSS as the flat ones, but they are much more LSS.

Dome is only half the story on the Vector though. Weight is a big factor due to the fact that the heavy ones are much more gyroscopic with all the extra grams going to the overmold. With more weighting agent in the overmold I also expect the heavier ones will break in faster. Anyway, the heavier, more gyroscopic Vectors seem to penetrate forward more on the fade if you have the revs to get them up to speed. As I'm breaking in one of my heavies the forward dominant flight is a lot more evident.

 

[discspeed]

I must say that in throwing the Vector extensively through the last couple of months and now getting a chance to see how it breaks in that it is one of the most interesting and unique discs I've ever thrown. In a lot of small ways it flies differently than similar discs with a less gyroscopic weight distribution, but those are largely masked by the overstability when the Vector is brand new. A new Vector seems to share more flight similarities with a heavy premium plastic Roc/Wasp than it does with it's little brother the Ion. This is because the Ion, unlike the Vector, has a geometry that plays into the effect of the gyroscopic weight distribution from the get go. Becuase the Ion has a shape that produces a neutral flight, and the gyroscopic effect makes the disc fly straighter, the two forces are working together. It seems like the shape of the Vector is overstable enough to initially trump the gyroscopic effect, or at least mute it at low and medium speeds. However, as the Vector wears in the 2 forces (shape/gyro) come more into balance. This is what I'm seeing with my broken in Vector...It is flying more like a faster Ion with more LSS because the break in has allowed the gyroscopic effect to pull the disc on a straighter line. I believe this is what Chad must have had in mind when he was designing the Vector...To have something with the glide/straight flight gyroscopic benefits of the Ion, but in a more flight stabilizing design for more HSS/LSS/predictability. This broken in Vector has got me very excited about the possibilities of this disc once again.

The break in of the Vector is interesting as well. I'm pretty certain that it is essentially the overmold that is breaking in and affecting flight. The overmold is more like a star plastic where the core is like the most durable champion (or better). I also believe that the bottom of the bead becoming imperfect through repeated impacts has a taming effect on the LSS. So I think that impacts on the overmold cause a reduction in HSS and the abrasions on the bead cause a reduction in LSS. Both allow the gyroscopics to play a larger role in the flight.

 

[peppermack]

how well does the vector handle FH, I have not had a chance to even throw the one I got yet but I would like to use it FH too. Better or worse than a Hornet lets say.

 

[JR]

I'm not good at flicking at high power with pure form with consistency and Vector doesn't come out cleanly out of my hand more often than not. My hands aren't large. I think the bead plays a part.

 

[discspeed]

I'm not good at flicking at high power with pure form with consistency and Vector doesn't come out cleanly out of my hand more often than not. My hands aren't large. I think the bead plays a part.

I too, with my amateur FH, have issues getting the Vector out cleanly. I'm fine with lower power shots, but if I try to power I get some OAT. On Sunday however, I gave a couple of my Vectors to my FH dominant buddy to throw. He throws Rocs/Buzzzes so cleanly that they look like LHBH throws. He had no trouble at all with the Vector and threw it very well. He thought my overstable one flew like his broken in FLX Drone and my seasoned one flew like a newish Roc.

 

[JR]

Roc is in the middle with Buzzz being the easiest mid for me to flick out of the straight mids. Flattish Vector that is. If fade is preferable Gator doesn't feel as heavy as a Zone to hold on to.

 

[Mike C]

How does an average Vector compare to a new Rancho Roc? Re-doing the midrange setup in my bag and probably going back to Rocs but I Was kind of curious about this disc, seeing as the Ion flew quite nice (But didn't quite beat out my Wizards).

 

[JR]

I don't know if there is an average Vector because flat and domey ones fly so differently. Domey ones are probably way more common and it's more like a Sentinel. Way more power requirement and earlier and harder fade.

 

[Apothecary]

How does an average Vector compare to a new Rancho Roc? Re-doing the midrange setup in my bag and probably going back to Rocs but I Was kind of curious about this disc, seeing as the Ion flew quite nice (But didn't quite beat out my Wizards).

vector will be significantly more overstable.

mike did you ever fix your falling-putt problem?