ESP Cyclone - home for wayward gazelle throwers

[x-out1]

Flight: For my noodle arm, I found Gazelles and Cyclones to be similar rather than interchangeable. Once worn in, DX Gazelles are considerably longer (often landing close to my Valkyries) and exhibit a slight but noticeable turn and mild fade. In contrast, ESP and X Cyclones are shorter and fade harder. I do prefer Cyclones for forehand, probably because of the additional stability.

Sounds like some of the differences that I see may wash out for you big-arm folk.

interesting. so the gazelles are longer with less fade? is that true for everyone?

BTW i haven't heard too much about glow champ or champ gazelles all that much. i'm guessing they are a bit more stable and more fade than DX.

 

[Monocacy]

BTW i haven't heard too much about glow champ or champ gazelles all that much. i'm guessing they are a bit more stable and more fade than DX.

I have two 157 glow champ Gazelles with a Japan Open stamp. They are more-or-less interchangeable with Champ Banshees of the same weight. Totally different disc than in DX.

I have no idea if all glow Champ Gazelles are that beefy.

 

[JHern]

...I didn't have a fail with the Cyclone...Only shots that did exactly what I wanted, and shots that didn't look as nice, but still had a pretty good result. This was especially the case when I threw with too much hyzer...The River behaves like a much more stable disc, where the Cyclone pushes forward more.

Exactly, and the strong fade at the end means that it is less prone to running off path and getting into more serious trouble. This was the essence of Blake's argument for using the Cyclone over the Stalker. I've found it to be true time and again.

interesting. so the gazelles are longer with less fade? is that true for everyone?

Both the Gazelle and Cyclone will beat in to become a slow turning driver at 250'+ power. For me, the flat ESP Cyclones have the best glide and fly straighter at high speeds when snapped clean, and are quite good to 350' (similar to discspeed's assessment). The Gazelle always has a softer fade than the Cyclone, and will not flex out of a 250'-ish range turn-over shot as well as a Cyclone. The DX Gazelles I've owned all had a more beefy feeling and flight to them too, so I haven't experienced the glidey runs of these yet.

BTW i haven't heard too much about glow champ or champ gazelles all that much. i'm guessing they are a bit more stable and more fade than DX.

My wife (250' power) throws a beautiful KC Pro plastic (aka Champion) Gazelle that is worth $$$$ (so she is careful when to pull it out). But her main off-the-tee driver is a 164 g ESP Cyclone. Her Cyclone flies with much more pronounced S while the KC Pro Gazelle holds stable and straight (like a laser beam from her hand).

One thing I have to say is that throwing the Cyclone has helped improve my throw a lot. Somehow, this disc trains me how to throw better, and rewards me for getting cleaner snappy releases. I notice the improvement especially when I pick up my distance drivers.

 

[mattw]

I realy wanted to like the River. That disc can take off and go. My problem was that I couldnt work the disc. I lack the power for it to be a true control driver. Its flight for me was long but straight with a little fade at the end. Problem is thats the same flight as my PPD. So I went back to the cyclone and have traded my Rivers. I hope I have learned my lesson. Each time I try something new it doesnt work out and I go back to the Cyclone. I will be honest thier should be a support group on this site for people like me. Just a person who will talk me down from making a poor decision for the safety of my limited disc golf game.

 

[x-out1]

My wife (250' power) throws a beautiful KC Pro plastic (aka Champion) Gazelle that is worth $$$$ (so she is careful when to pull it out). But her main off-the-tee driver is a 164 g ESP Cyclone. Her Cyclone flies with much more pronounced S while the KC Pro Gazelle holds stable and straight (like a laser beam from her hand).

again i need some clarification. the Cyclone = more turn and more fade?

i picked up the only gazelle i could find, a DX weighing in at 171g. for me the disc has a very soft turn, like those of a broken in putter or roc. it just slowly tracks right and there is almost zero fade. the disc doesn't want to finish left at the end of the flight, instead it just floats down, similar to that of a broken in roc or putter.

none of what i described is a bad thing. i like the disc and would love to add it to the bag, but i would really need to try a premium plastic version for it to be a staple.

 

[mattw]

Depends on the plastic. Pro D is not that stable more on par to DX Gazelle. Elite X and ESP have a little more fade than the Gazelle. ESP being the most stable.

 

[josser]

My gazelle vs cyclone exprience seems to be the opposite of others. I have had a handful of dx and champ glow gazelles and find them to have a very reliable fade. I never have those throws where I turn them over and they don't come back. And I find them very reliable for flex, hyzer and straight shots.

On the flip side, I have a quite new ESP Cyclone and have also thrown one of Ryan C's. I find that they really compliment the gazelles really well. They perform about the same on hyzers as the gazelle, need a bit of hyzer for straight throws or else they turn and don't come back, and hold most annys to the ground.

It's interesting that I am having different experiences in this comparison, but I do really like both these discs.

 

[JHern]

On the flip side, I have a quite new ESP Cyclone and have also thrown one of Ryan C's. I find that they really compliment the gazelles really well. They perform about the same on hyzers as the gazelle, need a bit of hyzer for straight throws or else they turn and don't come back, and hold most annys to the ground...

It depends how you throw and shape your line, as well. On a pure flat and level throw, my ESP Cyclone will literally turn left 90 degrees and penetrate leftward another 30-40 ft after slowing down, but I have to put it on a line that allows it to slow down enough. I can also throw it straight by flipping it flat and have no fade at all if it hits the ground before slowing enough to fade.

I'd definitely say that the Cyclone fades harder at low speeds than the Gazelle. But they are similar, no doubt.

Another reason to get a Cyclone is that you can pick one up in some nice ESP blend plastics, and they're pretty consistently nice and behave predictably. Discraft will always produce ESP Cyclones for the foreseeable future, and they are actually gaining in popularity with time. On the other hand, Gazelles are only made in DX now, unless you want to buy a special run of KC Pro blend for upwards of $100. DX Gazelles have behavior all over the place, sometimes the DX plastic is waxy and prone to cracking or bending on impact, and you never know what you're going to get unless you can see it before hand AND you are an expert in Gazelle shapes and run variations. Also, Innova continues to threaten discontinuation of the Gazelle from time to time, and they might actually do that one of these days.

 

[discspeed]

I didn't get to throw my Cyclone in doubles much today, but while warming up I had a chance to really rip on it flat with a mild 5-10mph tailwind and I put it about 20' from the pin on a 430' hole. That surprised me!!! I went back to the store and grabbed 3 other 174-175s just like mine because I have a feeling I'm going to get into a relationship with this disc...It just feels great in my hand and I really like that ESP plastic.

Unfortunately our store has not been selling hardly any of these...I hope they are doing better in other places. Hopefully we will sell some once I get my review up on our Facebook page and start pimping it's virtues a bit.

 

[BrotherDave]

Is the ESP plastic pretty consistent with these? Seems like ESP is either really durable or really easy to get gashes in them.

 

[mattw]

Mine have all been pretty consistant and durable. I do think that the white ones are stiffer than most other colors.

 

[Itchy1]

Bro D. I'm pretty sure I remember Mr. Ellis saying that Discraft color codes all of their discs. I don't have the colors down but color X is the most durable, color Y is best grip, color Z is in the middle, etc. I know he said they do it with the Rattler and the Buzzz and I'm pretty sure I read him say they do it with all plastics/molds.

 

[discspeed]

Is the ESP plastic pretty consistent with these? Seems like ESP is either really durable or really easy to get gashes in them.

It feels pretty consistent in the ones we have at the store. My Cyclone has a couple of nicks on the bottom along the bead, but nothing major. I think that has more to do with the shape of the disc and how the bottom part juts out like a bead than the plastic.

 

[JHern]

I only know the White, bright Yellow, and bright Orange ESP Cyclones. The Yellow was by far the smoothest and stiffest, closer to Z plastic but definitely had the shape and flew like one of the ESP variety. The White and Orange are similar, pretty tough plastic, decent rigidity, and resistant to dings.

I think part of the problem is that the Z Cyclones (I owned one of these) were not very well-received when they were released a few years ago (kind of beefy), so people are skeptical about a premium plastic Cyclone. But the ESP Cyclones are nothing like the Z Cyclones, totally different.

I would like to find a stack of Cyclones from a really good production run and just go nuts and buy the lot of them. I know I'll always use the Cyclone as long as I play disc golf...it is the heart of my bag.

 

[discspeed]

This morning I'm going to be playing my most potentially Cyclone friendly local course, and I haven't played it since putting the Clone in my bag, so I'm excited to see how it does. I really like the run that I now have 4 of...Nice dome, good fade, and glide for days. It flies like a midrange, only up to 400'. Basically, where my Buzzz goes 350', the Cyclone goes 390'-400'. That carry has been the most surprising thing to me about the Clone.

 

[discspeed]

This morning I'm going to be playing my most potentially Cyclone friendly local course, and I haven't played it since putting the Clone in my bag, so I'm excited to see how it does. I really like the run that I now have 4 of...Nice dome, good fade, and glide for days. It flies like a midrange, only up to 400'. Basically, where my Buzzz goes 350', the Cyclone goes 390'-400'. That carry has been the most surprising thing to me about the Clone.

The Cyclone officially "made my bag" this morning. I birdied 4 out of the 6 holes I threw the Cyclone on today, and I threw a second drive with it on my last hole (where I chose to throw FH instead and didn't get anywhere near the basket) and parked that as well. I love this disc. I just smooth it and give it a good snap and it seems to read my mind. Mine is still moderately overstable from a flat throw, but it's very workable by giving it just a tiny bit of anny. This is the most controllable driver I've ever thrown. I also bashed some pine/palm trees warming up, and my disc showed no warpage and there was no noticeable difference in flight. This disc makes my life easier on the course.

 

[DiscGolfTeeSigns.com]

i fell in love with the ESP clone as well. mine did eventually take a few nose bends on impact, which seemed to beat it to neutral, and i love it even more now.

 

[Timko]

Man Discspeed, you're making me want to put this back in my bag. I had clones in my bag for about 9 months, but took it out when I went to a smaller bag. Perhaps when Grip gets their bag finished, I may check one out again.

All of the things you said reminded me why I liked this disc so much.

 

[booter]

I was feelin up some esp clones at discnation yesterday. Are all the runs flat or are there some domey ones? The last time I threw a clone it was the old tp clones several yrs ago and mine were domey as all hell. I loved em

 

[DiscGolfTeeSigns.com]

there are domies and flats, and i saw both of em in the first run

never saw any quite as domey as a TP